Tuning the Mosin M44

[Ponder_MD]

To avoid digging too deeply into my reserves of .30-06 and 5.56, I've been practicing with my M44. Ammo is less expensive, and I have a ton of it.

When I first bought the M44, I invested in the accurizing kit for it that included action shims and strips of cloth to float the barrel. It passes the dollar bill test. I've been bench-shooting those white, red diamond sight-in targets at 100 yards with iron sights. I'm finally at the point where 4 of 5 rounds are inside the center red diamond, with an occasional flyer. The groups aren't that tight, often 1 or 2 grid squares apart (1 inch squares, I believe.) Often, I can get a pair of shots on top of each other but not 4 or 5.

I replaced the original globe sight with an adjustable post globe sight. It looks OEM. It took a ton of fidgeting to get the windage and elevation right. Absolutely miniscule adjustments.

Some notes: Russian ammo (even new ammo) is very inconsistent. Wolf 174 gr was the worst but at least it cycled smoothly. PPU 182 grain was better, more consistent but wide groups. My friend introduced me to this stuff called Igman at 170 grains which seemed best. It gave me the smallest groups and the most consistent. Czech silver tip (corrosive) at 147 grains also shoots OK but it cycles terribly. I have to leverage the bolt hard to open it after every shot. I'd like to re-test the Czech against the Igman.

The trigger is the worst. It's mush with a pull that is a mile long. I don't want to carve up the rifle to fit a Timney trigger. The relief cut for the safety leaves the wall paper-thin. I think I'm going to try a Huber trigger:
https://huberconcepts.com/product/mosin-nagant-trigger/
There's also a guy who makes these Finnish two-stage trigger sets. He custom makes them at a rate of 2 per month and you need to reserve one. Costs about $140. Also does not require any relief cutting of the stock.

I'd like to get the groups just a little tighter and then get off the bench and start shooting from CMP match positions.

 

[John from MD]

Hey bro, you are trying to make a silks purse out of a cows ear. The M44, just by the nature of the short barrel for caliber, is not going to be as accurate as an off the shelf rifle. While I have tuned MN 27's through Finn 39's to be tack drivers (with cast bullets), you won't do it with a 44.

There is a easy mod for the the trigger that will drop the sear down just by putting a washer under the screw. ( search the internet, someone must have posted it) You can also lessen the trigger pull by thinning the width of the sear spring. Do it slowly with a slow dremel and quench repeatedly to avoid changing the temper of the spring.

 

[U.S.SFC_RET]

Hey bro, you are trying to make a silks purse out of a cows ear.

No but lipstick on a pig is still lipstick.
2" groups with an occasional flyer is pretty good for an M44.

 

[Ponder_MD]

Hey bro, you are trying to make a silks purse out of a cows ear.

Yeah, I know. This is just a fun, cheap project as well as a learning experience. I'm not going to Bubba this thing or pour a bunch of money into it but I do have time.

 

[Ponder_MD]

Here's my final target of the session. I'm not making excuses but there was heavy shading over the target from moving trees which made things more challenging. The two smaller groups was a 5-round clip where I was fiddling with the front sight. The larger group was my last clip of the day with one flyer.

 

[John from MD]

No but lipstick on a pig is still lipstick.
2" groups with an occasional flyer is pretty good for an M44.

I agree.

 

[John from MD]

Here's my final target of the session. I'm not making excuses but there was heavy shading over the target from moving trees which made things more challenging. The two smaller groups was a 5-round clip where I was fiddling with the front sight. The larger group was my last clip of the day with one flyer.

Are they hand loads? If not, do you know the lot of ammo you are using?

 

[Ponder_MD]

Are they hand loads? If not, do you know the lot of ammo you are using?

No, factory stuff. This last session, it was all pretty new. Russian Wolf Performance, Privi Partisan and Igman.

 

[Melnic]

Couple things. barrels will vary greatly from mosin to Mosin. My Mosin Sniper, my Fin Mosin and one of my run of the mill 91/30 rifles have pristine barrels that shoot GREAT! I THINK my M38 I got from someone here has a decent barrel and I know it shoots pretty good. I got crap results with everything til I reloaded for it using 150gr .311 bullets for a 303 Brit and tuned it for the Sniper. It has shot well in all my other Mosins. Everything from surplus to even the "match PPU" which I think is a joke shot 4" size groups compared to the reloads which with the scoped sniper and me doing my part gets 1-2" groups @ 100 yards. If you play with trigger, for safety sake, do a butt slam test. Emptry gun, cock the gun and slam the butt down on some wood and make sure it won't fire. I got a WW1 dated Mosin and someone fiddled with the trigger/spring in there I think bent it to lighten the pull and it will go off if you slam it. I have not fired it and have yet to fix the trigger. I have done the washer, polish (flitz) and return spring tricks to 2 of the guns that are my better mosins. I have also done the cork thing and brass shims to firm up the action fit. That all makes a difference but w/o reloads it was not as much of a difference. If you can hit 2-3in groups @ 100 yards, you are doing GREAT!

