MSP advisory on AR pistols with braces

[jcutonilli]

Understood.
I found a way to get an MP5 side folder to 29" (with MDS help). I ultimately went with an AR collapsible adaptor so I could legally shoot suppressed.
My question that, based on MSP's advisory, can I (no suppressor or flash hider) legally put a folding stock on my registered SBR that would be <29" OAL? The firearm was legally purchased in MD as a braced pistol and converted to a MD legal SBR.

The MSP advisory does not technically address the "copycat weapon" definition. It has been interpreted to say that braced pistols are still pistols under MD law. The law does not clarify what a rifle is per the "copycat weapon" definition. It has been interpreted by MSP that firearms with shoulder stocks are rifles for the purposes of the definition.

An MP5 is semiauto and centerfire. With a folding or collapsible stock, it would appear to meet the MSP interpretation of a rifle. This would require the firearm to have an OAL >=29". I believe the OAL measurement is with the stock unfolded or extended so you can be less than 29" with it folded or collapsed. You still need to meet the 29" requirement for the longest configuration.

Hopefully the 4th circuit will overturn the law soon so you won't have to worry about this after they overturn the law.

 

[Robert heatterich]

I didn’t think atf made laws just enforced them

 

[jcutonilli]

I didn’t think atf made laws just enforced them

They don't make laws, but they do make regulations that govern how they enforce the law.

What's the Difference Between Laws and Regulations? - FindLaw

When we hear that something is against the law, we generally don't question where the law comes from. But 'the law' can mean a lot of things, from general ideas about jurisprudence all the way down to a written ordinance. And while the words 'law' and 'regulation' are often used interchangeably...

www.findlaw.com

 

[Bob A]

They don't make laws, but they do make regulations that govern how they enforce the law.

What's the Difference Between Laws and Regulations? - FindLaw

When we hear that something is against the law, we generally don't question where the law comes from. But 'the law' can mean a lot of things, from general ideas about jurisprudence all the way down to a written ordinance. And while the words 'law' and 'regulation' are often used interchangeably...

www.findlaw.com

And they have to power to define, to a large degree, just what their role and responsibility would be, concerning the laws that empower them.

Being unelected, and serving a bureaucracy rather than an electorate, their power is only limited by their leadership, who in turn rely on the deniability that politicians are so inordinately fond of.

A wink and a nod, and millions of gun owners are felons.

 

[Darkemp]

My two submissions are exactly as you described, under 29” OAL braced pistols built as such. First one took 9 days to receive approval, second one is still out. Was my first time doing it also, very simple process with the eForm1.

My second one was approved today- strange one took 9 days and the other 32.

 

[ltdave]

Good evening Everyone:

Question - I am trying to finalize my Form 1 on the eFile website. Unfortunately, I can only get so far as the VERIFY screen and cannot move onto the CERTIFY page (the last prior to final submission). This was automatically filed through SilencerShop, but unknown if that is the issue. The system populated fine and I can progress through the screens with no difficulty.

UNTIL....

Regardless of what I do the ’sign & submit’ and ‘next’ buttons don’t become clickable. Screen capture attached,.

I have tried numerous desktop and mobile devices, no luck.

I have tried numerous browsers, internet connections, and locations, no luck.

I have emailed eForms.general.info@atf.gov, eforms.admin@atf.gov, eforms.admin@atf.gov as well as calling their technical desk, no answer from any of the contacts.

I’d assume that their website is crushed today with tomorrow being June 1st, but that isn’t my fault in any way.

Might anyone have any thoughts as to how to proceed? Much appreciated!

Stay Safe,
David

 

[outrider58]

Good evening Everyone:

Question - I am trying to finalize my Form 1 on the eFile website. Unfortunately, I can only get so far as the VERIFY screen and cannot move onto the CERTIFY page (the last prior to final submission). This was automatically filed through SilencerShop, but unknown if that is the issue. The system populated fine and I can progress through the screens with no difficulty.

UNTIL....

Regardless of what I do the ’sign & submit’ and ‘next’ buttons don’t become clickable. Screen capture attached,.

I have tried numerous desktop and mobile devices, no luck.

I have tried numerous browsers, internet connections, and locations, no luck.

I have emailed eForms.general.info@atf.gov, eforms.admin@atf.gov, eforms.admin@atf.gov as well as calling their technical desk, no answer from any of the contacts.

I’d assume that their website is crushed today with tomorrow being June 1st, but that isn’t my fault in any way.

Might anyone have any thoughts as to how to proceed? Much appreciated!

Stay Safe,
David

See my post on your other thread..

 

[Staccato2011]

Just an update... I had a 22.5 inch overall length firearm approved today by the ATF. Approved per the MSP letter.

 

[Kirkster]

Just an update... I had a 22.5 inch overall length firearm approved today by the ATF. Approved per the MSP letter.

They marked all 3 of mine with the approved per MSP letter. Even though one of them is Over 29 inches, the other two are sub 29 inches by a lot.

 

[Eastern_Water_Moccasin]

Does it specifically say NOT to put a stock on? You MUST keep the brace on sub 29" SBRs?