VICTORY IN PALMER!!!!

[StantonCree]

BTW for those who perviously asked about what the court was going with people carrying guns during the stay.

Process............

You get caught with a gun....your going to be arrested for Carrying a Pistol (Misd and Felony) You will be charged the Felony Version as only the COURTS use the Misd Version.

You go down to court and they drop it down to Unregistered Firearm and Unregistered Ammo. (Both 6th Month Misd. cases that are tossed over to the OAG not the USAO)

Here is where I am not clear...........As a D.C. resident who carries they legally can't charge you the UF/UA if that process is properly completed so I don't know what the courts will do with that or if there is some other charge I don't know about. You will be arrested but I don't know what the courts will do as a D.C. resident but as an out-of-state resident see above.

I don't care about your concerns/comments/questions just giving you the information that was previolusly asked.

 

[DC-W]

2 Weeks, here we go!

 

[redeemed.man]

BTW for those who perviously asked about what the court was going with people carrying guns during the stay.

Process............

You get caught with a gun....your going to be arrested for Carrying a Pistol (Misd and Felony) You will be charged the Felony Version as only the COURTS use the Misd Version.

You go down to court and they drop it down to Unregistered Firearm and Unregistered Ammo. (Both 6th Month Misd. cases that are tossed over to the OAG not the USAO)

Here is where I am not clear...........As a D.C. resident who carries they legally can't charge you the UF/UA if that process is properly completed so I don't know what the courts will do with that or if there is some other charge I don't know about. You will be arrested but I don't know what the courts will do as a D.C. resident but as an out-of-state resident see above.

I don't care about your concerns/comments/questions just giving you the information that was previolusly asked.

Thanks for posting this.

 

[press1280]

BTW for those who perviously asked about what the court was going with people carrying guns during the stay.

Process............

You get caught with a gun....your going to be arrested for Carrying a Pistol (Misd and Felony) You will be charged the Felony Version as only the COURTS use the Misd Version.

You go down to court and they drop it down to Unregistered Firearm and Unregistered Ammo. (Both 6th Month Misd. cases that are tossed over to the OAG not the USAO)

Here is where I am not clear...........As a D.C. resident who carries they legally can't charge you the UF/UA if that process is properly completed so I don't know what the courts will do with that or if there is some other charge I don't know about. You will be arrested but I don't know what the courts will do as a D.C. resident but as an out-of-state resident see above.

I don't care about your concerns/comments/questions just giving you the information that was previolusly asked.

Presumably those charges won't stick to a non-resident since they have no mechanism to register their firearms (or ammo) in DC.

 

[press1280]

Gura did a nice job addressing DC's statements about adopting NY or MD may-issue: While Defendants’ argument lacks merit, that is not to say that it lacks value. The Drake theory Defendants endorse is rooted upon one central truth: a scheme allowing individuals to carry handguns only where they have a “justifiable need” to do so, N.J. Stat. Ann. § 2C:58-4(c), as
determined at the police’s discretion, is incompatible with a right to carry handguns. The Third Circuit acknowledged the conflict, but decided that the 1924 statute negates the existence of the right ratified in 1791.
This Court has indicated it will not make the same error should the District seek to evade the ruling by enacting a discretionary licensing scheme that destroys the right. This Court required “a licensing mechanism consistent with constitutional standards enabling people to exercise their
Second Amendment right to bear arms,” assuming that Defendants would wish to license the carrying of handguns (they are not obligated to require a license). Opinion, at 16; see also Order, Dkt. 53, at 2 (“appropriate legislation consistent with the Court’s ruling”). This Court’s requirement
is especially apt considering Defendants’ repeated admissions that its pre-2008 discretionary licensing scheme was, for all intents and purposes, indistinguishable from the flat ban this Court enjoined.

 

[ih23]

I had a huge grin when I read the conclusion of Mr. Gura's brief.

Not long ago, the District of Columbia made the same arguments with respect to the right to “keep” handguns—that the city is different, that handguns are too dangerous to keep, that the social costs of handgun possession outweigh any benefits, etc. and so on. The Supreme Court’s answer then is relevant now:

The very enumeration of the right takes out of the hands of government—even the Third Branch of Government—the power to decide on a case-by-case basis whether the right is really worth insisting upon. A constitutional guarantee subject to future judges’ assessments of its usefulness is no constitutional guarantee at all. Heller, 554 U.S. at 634; McDonald, 130 S. Ct. at 3050; Peruta, 742 F.3d at 1167; Opinion, at 15.

It is, however, “really worth insisting” that the Defendants cease resisting the constitutional reality, accept the fact that the Constitution does not always reflect their favorite policies, and stop interfering with the people’s enjoyment of fundamental rights.

 

[Afrikeber]

BTW for those who perviously asked about what the court was going with people carrying guns during the stay.

Process............

You get caught with a gun....your going to be arrested for Carrying a Pistol (Misd and Felony) You will be charged the Felony Version as only the COURTS use the Misd Version.

You go down to court and they drop it down to Unregistered Firearm and Unregistered Ammo. (Both 6th Month Misd. cases that are tossed over to the OAG not the USAO)

Here is where I am not clear...........As a D.C. resident who carries they legally can't charge you the UF/UA if that process is properly completed so I don't know what the courts will do with that or if there is some other charge I don't know about. You will be arrested but I don't know what the courts will do as a D.C. resident but as an out-of-state resident see above.

I don't care about your concerns/comments/questions just giving you the information that was previolusly asked.

Appreciate the heads up.

