Special Session: SB21 Introduced

[Patrick]

(1) A CHURCH OR OTHER PLACE OF WORSHIP; Sikh Shooting
(2) AN ESTABLISHMENT LICENSED TO SERVE ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGES;
(3) A GOVERNMENT BUILDING;
(4) A PRIVATE SCHOOL, UNIVERSITY, OR COLLEGE; Virginia Tech Shooting
(5) A PUBLIC SCHOOL, UNIVERSITY, OR COLLEGE; Columbine Shooting
(6) A PUBLIC LIBRARY;
(7) A THEATER OR MOVIE THEATER; OR Aurora Shooting
(8) A YOUTH CENTER. Norway Shooting


Did they google mass murder and add the locations to the prohibited list??
WTF?

Pretty much. You could fill in the rest of those places with a little more Googling. Like the US Congress shootings a few years back, where the guard was killed.

It's illustrative of the mindset.

I won't damn this, but will say it's a bad bill in its current form.

 

[eruby]

repealing the requirement that the Secretary find that a person has a good and substantial reason to wear, carry, or transport a handgun before issuing a handgun permit to the person

This seems good, but this is Maryland, so I'll take it with a grain pound of salt.

 

[Braddbdl]

[(5)] (9) based on an investigation: 28
(i) has not exhibited a propensity for violence or instability that 29 may reasonably render the person’s possession of a handgun a danger to the person or 30 to another; and 31
SENATE BILL 21 7
(ii) [has good and substantial reason to wear, carry, or transport 1 a handgun, such as a finding that the permit is necessary as a reasonable precaution 2 against apprehended danger] HAS NOT EXHIBITED ANY CONDUCT THAT INDICATES 3 THE PERSON IS POTENTIALLY A DANGER TO THE PUBLIC IF ISSUED A PERMIT.

Do brackets mean that it's being removed?

 

[Atlasarmory]

(1) A CHURCH OR OTHER PLACE OF WORSHIP; Sikh Shooting
(2) AN ESTABLISHMENT LICENSED TO SERVE ALCOHOLIC BEVERAGES;
(3) A GOVERNMENT BUILDING;
(4) A PRIVATE SCHOOL, UNIVERSITY, OR COLLEGE; Virginia Tech Shooting
(5) A PUBLIC SCHOOL, UNIVERSITY, OR COLLEGE; Columbine Shooting
(6) A PUBLIC LIBRARY;
(7) A THEATER OR MOVIE THEATER; OR Aurora Shooting
(8) A YOUTH CENTER. Norway Shooting


Did they google mass murder and add the locations to the prohibited list??
WTF?

Looks like I'll be avoiding libraries for the foreseeable future

 

[vector03]

Pretty much. You could fill in the rest of those places with a little more Googling. Like the US Congress shootings a few years back, where the guard was killed.

It's illustrative of the mindset.

I won't damn this, but will say it's a bad bill in its current form.

Just added in Luby's Massacre

 

[lx1x]

Pretty much. You could fill in the rest of those places with a little more Googling. Like the US Congress shootings a few years back, where the guard was killed.

It's illustrative of the mindset.

I won't damn this, but will say it's a bad bill in its current form.

you mean they forgot 1000 yards from any safeway..

 

[jkray]

[(5)]
Do brackets mean that it's being removed?

yes and bold means it being inserted

 

[jkray]

they forgot 1000 yards from any safeway..

safeway can sell cooking wine so its covered under the alcohol section

 

[MJD438]

My thoughts:

1. A lot of mere wording changes.
2. Propose 4-203 (b) (2) (II) is redundant from a layperson's perspective since I would make a logical assumption that it is covered under what is currently in that section.
3. Proposed changes to 5-113 just look like minor word-smithing that does not substantially change the content from current.
4. Proposed changes to 5-306:
   1. 5 - Adding in to wording what was already presumed (permit holder must be able to possess any regulated handguns)
   2. 6 - Open-ended, undefined, continually refreshed, mandated by and controlled by the state training requirement; at least it is without charge (maybe...wording is too ambiguous)
   3. 7 - Again, to me this would already be presumed from the regulated firearms issues
   4. 8 - No permits for those that have been charged with, but not found guilty of, certain crimes
      [*]9(ii) - strikes "good and substantial" and replaces with the highly subjective criteria of "potentially a danger to the public"
5. Proposed changes to 5-309 adds the onerous training requirement discussed above in 5-306
6. Addition of 5-315 TPM restrictions which pretty much rule out ever carrying a firearm in places where it is most needed (based on news reports over the past couple of years) with a permit, without exceptions, even for LEO/retired LEO

 

[browning guy]

I interpret it more to mean that you will not be able to provide self-defence to your children since all the restricted places are places I would go with my children.

