Tuning the Mosin M44

[Ponder_MD]

@Melnic @mawkie - I'm definitely not looking for lighter trigger pull. What I want to do is take up some of the slop or slack.
I know you can add a return spring but I don't think that's quite what I'm after. I might try the "add a small washer trick."

@sbmike Something about the powder in older surplus Russian and Eastern Bloc ammo makes the biggest flash.

I've shot enough modern boxer-primed ammo that I now have a sufficient amount of brass to get into handloading. My buddy and I are going to slug the barrel with a buckshot pellet and see what we get.

 

[John from MD]

@Melnic @mawkie - I'm definitely not looking for lighter trigger pull. What I want to do is take up some of the slop or slack.
I know you can add a return spring but I don't think that's quite what I'm after. I might try the "add a small washer trick."

@sbmike Something about the powder in older surplus Russian and Eastern Bloc ammo makes the biggest flash.

I've shot enough modern boxer-primed ammo that I now have a sufficient amount of brass to get into handloading. My buddy and I are going to slug the barrel with a buckshot pellet and see what we get.

If you use Cerrosafe, you will get a better reading. 1/2 oz will last forever as it is reuseable. It melts at low temp and will be easier to measure than a pellet. $12 and change.

BROWNELLS Cerrosafe Chamber Casting Alloy 1/2lb SKU: 080027050 | Brownells

There are various products on the market which can be used to make a cast of a gun chamber. To be certain that the product we are offering you is the best and most practical, we contacted the basic manufacturer. They recommended Cerrosafe because ...

www.brownells.com

 

[Ponder_MD]

If you use Cerrosafe, you will get a better reading. 1/2 oz will last forever as it is reuseable. It melts at low temp and will be easier to measure than a pellet. $12 and change.

BROWNELLS Cerrosafe Chamber Casting Alloy 1/2lb SKU: 080027050 | Brownells

There are various products on the market which can be used to make a cast of a gun chamber. To be certain that the product we are offering you is the best and most practical, we contacted the basic manufacturer. They recommended Cerrosafe because ...

www.brownells.com

Excellent, thanks!

Uh, wait- how do I cast it into a sphere that will fit down the Mosin barrel?

 

[John from MD]

Excellent, thanks!

Uh, wait- how do I cast it into a sphere that will fit down the Mosin barrel?

https://feeds.brownells.com/userdocs/learn/Inst-446.pdf

 

[Ponder_MD]

Wow, you just pour it in. Seems tricky but doable.

 

[Doco Overboard]

Wow, you just pour it in. Seems tricky but doable.

It’s not hard, strip the rifle and heat the chamber reinforce with a hair dryer before you pour. Bring it up to temp.
What you want to understand is the cone measurement just before the leade.
It’s also known as the ball seat.
Right where the chamber transitions to the bore but before the leade.
Pound casting is another method that doesn't involve casting metals.
The”Why” is, how a chamber reamer is made. The diameter of the reamer is larger than the bore because it has to cut the neck first.
And makes a bullet or ball seat before the lands are cut at the leade where the bore is located.
When a rifle has been used for a while, erosion occurs at a faster rate than the bore.
Especially with specific powder types

 

[Doco Overboard]

Make sure you lightly oil the are you want to cast, and don’t get trapped in the mind set a little bit of Babbitt material last forever.
It doesn't because when you use it enough it cools rapidly and is harder to control loss.
That why you also warm the reinforce up, so the casting metal doesn't cool to rapidly.

 

[Ponder_MD]

What you want to understand is the cone measurement just before the leade.
It’s also known as the ball seat.

Right. I need to find a barrel cutaway image on the internet of this, so that I can understand it better.

 

[John from MD]

Right. I need to find a barrel cutaway image on the internet of this, so that I can understand it better.

Ask and you shall receive.

 

[GuitarmanNick]

I use a soft lead, bullet shaped fishing weight for slugging barrels. Oiling the barrel first makes it very easy to drive though using a rod or wooden dowel.

 

[Doco Overboard]

Right. I need to find a barrel cutaway image on the internet of this, so that I can understand it better.

Crude drawing attached.
You can beat bullets through your bore all day long and get a certain margin of success but here is where the rubber meets the road because you want to take up as much room as possible so no gas which is nearly impossible or as little as possible gets by the bullet.
The case mouth opens before the bullet starts a significant forward amount of travel.
For that instant the bullet floats on the gas created by the ignition of the powder.
The closer the fit the straighter the grip.

 

[Melnic]

Suggestion, bang 12" steel @ 100 yards offhand.

If you use Cerrosafe, you will get a better reading. 1/2 oz will last forever as it is reuseable. It melts at low temp and will be easier to measure than a pellet. $12 and change.