All I care about most of my milsurps is to bang steel 100 Yards offhand.

 

[GuitarmanNick]

I can't see the target clearly at 100 yards. Below is 50 yards with my M-44 shooting handloaded 150 grain soft points. The flier is all me. Original sights.

 

[willtill]

I’d be happy with the shot groups displayed, from those M44 iron sights. I would echo John from MD‘s comments in his initial reply in this thread. You’re trying to make a silk purse out of a sows ear.

But I do get it. Aim small, shoot small. Winging someone with that carbine @ 100 yards, while aiming for center of mass is still a win.

 

[dieselfarmboy]

I’d be happy with the shot groups displayed, from those M44 iron sights. I would echo John from MD‘s comments in his initial reply in this thread. You’re trying to make a silk purse out of a sows ear.

But I do get it. Aim small, shoot small. Winging someone with that carbine @ 100 yards, while aiming for center of mass is still a win.

I wouldnt want to be at the receiving end of that M44 at 100 yards.

 

[babalou]

I wouldnt want to be at the receiving end of that M44 at 100 yards.

lol pretty much this

 

[John from MD]

I wouldnt want to be at the receiving end of that M44 at 100 yards.

Sometimes, depending on the clothes you are wearing, the back end is almost as bad as the front.

 

[dieselfarmboy]

Sometimes, depending on the clothes you are wearing, the back end is almost as bad as the front.

That steel butt plate with some certain surplus ammo in the summer, yuppppppppp both ends are brutal.

 

[U.S.SFC_RET]

That steel butt plate with some certain surplus ammo in the summer, yuppppppppp both ends are brutal.

I liken to shooting a Mosin like shooting a 2X4 piece of wood.

 

[Red1917]

That's pretty good with an M44 at 100 yards. Anywhere inside 2-3" groups excluding the flier is solid.

If you want to try it in the CMP style matches, my advice would be to get some of of the SR targets (I think the reduced centers for 100 yards are the SR-1C) and see what 10 rounds looks like off the bench. If they're all in the 10 or at least the black then the challenge will be learning to shoot with the rifle in standing/sitting/prone with the sling you want to use.

I've shot a few of the CMP type matches at AGC with mosins with some success, my 28-30 has beat my M1 scores once or twice.

Btw if you want to trade that 174 grain ammo for something else let me know, I have a few rifles that like it so we could trade if I have something you'd want instead

 

[sbmike]

I just like shooting my M44 to watch the muzzle blast out the front.

 

[John from MD]

I just like shooting my M44 to watch the muzzle blast out the front.

Do it just prior to night and really see some flame.

 

[mawkie]

Couple things. barrels will vary greatly from mosin to Mosin. My Mosin Sniper, my Fin Mosin and one of my run of the mill 91/30 rifles have pristine barrels that shoot GREAT! I THINK my M38 I got from someone here has a decent barrel and I know it shoots pretty good. I got crap results with everything til I reloaded for it using 150gr .311 bullets for a 303 Brit and tuned it for the Sniper. It has shot well in all my other Mosins. Everything from surplus to even the "match PPU" which I think is a joke shot 4" size groups compared to the reloads which with the scoped sniper and me doing my part gets 1-2" groups @ 100 yards. If you play with trigger, for safety sake, do a butt slam test. Emptry gun, cock the gun and slam the butt down on some wood and make sure it won't fire. I got a WW1 dated Mosin and someone fiddled with the trigger/spring in there I think bent it to lighten the pull and it will go off if you slam it. I have not fired it and have yet to fix the trigger. I have done the washer, polish (flitz) and return spring tricks to 2 of the guns that are my better mosins. I have also done the cork thing and brass shims to firm up the action fit. That all makes a difference but w/o reloads it was not as much of a difference. If you can hit 2-3in groups @ 100 yards, you are doing GREAT!

All I care about most of my milsurps is to bang steel 100 Yards offhand.

Definitely this! Especially about "over tuning" the trigger. Back when Century was selling fake snipers I bought one directly from them on the cheap for a fun shooter. Century staff had modified the trigger to the point where it was very unsafe. Took a bit of work to return it to something safe and not scary light. Take care with your trigger adjustments, safety first!