Special Session: SB21 Introduced

[BrianS]

I am more concerned with this coming back in January. It's smartly written and could pass if we were not vigilant.

This.

Also keep in mind when the full nest of libs come scurrying together in January they might not be in the best of moods when they realize moving trucks are pulling up to 1600 Penn. for the grand eviction notice.

 

[Storm40]

I have three greyhounds as well... they are REALLY dangerous, they might lick the MSP to death

WAAAAAY off topic - that's the third MDS'er that's mentioned having greyhounds. two of which have three! I got one, thinking of adding another in the spring. maybe we should have an MDS greyhound M&G!

anyway, back on topic:
roll back some restrictions to something approaching common sense. codify specific training requirements. specify you only need training to get the license the first time and the training must be free and/or what training would suffice in its place. remove that language about "HAS NOT EXHIBITED ANY CONDUCT THAT INDICATES 3 THE PERSON IS POTENTIALLY A DANGER TO THE PUBLIC IF ISSUED A PERMIT." or make it more clear and specific, leaving less to discretion. pretty much, I suppose, what everyone else has already said.

 

[Braxtonian]

First round of email away, posted below.

All 41 states that allow law-abiding citizens to get carry permits prohibit drinking while carrying a handgun. But most do not prohibit citizens from merely entering a restaurant that holds a liquor license as long as the permit holder him or herself is not personally drinking.

That is actually not correct. PA has no such statute. You can walk into applebees with a gun on your hip, sit at the bar, and have a beer.

 

[swinokur]

That is actually not correct. PA has no such statute. You can walk into applebees with a gun on your hip, sit at the bar, and have a beer.

VA only prohibits alcohol consumption while CC as well

Consumption while OC is ok.

Go figure.

 

[pfrazier]

What I don't understand is why you would have to go through the training after every re-up of your license. Other than them wanting to place a "burden" on the person and more money out of your pocket

 

[fightinbluhen51]

That is actually not correct. PA has no such statute. You can walk into applebees with a gun on your hip, sit at the bar, and have a beer.

Same with Delaware...

Same (as far as I know) open carrying in VA.

Now, I think both of those states do have BAC limits...which does make sense.

Drinking and carrying, should carry the same weight as drinking and driving. Provided you aren't an idiot and will suffer impairment, A glass of wine or A beer while carrying shouldn't be some mythical taboo.

Would I personally do this? I would adhere to the strict limits I just provided above for myself. Obviously, there will be boneheads that don't follow any laws or moral conduct.

 

[Klunatic]

I like a social drink, but never carry when armed.

I can also tell you from experience (we're retired and travel a lot) that it becomes burdensome real fast when the only place you can eat in some states is the local McD type places.

Of course one has the option to disarm and leave the firearm in the vehicle.

Kind of hard to carry if you aren't armed.

I like VA's law.

 

[MDGolom]

Maybe I'm not reading this correctly, but they modified 4-203(b) to "wearing, carrying or transporting" requiring a permit. Would we still be allowed to transport an unloaded firearm to the range if we didn't have a permit?

 

[swinokur]

Same with Delaware...

Same (as far as I know) open carrying in VA.

Now, I think both of those states do have BAC limits...which does make sense.

IIRC VA is .08, same as DUI.


Drinking and carrying makes no mores sense than drinking and driving IMHO.

 

[Braxtonian]

Same with Delaware...

Same (as far as I know) open carrying in VA.

Now, I think both of those states do have BAC limits...which does make sense.

Drinking and carrying, should carry the same weight as drinking and driving. Provided you aren't an idiot and will suffer impairment, A glass of wine or A beer while carrying shouldn't be some mythical taboo.

Would I personally do this? I would adhere to the strict limits I just provided above for myself. Obviously, there will be boneheads that don't follow any laws or moral conduct.

Yeah every once in a while I may have a beer with my steak if I'm carrying but I won't go past one. You have to have the sense to know alcohol can impair your judgement, and even if it didn't, it would certainly impair your aim.

