.223 bullet selection for home defense AR

[Russ D]

I don't care if you want to use #5 shot as a home defense weapon. I'm simply trying to provide fact based information to the OP and others who are trying to find an effective home defense load. As soon as you can find some sort of fact-based defense for using birdshot for self-defense, I welcome your addition to the discussion. But your post above is the equivalent of asking someone "Do you want to be slapped in the face?" and, when they say no, determinig that open-hand slapping is an effective deterrant against a determined attacker.

 

[501st]

Debating what I want to load up for home defense/self defense. No idea if I want something as frangible as a Barnes Varminator bullet or something like a Barnes TSX bullet.

What do you guys think would be a good idea? Even thought about alternating the bullet types in the mag, but that would be confusing as can be and they might not group well that way.

http://le.atk.com/ammunition/speer/rifle/details.aspx?id=24448

 

[SOMDSHOOT]

Hey it's your life, but I plan on shooting until the threat is no longer a threat.

I won't argue with that. Have fun with it.

 

[ksy95]

I run M193 ball through my AR as my defense loads. It's not a hollow point, but it destabilizes and yaws pretty fast when it hits squishy stuff. The overpenetration is pretty low.

 

[Bonanza]

- the legal implications if using hand loaded vs factory ammo can be huge, especially in this state.

Thats what I was gonna say.
Load all you want, but leave a mag filled with factory loads if that's your choice for home defense.

 

[fabsroman]

Thats what I was gonna say.
Load all you want, but leave a mag filled with factory loads if that's your choice for home defense.

The amount of disinformation/bad information given by gun owners is just incredible.

I want to see a single case where somebody was sued successfully for killing an intruder with hand loaded ammunition.

This is about as bad as the rumor that a person can only have 5,000 loaded rounds of ammunition on hand. Heard that earlier in the year and have yet to find a single law or case that actually supports its "illegality".

I just find it hard to believe that the beneficiaries of the estate of an intruder that breaks into my home, whom I can legally kill under the castle doctrine, can be successful in suing me based upon the type of ammo I use to kill the intruder. Next thing I am going to hear is that I will get sued should I decapitate the intruder with a sword.

 

[Pinecone]

You can find it hard to believe, but stranger things have happened. Starting with, why can the family of someone who BROKE INTO YOUR HOME, sue you???????

And no, there is no case where the ONE THING that caused the person to lose was the use of handloads, but as posted, there are a number of cases where the use of handloads CAUSED PROBLEMS FOR THE DEFENSE.

So you win, after 4 trials, and several million dollars in legal fees. Great, you are right, you won, shoot handloads and damn the consequences. It only is your wallet

Oh and yeah, what about your family??

 

[Vince55]

Rifle is too hard to manuver inside the house for home defense. Ruger .44 with 240 gr. SP Hit someone with one and they go down.

 

[Pinecone]

Read more on MD Castle Doctrine 2010 which provides immunity under certain circumstances.
http://delegatemike.com/maryland-governor-signs-castle-doctrine-bill/
http://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=42331&highlight=Castle+Doctrine

As long as the local DA doesn't prosecute you, and your use of handloads or anything else they can think up gets a conviction.

They you have both the conviction AND the civil suit.

 

[fabsroman]

As long as the local DA doesn't prosecute you, and your use of handloads or anything else they can think up gets a conviction.

They you have both the conviction AND the civil suit.

You do realize that I happen to be an attorney.

I did a google search last night about the issue and the only thing I could find was that using hand loads makes it harder for them to piece together the crime scene if they were trying to use ballistics to figure out where the shots were fired, etc. Hand loads can also make it look like you were hungry for blood and out to kill somebody with more lethal loads. Counter to that is "I had no intention to kill anybody, merely make sure I neutralize a threat of death as quickly as possible for the safety of me, my wife, and my three kids."

I just cannot see a State's Attorney bringing charges when the only thing to hang his hat on is hand loads. If the rest falls within the Castle Doctrine or even self defense, I cannot see the State pressing charges just because hand loads were used.

I clerked at a personal injury firm for 2 years while I was in law school and worked for 3 years for a firm that did insurance defense work and I seriously doubt that the beneficiaries of the decedent's estate would prevail on a civil lawsuit either just because hand loads were used.

Yes, I understand that anybody can get sued any day of the week and twice on Friday. However, I am not going to let that prevent me from using hand loads for home defense when I think I can make a better, cheaper, load than what is offered by the factory.

 

[BenL]

For home defense:

Rifle > Shotgun > Pistol.

 

[Pinecone]

You do realize that I happen to be an attorney.

I did a google search last night about the issue and the only thing I could find was that using hand loads makes it harder for them to piece together the crime scene if they were trying to use ballistics to figure out where the shots were fired, etc. Hand loads can also make it look like you were hungry for blood and out to kill somebody with more lethal loads. Counter to that is "I had no intention to kill anybody, merely make sure I neutralize a threat of death as quickly as possible for the safety of me, my wife, and my three kids."

I just cannot see a State's Attorney bringing charges when the only thing to hang his hat on is hand loads. If the rest falls within the Castle Doctrine or even self defense, I cannot see the State pressing charges just because hand loads were used.

I clerked at a personal injury firm for 2 years while I was in law school and worked for 3 years for a firm that did insurance defense work and I seriously doubt that the beneficiaries of the decedent's estate would prevail on a civil lawsuit either just because hand loads were used.

Yes, I understand that anybody can get sued any day of the week and twice on Friday. However, I am not going to let that prevent me from using hand loads for home defense when I think I can make a better, cheaper, load than what is offered by the factory.

Up to you. I don't trust the system enough.

The only thing I will argue with you about is the cheaper. Not because you cannot reload cheaper, but that for HD you don't shoot enough to make the cost a factor. At least most people don't.

I prefer factory ammo for HD. Just don't want any additional factors involved. And at HD distances, the POI doesn't differ much from my reloads that I shoot all the time.

 

[jmike1487]

That's interesting.
I find it odd that Hornady would make a line specifically for LEO and that it not be optimal for home defense. I keep some mags loaded with the TAP and the PDX1.
Frankly though, 30 rounds of just about anything will stop the threat.

+1

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[Blackstar65]

Federal soft tip 55 grain