All restaurants are out since they are licensed.
All professional or semi-professional sporting events are out since they are licensed.
All live entertainment is out (like Disney on ice or the Wiggles) since they are licensed and god knows I need a beer to get through the wiggles.

Those 10 items effectively remove 90% of the places I would ever take my kids any way. Maybe even 100% since parks and other playgrounds might actually fall under one of those places as well.

100% all good points!
One of the reasons I carry is for my childern's safety. Also the penelty for making a mistake on where to and not to carry is basicly you loose your guns.

this bill needs more clarity to it.

 

[lx1x]

safeway can sell cooking wine so its covered under the alcohol section

cooking vs beverages.. not the same.. oops.. just gave them an idea..

 

[MJD438]

safeway can sell cooking wine so its covered under the alcohol section

Well, they don't "serve" alcohol...

 

[hdatontodo]

Florida's 790.05 12 License to Carry Concealed Weapon or Firearm contains:

...
any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premisys, which portion of the establishments is primarily devoted to such purpose;
...


Virginia's contains:

...
J3. No person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premisys of any restaurant or club as defined in 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia (ABC)... may consume an alcohol beverage while on the premisys...
...

 

[lx1x]

Florida's 790.05 12 License to Carry Concealed Weapon or Firearm contains:

...
any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premisys, which portion of the establishments is primarily devoted to such purpose;
...


Virginia's contains:

...
J3. No person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premisys of any restaurant or club as defined in 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia (ABC)... may consume an alcohol beverage while on the premisys...
...

key right there.. from my understanding that you can get it there but cannot consume any alcoholic beverages.

 

[Garet Jax]

Florida's 790.05 12 License to Carry Concealed Weapon or Firearm contains:

...
any portion of an establishment licensed to dispense alcoholic beverages for consumption on the premisys, which portion of the establishments is primarily devoted to such purpose;
...


Virginia's contains:

...
J3. No person who carries a concealed handgun onto the premisys of any restaurant or club as defined in 4.1-100 for which a license to sell and serve alcoholic beverages for on-premises consumption has been granted by the Virginia (ABC)... may consume an alcohol beverage while on the premisys...
...

Florida's is a little scary - so I can go to a restaurant that serves alcohol, but I can't sit at the bar waiting for my table.

Viriginia's is a little more to my liking

 

[Patrick]

Doesn't go after preemption? At work.

Sent from my SAMSUNG-SGH-I747 using Tapatalk 2

Technically, no. But look to the nebulous definitions of "Youth Center"...there is none.

Parks?

I'm sure that would be up to localities to decide.

This is the smartest gun control bill I have read in a long, long time. Smart, as in, "We need to worry about it coming back in the future."

 

[Garet Jax]

Technically, no. But look to the nebulous definitions of "Youth Center"...there is none.

Parks?

I'm sure that would be up to localities to decide.

This is the smartest gun control bill I have read in a long, long time. Smart, as in, "We need to worry about it coming back in the future."

I agree 100%. This is exactly what I was alluding to above. Youth Centers could easily be defined as including Annie's Playground or Lynn Stacey Park (up here in Harford County).

This bill could easily be you now have the right to CC, but you can't do it any place where you would normally go so it is no better than G&S.

[edit]One added thought: This is far worse than G&S in the sense that to fight it (and especially to legally define the more ambiguous terms), someone is going to have to risk their freedom and their ability to even own guns. All Wollard had to do was apply for a CCW permit and get rejected. With that action and that denial, we had a court case with which we could argue against G&S. Win or lose no one went to jail and no one lost their freedom. That won't be the case here.

 

[highwayheat]

More knee jerk reaction legislation by the liberal democrats in the the General Assembly

 

[markgrutz]

Sent my first round of emails.

Mark

 

[3/2ACR Vet]

Technically, no. But look to the nebulous definitions of "Youth Center"...there is none.

Parks?

I'm sure that would be up to localities to decide.

This is the smartest gun control bill I have read in a long, long time. Smart, as in, "We need to worry about it coming back in the future."

Baltimore City has several Youth Recreation Centers, some run by the police, some by the city. That and places like YMCA's are what they mean, probably