MSP denials

[tailgunner]

Well, there are two schools of thought on this.

I am in the “Criminal Procedure 10-109(a)(2) says you don’t have to disclose anything about an expunged record” camp (https://law.justia.com/codes/maryland/2019/criminal-procedure/title-10/subtitle-1/sect-10-109/).

The alternative camp believes that once you are charged you have to answer “yes.”

I’d recommend you read the link above to Criminal Procedure 10-109 and give it a thorough read-through.

If it were me, I would answer “no” as long as it was expunged. If it is eligible for expungement, but not yet expunged, then I would answer “yes.” You weren’t clear if the charge has actually been expunged.

That’s me though. Others have differing opinions.

This isn’t legal advice.

Never had it expunged, didn't know I had to since I was told by my probation officer completing the probation Civil service I was ordered to do there would be no record and my probation period was complete. No further probation time was required. This was going on 20 yrs ago and I don't have any records or even remember what courthouse it was in.

 

[Inigoes]

need to upload something it shows that as incomplete

Upload the NYSRPA v Bruen decision, thats what I did.

 

[6-Pack]

Upload the NYSRPA v Bruen decision, thats what I did.

It let me submit the application without any documented threat uploads and it was accepted.

 

[rseymorejr]

need to upload something it shows that as incomplete

Mine doesn't. I chose "Personal Protection" and then for reason I put personal protection again. My documents page shows 2 incomplete items. Training and Fingerprints. (I already uploaded a photo)

 

[jrumann59]

It let me submit the application without any documented threat uploads and it was accepted.

thanks

 

[thomfantomas]

Just putting "self-defense"
Is substantial enough.

I was approved within 20 days once my application was accepted!

 

[Burt Hammersmith]

Never had it expunged, didn't know I had to since I was told by my probation officer completing the probation Civil service I was ordered to do there would be no record and my probation period was complete. No further probation time was required. This was going on 20 yrs ago and I don't have any records or even remember what courthouse it was in.

Solicitation of prostitution in the $5 range?

 

[BmorePA]

I'm a bit confused as how to answer the questions on the application. No I wasn't arrested. Yes I received a summons. Yes I got a PBJ for a misdemeanor and did the community service at which time the probation officer said I would have no record. The offense carried less then 2yrs. So what the hell do I check on the application so I don't get in trouble?

If it was a crime that would not prohibit you from getting the permit then just put yes, and don't risk it.

 

[tailgunner]

Well, there are two schools of thought on this.

I am in the “Criminal Procedure 10-109(a)(2) says you don’t have to disclose anything about an expunged record” camp (https://law.justia.com/codes/maryland/2019/criminal-procedure/title-10/subtitle-1/sect-10-109/).

The alternative camp believes that once you are charged you have to answer “yes.”

I’d recommend you read the link above to Criminal Procedure 10-109 and give it a thorough read-through.

If it were me, I would answer “no” as long as it was expunged. If it is eligible for expungement, but not yet expunged, then I would answer “yes.” You weren’t clear if the charge has actually been expunged.

That’s me though. Others have differing opinions.

This isn’t legal advice.

Never had it expunged, didn't know I had to since I was told by my probation officer completing the probation Civil service I was ordered to do there would be no record and my probation period was complete. No further probation time was required. This was going on 20 yrs ago and I don't have any records or even remember what courthouse it was in

If it was a crime that would not prohibit you from getting the permit then just put yes, and don't risk it.

So I guess I'll answer yes to recieving a summons and explain what for and what the outcome was and roll the dice. I don't want to lie on the application.

 

[ras_oscar]

To the OP: the simplest thing to do is get a background check and see what is returned. I suspect there is a way an individual can do it, perhaps your attorney can help?

 

[gtodave]

So should I try and expunge a possession of alcohol underage that I pled guilty to and got probation?

You just reminded me that I had two of those (one each in two states) from 25 years ago. FWIW I never said a thing about them (completely forgot about them), and got a FL and a VA (one of the states I got one in) non-resident carry permits with no issues.

 

[jrumann59]

You just reminded me that I had two of those (one each in two states) from 25 years ago. FWIW I never said a thing about them (completely forgot about them), and got a FL and a VA (one of the states I got one in) non-resident carry permits with no issues.

Yeah, I have clearances and VA and UT NR CCW

 

[Ouroboros]

One of the questions on the application asks about prior LE experience and requires one to upload proof you left in good standing. I don't see anything in § 5-306 that indicates leaving in negative standing would be disqualifying, unless perhaps it was for something related to violence or criminal behavior.

Is simply leaving in bad standing, for job performance issues or personality conflicts somehow disqualifying according to Maryland Code?

I was going to put my application in, but years ago I left a department under investigation for petty job performance issues. Nothing excessive force/violence/criminal behavior related. Am I wasting my time applying? I understand no one has a crystal ball, just wondering if this is a known issue or anyone has had similar issues in applying.

 

[Squaregrouper]

One of the questions on the application asks about prior LE experience and requires one to upload proof you left in good standing. I don't see anything in § 5-306 that indicates leaving in negative standing would be disqualifying, unless perhaps it was for something related to violence or criminal behavior.

Is simply leaving in bad standing, for job performance issues or personality conflicts somehow disqualifying according to Maryland Code?

I was going to put my application in, but years ago I left a department under investigation for petty job performance issues. Nothing excessive force/violence/criminal behavior related. Am I wasting my time applying? I understand no one has a crystal ball, just wondering if this is a known issue or anyone has had similar issues in applying.

If you have a DD214, go ahead and do it. Worse case scenario, you're out $130-140 and an hour of your life

 

[Ouroboros]

If you have a DD214, go ahead and do it. Worse case scenario, you're out $130-140 and an hour of your life

Well I'll be out a lot more. I paid $400 for the required training, plus fingerprints, and photos, etc. That ship has sailed at this point though.

I could be out more if I have to hire a lawyer to fight a denial too.

But generally, I take your point. My plan at the moment is to just submit the memos I have acknowledging my resignation and my rebuttal to the IA allegations.

 

[Muleskinner]

I'm under the impression that if you can legally buy a gun, your not disqualified. Am I wrong in that assumption?

Correct which brings us back to "why is MSP still asking for references?" The info from questions cannot be used to deny anyone..

 

[rseymorejr]

Well I'll be out a lot more. I paid $400 for the required training, plus fingerprints, and photos, etc. That ship has sailed at this point though.

I could be out more if I have to hire a lawyer to fight a denial too.

But generally, I take your point. My plan at the moment is to just submit the memos I have acknowledging my resignation and my rebuttal to the IA allegations.

As long as you've done nothing to make yourself prohibited I can't imagine a problem

 

[Ouroboros]

As long as you've done nothing to make yourself prohibited I can't imagine a problem

Good to know! I already dumped a whole lot of money into it, so might as well finish it out. I just tend to be a little cynical watching what y'all have to deal with from across the river in VA, so not sure what sort of response I should expect.

In VA, literally all I had to do was show up at the courthouse with my application and a photocopy of my academy graduation certificate. Maryland definitely seems more...obstructionist, to put it politely.

 

[Armadillofz1]

Didn’t expect to live long enough to see maryland defacto shall issue. Congrats!

 

[RoadDawg]

Check “yes” and tell MSP the truth, nothing but the truth. Attach court documents if you have any.

Why can’t folks understand that… if they lie… and the investigator finds that they lied on something simple… that same investigator is going to reason that there are likely more lies on the application.