 

[MJD438]

Maybe I'm not reading this correctly, but they modified 4-203(b) to "wearing, carrying or transporting" requiring a permit. Would we still be allowed to transport an unloaded firearm to the range if we didn't have a permit?

That section in the proposed law only changes 4-203(b)(2), the range issue is covered by 4-203(b)(4), IIRC.

 

[Mr H]

What I don't understand is why you would have to go through the training after every re-up of your license. Other than them wanting to place a "burden" on the person and more money out of your pocket

DING!!!!

It's all about encumbering, then criminalizing.


Received another personal reply (this one from Del. Zucker)...

Thank you for writing me about this important issue. The text of the bill became available yesterday afternoon, and can be found by following this link: http://mlis.state.md.us/2012s2/bills/sb/sb0021f.pdf. However, it is my understanding that this Special Session will only be used to address two issues: gambling and pit bulls. If the bill should be reintroduced during the regular session in January, I will definitely be looking at the issue more in-depth. Please do not hesitate to contact me if there is any way I can ever be helpful. Best wishes, Craig Zucker

 

[fightinbluhen51]

Yeah every once in a while I may have a beer with my steak if I'm carrying but I won't go past one. You have to have the sense to know alcohol can impair your judgement, and even if it didn't, it would certainly impair your aim.

I wouldn't go past one either. But as others have stated, disarming and leaving it unattended in the vehicle creates a risk.


Ahh, the questions of life we must face when our right is fully restored.

 

[esqappellate]

Yeah every once in a while I may have a beer with my steak if I'm carrying but I won't go past one. You have to have the sense to know alcohol can impair your judgement, and even if it didn't, it would certainly impair your aim.

BTW, VA flatly prohibits *any* drinking while carrying. I *never* take even a sip while carrying in VA on my permit. See VA Code Ann. § 18.2-308:

J3. No person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia may consume an alcoholic beverage while on the premises. A person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premises of such a restaurant or club and consumes alcoholic beverages is guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor.

 

[Blacksmith101]

The problem with allowing the police to control the training is suspose they provide training twice a year. You have to get training within six months of applying for your permit or renewing your permit and if renewing it must be applied for three months prior to expiration. If you miss the training because you are sick, have a wedding or funeral to attend or whatever reason you just blew your chance at getting a renewal and have to start all over again.

Training must be available from a wide variety of sources to prevent it from being turned into yet another tool for unconstitutionally preventing people from exercising their natural rights as enumerated in the 2nd ammendment.

Blacksmith101

 

[Jim Sr]

This.

Also keep in mind when the full nest of libs come scurrying together in January they might not be in the best of moods when they realize moving trucks are pulling up to 1600 Penn. for the grand eviction notice.

​

 

[swinokur]

BTW, VA flatly prohibits *any* drinking while carrying. I *never* take even a sip while carrying in VA on my permit. See VA Code Ann. § 18.2-308:

J3. No person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia may consume an alcoholic beverage while on the premises. A person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premises of such a restaurant or club and consumes alcoholic beverages is guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor.

But since there is no mention of OC, it is then legal if not prohibited.

 

[kohburn]

BTW, VA flatly prohibits *any* drinking while carrying. I *never* take even a sip while carrying in VA on my permit. See VA Code Ann. § 18.2-308:

you mean - while concealing

 

[esqappellate]

But since there is no mention of OC, it is then legal if not prohibited?

That's weird for sure. I won't opine on that, other than to say that it is probably a bad idea for other reasons (alcohol does impair judgment and reaction time -- yes only one drink will do so -- lots of studies on that. I can have dinner out without drinking.).

 

[NateIU10]

BTW, VA flatly prohibits *any* drinking while carrying. I *never* take even a sip while carrying in VA on my permit. See VA Code Ann. § 18.2-308:

J3. No person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premises of any restaurant or club as defined in § 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia Alcoholic Beverage Control Board under Title 4.1 of the Code of Virginia may consume an alcoholic beverage while on the premises. A person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premises of such a restaurant or club and consumes alcoholic beverages is guilty of a Class 2 misdemeanor.

Doesn't that just say concealed?