Is it lawful to shoot an intruder who reaches for his waistband behind his back

[Bountied]

I remember watching a Shoot / Don't Shoot video eons ago where the suspect reached behind his back and eventually produced a note that said, "I am deaf"

Did they shoot him? Deaf people are annoying.

 

[Brute]

Did they shoot him? Deaf people are annoying.

Pretty sure I've already got a one-way ticket to Hell, so it's ok for me to laugh at this.

 

[swinokur]

You’ll have plenty of MDS company riding with you


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[dblas]

You’ll have plenty of MDS company riding with you


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I call curb side door gunner.

 

[4g64loser]

I call curb side door gunner.

Whoa, whoa, there. All respect to you for your knowledge and commitment to the cause but you must surely know that when you ride with Kurt cobain he always calls shotgun!

And since we are calling out road trip positions, I'll take lead vehicle cupola/ring mount.

 

[dblas]

Whoa, whoa, there. All respect to you for your knowledge and commitment to the cause but you must surely know that when you ride with Kurt cobain he always calls shotgun!

And since we are calling out road trip positions, I'll take lead vehicle cupola/ring mount.

Kurt can keep shotgun, I called door gunner (Curb side), a completely different position and weapon system. If this is a special bus, I claim the rear side door with the lift.

 

[Tungsten]

when you ride with Kurt cobain he always calls shotgun!

All ya'lls going to hell for that... lol

 

[4g64loser]

Kurt can keep shotgun, I called door gunner (Curb side), a completely different position and weapon system. If this is a special bus, I claim the rear side door with the lift.

That works. Shotgun is front seat curb side, you are calling mid or rear, check. Once upon a time, I worked for a place where the suburbans had lift-off door hinge kits and could be replaced with swing away bars that supported pintles for MAG58s. You can run one of those, I'm sure.

The theme song for this run should either be highway to hell or shout at the devil.

 

[dblas]

That works. Shotgun is front seat curb side, you are calling mid or rear, check. Once upon a time, I worked for a place where the suburbans had lift-off door hinge kits and could be replaced with swing away bars that supported pintles for MAG58s. You can run one of those, I'm sure.

The theme song for this run should either be highway to hell or shout at the devil.

I may have provided comms for the boss that those suburbans followed/lead for.

 

[dblas]

All ya'lls going to hell for that... lol

That is what we are calling seats and weapons for, have you not been paying attention??

 

[Boats]

This is situationally dependent. I'd wonder why a regular citizen would have someone held at gunpoint just standing there without first identifying a weapon. Police? Sure, but why would a regular citizen be in that position to start with?

If you're drawing a firearm, it should be to use it. You should be using it because there's a clear and articulable reason to expect severe bodily injury or death that you need to stop right then as you're drawing your gun.

This x100

 

[4g64loser]

I may have provided comms for the boss that those suburbans followed/lead for.

Oh, those guys have m249s. And badges. Definitely not one of those guys.

The military doesn't issue MAG58s, they have the M240B through M240L. The MAG58 is what you see in private or foreign military hands.

And I'd like to add another two songs to the sound track; the devil in I (slipknot) and devil's dance (metallica).

 

[smokey]

This is one of those times owning a undocumented .25 ACP saturday night special or something similar would be handy...also known as a "throw down" piece..

Basically every house has a knife block on a kitchen counter...

 

[Blacksmith101]

Oh, those guys have m249s. And badges. Definitely not one of those guys.

The military doesn't issue MAG58s, they have the M240B through M240L. The MAG58 is what you see in private or foreign military hands.

And I'd like to add another two songs to the sound track; the devil in I (slipknot) and devil's dance (metallica).

I suggest:

Ride of the Valkyries​

IN- A-GADDA-DA-VIDA​

In Hell I'll Be In Good Company​

 

[Tungsten]

Is a furtive movement by the criminal considered a justifiable escalation to use lethal force? I know I have seen police use it to justify shootings (vast majority of which the cop was correct), but I don't know if Joe Citizen is allowed to use that in his defense.

 

[4g64loser]

Is a furtive movement by the criminal considered a justifiable escalation to use lethal force? I know I have seen police use it to justify shootings (vast majority of which the cop was correct), but I don't know if Joe Citizen is allowed to use that in his defense.

It can be articulated as part of the affirmative defense. As a non-attorney, I'll defer on the finer points to dblas and those better educated than I am. What I will say is that the argument for use of lethal force is dependent on the totality of circumstances.

One way to break down the totality into more identifiable and specific things are so-called Graham factors. There's plenty of good written material that will be more eloquent on the subject than I can be. In short, you consider specific criteria as part of your assessment of the threat. It definitely helps you deconstruct hypothetical situations more effectively and be much more comfortable articulating your justification for the level of force used.

 

[rob]

I am neither a cop nor a lawyer. But I would suggest you not try to articulate a single thing. STFU and let your lawyer do it. STFU immediately. Like don't say anything. At all. Nothing.

My planned response if I ever find myself in that situation. "Considering the gravity of this situation, I respectfully decline to make a statement."

Rob

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[Biggfoot44]

. To distill and further summarize Fg64's post #156 :

This ( like most similar questions ) can not be answered with a catagorically Yea or No .

Per Rob's #157 :

At the immediate aftermath , you will either " stfu " , OR only make limited brief statement to effect of " he was attacking , I defended , that guy & that guy were witnesses " then stfu until lawyer .

With your lawyer , and at trial , subtleties of totality of circumstances will be important.

Assuming that you survive , of course .

 

[welder516]

Are you both in underwear and have slippers on ?

 

[E.Shell]

Are you both in underwear and have slippers on ?

And who has the hammer?