BROWNELLS Cerrosafe Chamber Casting Alloy 1/2lb SKU: 080027050 | Brownells

There are various products on the market which can be used to make a cast of a gun chamber. To be certain that the product we are offering you is the best and most practical, we contacted the basic manufacturer. They recommended Cerrosafe because ...

www.brownells.com

Cerrosafe can be used to slug the barrel? Is that something you just do at the muzzle or push through? I recall you giving me some and I thought I used it to check the chamber and throat. I may have done the muzzle but my memory fails me.

 

[Doco Overboard]

Here’s a better suggestion.
Melt your cerro safe in heated water placed in a pouring ladle not with a torch that’s silly stupid and wasteful.

 

[John from MD]

Suggestion, bang 12" steel @ 100 yards offhand.


Cerrosafe can be used to slug the barrel? Is that something you just do at the muzzle or push through? I recall you giving me some and I thought I used it to check the chamber and throat. I may have done the muzzle but my memory fails me.

I probably mentioned it to you. You forgot because you are getting old and senile.
Look at the links I put in post #29 and you will get an idea how it is done. In my days of competing, I made casts of the muzzle and lead of each barrel I used. Every 500 rounds I would make another and check for wear. ( probably overkill but I was young and dumb then.

 

[Sirex]

One thing you may want to try is, look on Ebay or Gunbroker for a M39 2 stage trigger + sear. Fully reversible and my triggers feel great now. I have one in my carbine and a M91, and they are much better than the standard triggers. I polished the contact points as well, and it's super smooth as well. That and some Barnaul 54r ammo, or Czech seems to do well.

 

[Ponder_MD]

One thing you may want to try is, look on Ebay or Gunbroker for a M39 2 stage trigger + sear. Fully reversible and my triggers feel great now. I have one in my carbine and a M91, and they are much better than the standard triggers. I polished the contact points as well, and it's super smooth as well. That and some Barnaul 54r ammo, or Czech seems to do well.

Thanks, I'll look for that.

ETA: Nothing on Gunbroker but I found this ebay listing:

Finnish Mosin Nagant M39 Trigger Made in the USA using modern CNC Standards | eBay

This is an aluminum trigger fully machine and anodized here in the USA by US citizens. It is modeled after the Finnish M39 trigger. It is complexity compatible with all Variant so the Mosin Nagant.

www.ebay.com

It doesn't include the spring. Should I be looking for an M39 spring or can I use the existing M44 spring?

 

[John from MD]

Thanks, I'll look for that.

ETA: Nothing on Gunbroker but I found this ebay listing:

Finnish Mosin Nagant M39 Trigger Made in the USA using modern CNC Standards | eBay

This is an aluminum trigger fully machine and anodized here in the USA by US citizens. It is modeled after the Finnish M39 trigger. It is complexity compatible with all Variant so the Mosin Nagant.

www.ebay.com

It doesn't include the spring. Should I be looking for an M39 spring or can I use the existing M44 spring?

The Finn trigger uses the two pins to give you a two stage trigger. Again, the weight of the trigger pull is adjusted by thinning the sides the sear spring. With the exception of the 28-30, no MN variant has a compression spring.

 

[Ponder_MD]

The Finn trigger uses the two pins to give you a two stage trigger. Again, the weight of the trigger pull is adjusted by thinning the sides the sear spring. With the exception of the 28-30, no MN variant has a compression spring.

I was just reading about thinning the sear spring. Several people recommended against it because it causes the trigger or spring to hang up, too light of a trigger pull and sometimes the spring just breaks. I don't feel that I have the experience to fiddle with it without making the rifle unsafe. Besides, I don't think the weight of pull if my problem. It's slop and distance of travel (lack of a clean break?) I do have a trigger scale. I'll perform a test and report back on what the weight is.

I'm going to start by install the washer shim and trigger return spring. It's cheap, reversible and something that I think I can do without screwing it up. If that doesn't yield satisfactory results, then I'll get more aggressive.

 

[somd_mustangs]

Thanks, I'll look for that.

ETA: Nothing on Gunbroker but I found this ebay listing:

Finnish Mosin Nagant M39 Trigger Made in the USA using modern CNC Standards | eBay

This is an aluminum trigger fully machine and anodized here in the USA by US citizens. It is modeled after the Finnish M39 trigger. It is complexity compatible with all Variant so the Mosin Nagant.

www.ebay.com

It doesn't include the spring. Should I be looking for an M39 spring or can I use the existing M44 spring?

Well at least it's complexity-compatible!

"It is complexity compatible with all Variant so the Mosin Nagant." yikes.

 

[Ponder_MD]

Well at least it's complexity-compatible!

"It is complexity compatible with all Variant so the Mosin Nagant." yikes.

Yeah, not sure if that guy is ESL or what. I didn't buy one. I'm trying the washer shim and return spring first.