 

[Tyeraxus]

Judge's order says self defense has to be acceptable meaning may issue is not on the table with him. He also says that you cannot exclude nonresidents. So with this judge may issue and non reciprocity will not fly. The Circuit is a completely different matter and I expect they will overturn this in short order.

Why does everybody keep saying this? Even with the judge's order that DC allow non-residents the ability to carry, they absolutely are NOT required to accept or implement reciprocity. A non-resident permit scheme using the same standards as a resident permit scheme would satisfy the judge's order, make more money for the city, and allow them to compile a "carry registry" to boot. That is absolutely the way I expect them to go.

 

[GTOGUNNER]

Why does everybody keep saying this? Even with the judge's order that DC allow non-residents the ability to carry, they absolutely are NOT required to accept or implement reciprocity. A non-resident permit scheme using the same standards as a resident permit scheme would satisfy the judge's order, make more money for the city, and allow them to compile a "carry registry" to boot. That is absolutely the way I expect them to go.

Dat true.

 

[press1280]

Dat true.

Agreed, and don't be suprised if more non-residents than residents apply.

 

[JC92]

Judge's order says self defense has to be acceptable meaning may issue is not on the table with him. He also says that you cannot exclude nonresidents. So with this judge may issue and non reciprocity will not fly. The Circuit is a completely different matter and I expect they will overturn this in short order.

DC will not appeal. They made this mistake in the Heller case which brought about a Supreme Court decision. The anti-Second Amendment folks will not risk bringing another clear case to the Supreme Court, when all that they have lost is just Second Amendment gains in the small area of the District of Columbia.

 

[rem87062597]

DC will not appeal. They made this mistake in the Heller case which brought about a Supreme Court decision. The anti-Second Amendment folks will not risk bringing another clear case to the Supreme Court, when all that they have lost is just Second Amendment gains in the small area of the District of Columbia.

They're not a united front though. We're just dealing with the higher-ups in DC here, and they may be thinking more about DC than the bigger picture. At least that's what I'm hoping.

 

[swinokur]

That's my thinkiing as well. DC is too focused on the "we're special" aspect to worry about the rest of the country. Deep legal thought isn't their forte IMO. Look at Heller.

I'd be ok with getting a DC permit if they don't want reciprocity with other states. Carry is the objective, no matter how we get there.

My .02

 

[swinokur]

The problem with a national reciprocity bill is all of the previous ones proposed didn't force a state to issue a permit, only that other states honor other states permits. That would bring up 10A issues if a state was forced to issue.

How does that help us?

Let DC issue a permits. I'll get one.

Letting the FEDS compel states to do something that is not is the Federal purview opens a whole other can of worms. If SCOTUS mandates carry that's another issue entirely. Enumerated rights should be clarified and solidified by SCOTUS, not by the whims of Congress.

My .02

 

[Inigoes]

The problem with a national reciprocity bill is all of the previous ones proposed didn't force a state to issue a permit, only that other states honor other states permits. That would bring up 10A issues if a state was forced to issue.

How does that help us?

Let DC issue a permits. I'll get one.

If the court coerces compels DC to accept an out-of-territory (MD/VA/WV/PA/UT) permit, then that would force the states to accept each others, removing the "non-resident" permits from the table, creating a less complicated process.

Currently, the reprocity agreements have gotten too cumbersome. If the states honor each others DL, they should honor each others carry permit.

 

[Mr H]

Great, so then we can have a $300 Illinois permit, something equally ridiculous for D.C., and then when/if Md, NY, NJ, and CA ever get forced to issue permits, something equally expensive from all of them, which of course the courts are not willing to do anything about. Tell a poor woman she needs a $5 photo ID to vote for a Democrat to provide food stamps to her 12 illegitimate children, and it's an outrage. A $340 gun permit fee is perfectly acceptable.

No. We need federal reciprocity, with no exception for one's own state of residence. This way everyone will just get whatever state has the cheapest permit and we can all call it a day.

You bring up a valid point, and one we used in the FSA13 debates...

Is it allowable to price/regulate citizens out of the exercise of an Enumerated Right?!

We know Maryland tries it in many things, making the costs and hoops so onerous as to discourage people from engaging in a particular activity.

But to do this for RKBA, with exorbitant fees, should not be able to stand. You might as well restrict voting to landowners with more than 1000 acres.

 

[swinokur]

I agree. But having congress do it isn't nearly as palatable as the courts doing it.

The cost of the permit is an issue to be resolved as well.

 

[OrbitalEllipses]

That's my thinkiing as well. DC is too focused on the "we're special" aspect to worry about the rest of the country. Deep legal thought isn't their forte IMO. Look at Heller.

I'd be ok with getting a DC permit if they don't want reciprocity with other states. Carry is te objective, no matter how we get there.

My .02

I love it when someone with a case of "I'm special" gets a hard smack of truth.

I'm not calling for that. I'm calling for Congress to force every state to honor every other state's permit. If D.C. won't issue one itself, then we'll just get a Florida or Utah permit.

The interesting issue with this and other national reciprocity type ideas is it totally tramples states' rights. Did an anti come up with that argument? Probably...but it's true in a way, isn't it?

 

[Inigoes]

The interesting issue with this and other national reciprocity type ideas is it totally tramples states' rights. Did an anti come up with that argument? Probably...but it's true in a way, isn't it?

Not if carry permits were handled like Drivers Licenses.

Renew your carry permit, when you renew your DL! Hmmmm....

 

[OrbitalEllipses]

Not if carry permits were handled like Drivers Licenses.

Renew your carry permit, when you renew your DL! Hmmmm....

Well, if I can register to vote when I get my DL why can't I get my CCW at the same time...