MY CARRY PERMIT IS DENIED!!!

[Mooseman]

They didn't even give me the satisfaction of a reach around.

I know. How rude.

 

[montoya32]

How does the appeal process work? Is it like the NFL in that the person/parties who made the original decision just revue their decision and rule again?

 

[BUFF7MM]

How does the appeal process work? Is it like the NFL in that the person/parties who made the original decision just revue their decision and rule again?

I was called and an appointment was made to meet at MSP Glen Burnie, I had to go in front of 5 appointed civilians and a Trooper, the trooper submitted the states case, and I said my peace. The 5 member panel took all evidence presented in to account and then made their decision while I was in the room.
I had the feeling that they had pretty much made up their minds before I walked in the room.

 

[montoya32]

I was called and an appointment was made to meet at MSP Glen Burnie, I had to go in front of 5 appointed civilians and a Trooper, the trooper submitted the states case, and I said my peace. The 5 member panel took all evidence presented in to account and then made their decision while I was in the room.
I had the feeling that they had pretty much made up their minds before I walked in the room.

These are state appointed civilians, correct?

Safe to say that if you initially get denied, your appeal will go no better?

 

[BUFF7MM]

These are state appointed civilians, correct?

Safe to say that if you initially get denied, your appeal will go no better?

Yes, I think they are appointed by the Governor. 3 males, 2 females.

That's how I saw it.

 

[montoya32]

Does anyone know when the appointees are selected? Will Hogan appoint his own?

 

[pcfixer]

Yes, I think they are appointed by the Governor. 3 males, 2 females.

That's how I saw it.

basically called a kangaroo court.

 

[cad68m_m]

Permit Review Members

Does anyone know when the appointees are selected? Will Hogan appoint his own?

Existing Handgun Permit Review Members with expiration of term years are:

Appointed by Governor with Senate advice & consent to 3-year terms:
Charles M. Thomas, Jr., Chair (chosen by Governor), 2016
Rolinda S. Collinson, 2014; Seymour R. Goldstein, 2015; W. Roland Knapp, 2017; Charles L. Washington, 2017.

Source: http://msa.maryland.gov/msa/mdmanual/22dpscs/html/dpscs.html#handgun

So Hogan can not replace them all at once

1

 

[daggo66]

It would certainly be interesting to have one or two friendlies on this board. If anything it would make life uncomfortable for the others.

 

[jkeiler]

jkeiler: What a ridiculous outcome! A couple of questions:



How long did it take from the time you filed your appeal until the denial?




How did they communicate this to you? In writing?

Thanks this information would be very helpful to me.

CF


PS You know you have the right to appeal their decision to the Circuit Court of the County you live in.

CF--Application to final denial on appeal took about a year. From the appeal to denial I think about 6 months. All communication was in writing. I know I can appeal further, but in PGC I don't see a favorable outcome as likely, even though the rationale of the board in this case is pretty ridiculous. I can see why they don't allow applicants to speak at the appeal hearings--they would have to answer questions about their incoherent logic.

 

[MrNiceGuy]

CF--Application to final denial on appeal took about a year. From the appeal to denial I think about 6 months. All communication was in writing. I know I can appeal further, but in PGC I don't see a favorable outcome as likely, even though the rationale of the board in this case is pretty ridiculous. I can see why they don't allow applicants to speak at the appeal hearings--they would have to answer questions about their incoherent logic.

No they wouldn't; they'd just give you blank stares and then provide more incoherent logic about why you're being denied. If these people understood logic, they wouldn't be denying you in the first place.

 

[Mark75H]

Correct. Law and logic do not intersect, esp in MD.

 

[CharlieFoxtrot]

CF--Application to final denial on appeal took about a year. From the appeal to denial I think about 6 months. All communication was in writing. I know I can appeal further, but in PGC I don't see a favorable outcome as likely, even though the rationale of the board in this case is pretty ridiculous. I can see why they don't allow applicants to speak at the appeal hearings--they would have to answer questions about their incoherent logic.

Thanks. The law says they have to either review the record or conduct a hearing within 90 days of receiving the request.
They certainly didn't conduct a hearing since you weren't allowed to talk, so I guess they reviewed the record? Did they specify to you which of the two options they were doing?
Sorry for all the questions. I am doing two appeals right now and the information is helpful. For too long the HPRB has gotten away with not following procedures (remember the open meeting issue) and I want to hold their feet to the fire. They are actually (in part) covered by Maryland's Administrative Procedures Act. If you'd prefer to answer privately pm me or my email is on my IP page.

CF

 

[Mark75H]

What a corrupt setup. If they were subject to the open meeting requirement maybe they could be caught renewing someone who is connected but has no significant reason to carry, but if they can slip thise people in with a "review" instresd of a hearing it could just slip under the radar

 

[CharlieFoxtrot]

They are subject to the open meeting law, although that came as news to them. CypherPunk did excellent work with this.

 

[PJDiesel]

They are subject to the open meeting law, although that came as news to them. CypherPunk did excellent work with this.

Interesting. So, you can go as a spectator, like a court proceeding?

 

[Seeker]

Interesting. So, you can go as a spectator, like a court proceeding?

Yes and no... They are subject to it in the sense that they have to have an open period, but they can vote to close the meeting as soon as it's opened, in order to "protect" people's privacy.

 

[Jimboy]

Gents I apologize in advance for my possible improper use of the forum since I am a newbie, but I posted yesterday on a similar thread that I have been denied, and have sent in the form requesting an informal review.
Also, following advice in this forum, I requested from the trooper who signed my denial letter, to forward to me the info that was in my MSP file.
He refused after checking with his MSP legal counsel. They will only send me another copy of the application I had submitted. Not sure if it takes a subpoena or a FOIA request to break that info loose, but it would sure be handy to have to prep for the informal review.
I then called Gov. Hogan's office today and got a complete run-around by his aide. No support whatsoever.
It's been a bad day but I'm still gonna pursue all avenues!
Thanks,
Jimboy

 

[Stoveman]

Jimboy that sucks. Best of luck to you going forward.

 

[Gryphon]

Don't give up, there is a movement a foot.