Spent Shell Casing Cost

[montoya32]

Do any other states have this program?

What is the consensus on what it costs per firearm to include a fired shell casing? I would love to stick it to the state over this. I have personally had to pay $30+/- per gun to have a shell case fired for purchases I've made over the last 5 years.

Mfg of firearms that do not include a shell case should be pissed too.

 

[montoya32]

I know of a case that was solved via shell casing. I think the PG county Sargent is stll in jail.

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Can the resolution of the case be specifically attributed to the shell case or other info collected?

 

[Bolts Rock]

What people don't realize is for a MD Dealer to do the shell casing they need an 07 FFL, BUT most 07's don't realize that they also need to submit for ITAR (US State Department). This costs $2200+ EACH YEAR, even if you DONT export or manufacture anything. You still have to register. Fines for non-compliance, each year can approach 1 MILLION dollars and jail time of 3+ years for each violation.

BATFE is looking at this when they do FFL inspections and they WILL inform the State Department if a 07 is not compliant.


All that to sell handguns that don't have shell casings.

ITAR makes things so much more fun too. You cannot allow any foreign national (anyone not a US Citizen or holder of a valid legal permanent resident alien card) to handle any export controlled item without your direct supervision and permission. You cannot discuss any export controlled item without reporting it to State and you're supposed to get permission to "export" the information you disclose prior to discussing it. You cannot even think of selling an export controlled item to a foreign national (mildot scopes, EoTechs and the like, most Magpul products, magazines, guns.....). The way ITAR is written State can come down on you for even having those items where a foreign national can see them out of their packaging.

 

[GTOGUNNER]

Can the resolution of the case be specifically attributed to the shell case or other info collected?

I think so. Police traced shell casings from the crime scenes to the gun of Prince George's County police officer Ray Evans.
This was In the 1990s...

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[Topher]

Don't forget the revenue they could realize if they recycled the brass they had already collected.

So it is a Double bonus for MD:
1. Stop spending money on a broken / pointless system.
2. Realize cash by selling the brass they have to be recycled.

 

[tsmith1499]

I think so. Police traced shell casings from the crime scenes to the gun of Prince George's County police officer Ray Evans.
This was In the 1990s...

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But I was under the impression that the fired shell casing program started in 2000. So if your case was in the 90's this program didn't help.

 

[Mr H]

But I was under the impression that the fired shell casing program started in 2000. So if your case was in the 90's this program didn't help.

Correct... 1990s would have been basic forensics that existed at the time.

 

[GTOGUNNER]

Maybe they did it with cops first? 3 people went to jail on this one.

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[GTOGUNNER]

Maybe they did it with cops first? 3 people went to jail on this one.

But then again. The program clearly doesn't work..



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[danb]

ok so we have discovered the ONE case. maybe.

Maryland has had about 4000 firearms related murders since this was passed. More in 2007, 2008, 2009, many years after this passed. Tell me again how much this actually costs...?? It sounds like the answer is: No idea

 

[tsmith1499]

This program cost MD. 2.5 MILLION dollars from 2000-2005. That's when the MSP themselves asked it be repealed and the same year 3 delegates brought one of the first bills to repeal it.

 

[SB281 Blaster]

Copy of New York bill repealing shell casings 3 years ago. Used this last week and will this week in testimony if it is of any help.



Bill S459-2011
Repeals pistol and revolver ballistic identification databank
Repeals section 396-ff of the general business law relating to the pistol and revolver ballistic identification databank.
Details
• Same as:A1131-2011
• VersionsS459-2011
• Sponsor:NOZZOLIO
• Multi-sponsor(s):None
• Co-sponsor(s):GOLDEN, O'MARA, RITCHIE, SEWARD, ZELDIN
• Committee:RULES
• Law Section: General Business Law
• Law: Rpld §396-ff, Gen Bus L
Actions
• Jun 21, 2012: COMMITTED TO RULES
• Jan 23, 2012: ADVANCED TO THIRD READING
• Jan 19, 2012: 2ND REPORT CAL.
• Jan 18, 2012: 1ST REPORT CAL.66
• Jan 4, 2012: REFERRED TO CONSUMER PROTECTION
• Jan 4, 2012: returned to senate
• Jan 4, 2012: died in assembly
• Jun 13, 2011: referred to codes
• Jun 13, 2011: DELIVERED TO ASSEMBLY
• Jun 13, 2011: PASSED SENATE
• May 23, 2011: ADVANCED TO THIRD READING
• May 18, 2011: 2ND REPORT CAL.
• May 17, 2011: 1ST REPORT CAL.754
• Jan 5, 2011: REFERRED TO CONSUMER PROTECTION
Votes
VOTE: COMMITTEE VOTE: - Consumer Protection - May 17, 2011
Ayes (7):Zeldin, Ball, Fuschillo, Little, Marcellino, O'Mara, Hassell-Thompson
Ayes W/R (1):Huntley
Nays (2):Adams, Squadron
VOTE: FLOOR VOTE: - Jun 13, 2011
Ayes (38):Adams, Addabbo, Alesi, Ball, Bonacic, Breslin, DeFrancisco, Farley, Flanagan, Fuschillo, Gallivan, Golden, Griffo, Grisanti, Hannon, Johnson, Kennedy, Lanza, Larkin, LaValle, Libous, Little, Marcellino, Martins, Maziarz, McDonald, Nozzolio, O'Mara, Ranzenhofer, Ritchie, Robach, Saland, Sampson, Seward, Skelos, Valesky, Young, Zeldin
Nays (22):Avella, Carlucci, Diaz, Dilan, Duane, Espaillat, Gianaris, Hassell-Thomps, Klein, Krueger, Montgomery, Oppenheimer, Parker, Peralta, Perkins, Rivera, Savino, Serrano, Smith, Squadron, Stavisky, Stewart-Cousin
Absent (2):Huntley, Kruger
VOTE: COMMITTEE VOTE: - Consumer Protection - Jan 18, 2012
Ayes (7):Zeldin, Ball, Fuschillo, Little, Marcellino, O'Mara, Hassell-Thompson
Ayes W/R (1):Adams
Nays (2):Huntley, Squadron
Memo
BILL NUMBER:S459

TITLE OF BILL: An act to repeal section 396-ff of the general business law relating to the pistol and revolver ballistic identification databank

PURPOSE OR GENERAL IDEA OF BILL: To discontinue the use of the New York Combined Ballistic Identification System (CoBIS) and to remove the shell casing requirement from state law.

JUSTIFICATION: It is the conclusion of two studies by the California Department of Justice conducted two years ago and a 2004 study conducted by the Maryland State Police that the ballistic database systems in these states are a waste of time, money and manpower. The Maryland report cited the complete failure of the New York Combined Ballistic Identification System (CoBIS) to produce a single "hit" on a gun crime as complete failure of that system. The CoBIS system is costing taxpayers approximately $4 million per year and it is a certainty that the State Police could find a better use for those millions.

PRIOR LEGISLATIVE HISTORY: S.4577 of 2005/2006 S.711 of 2007/2008 S.1152 of 2009/2010

FISCAL IMPLICATIONS: None.

EFFECTIVE DATE: Immediately after having become law.

Text

STATE OF NEW YORK
________________________________________________________________________

459

2011-2012 Regular Sessions

IN SENATE

(PREFILED)

January 5, 2011
___________

Introduced by Sen. NOZZOLIO -- read twice and ordered printed, and when
printed to be committed to the Committee on Consumer Protection

AN ACT to repeal section 396-ff of the general business law relating to
the pistol and revolver ballistic identification databank

THE PEOPLE OF THE STATE OF NEW YORK, REPRESENTED IN SENATE AND ASSEM-
BLY, DO ENACT AS FOLLOWS:

Section 1. Section 396-ff of the general business law is REPEALED.
S 2. This act shall take effect immediately.

EXPLANATION--Matter in ITALICS (underscored) is new; matter in brackets
[ ] is old law to be omitted.
LBD00458-01-1

 

[jcbvh]

OK... Devil's Advocate for a second...

Assuming this is correct, and this program had proven effective, why then would MSP not look to repair the equipment.

I'm thinking there's a tweak in that report somewhere...

So Im trying to understand this.

You have to give Maryland State Police a spent shell casing from a handgun?

What does this do exactly?

 

[Mr H]

Has to be part of the purchase process for a new handgun, yes.

Ironically, if it is a private sale, there is no such requirement, even if the original purchaser came from out-of-state.

 

[jcbvh]

Has to be part of the purchase process for a new handgun, yes.

Ironically, if it is a private sale, there is no such requirement, even if the original purchaser came from out-of-state.

Are barrels illegal in MD?

This is dumb. What is to stop people from switching barrels rendering the shell casing intrusion useless?

 

[Mr H]

Are barrels illegal in MD?

This is dumb. What is to stop people from switching barrels rendering the shell casing intrusion useless?

or firing pins

You're right on it. I use the barrel example all the time.

No one ever accused MD of having laws that made sense.

 

[jcbvh]

or firing pins

You're right on it. I use the barrel example all the time.

No one ever accused MD of having laws that made sense.

Yep. Amazing.

 

[rseymorejr]

So Im trying to understand this.

You have to give Maryland State Police a spent shell casing from a handgun?

What does this do exactly?

Impedes the process of exercising our rights, makes it more expensive and make clueless liberal idiots think they did something important.

 

[Mr H]

And that's only PART of the problem.

I will refer our Cajun Compadre to the web, to look up "Plan Maryland".

 

[Not_an_outlaw]

Where is this Maryland Report? How can I get a copy? Anyone request it under MD Sunshine Law?