https://palmettostatearmory.com/pan...hotgun-18-5-w-fixed-skeleton-stock-black.html
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Wanting to get into shotguns, are these legal in Maryland and opinions.
- Thread starter nuxbag
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Yes. All of the above are legal, AFAIK.
Thanks, Do you have any experience with bullpup shotguns?
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Standard SAs and pumps are more my speed. I never really got into bullpups.
I think the only kind of shotgun that is problematic in MD is one with a revolving cylinder. The exception to that is the Curciut Judge since that has a rifled barrel.
The only issue I've heard with both the Panzer Arms and Black Aces shotguns is that they can be particularly picky (even more so than the high-end fancy competition guns) with ammo. Specifically, they tend to do better with higher pressure loads vs target loads, and that can make things pricey if you shoot a lot.
Squaregrouper
Kragaphile
I did extensive testing with my Black Aces Bullpup and you are correct. It will reliably shoot anything at 1250+ fps. 1200-1225fps is hit or miss. <1200fps/light target loads simply don't work.
Ellis Gordon
gordoninmontgomerycounty
Take a look at this Maryland legal Bullpub:
The Tavor TS12 12 gauge shotgun is a gas regulated bullpup shotgun with an innovative design that feeds from one of three (3) individual magazines which can hold four 3 inch shotgun shells or five 2 ¾ inch shotgun shells each. This means that the potential overall capacity from all three (3) individual magazines is 15 rounds plus one additional round in the chamber. The TS12 has a unique feature that automatically loads a round in the chamber once the subsequent loaded magazine is rotated into position. It can be fed and unloaded from either side.
The Tavor TS12 12 gauge shotgun is a gas regulated bullpup shotgun with an innovative design that feeds from one of three (3) individual magazines which can hold four 3 inch shotgun shells or five 2 ¾ inch shotgun shells each. This means that the potential overall capacity from all three (3) individual magazines is 15 rounds plus one additional round in the chamber. The TS12 has a unique feature that automatically loads a round in the chamber once the subsequent loaded magazine is rotated into position. It can be fed and unloaded from either side.
I do, if you mean the recent Turkish imports. Most of the newer crop of uber tactical semiautomatics being brought over from Turkey really need a careful break in with full power loads and ran a little wet. Once they have seen a couple boxes of at least high brass hunting loads, it seems as though they are as reliable as they’re going to be. They DO need that break in though. A lot of new owners try to go grab a 100 pack of Walmart target stuff and then are bumming clearing jam after jam.
Bullpups, in general, have that added trigger linkage and these shotguns are just semi autos that are stuck in a bullpup stock configuration, adding more complexity while not really offering sound engineering solutions like more seriously developed bullpup weapons systems. In other words, the driver towards getting all of these similar variants to market was that they are “hot sellers”, not that there was a significant Turkish contribution to modern small arms development…
Squaregrouper
Kragaphile
The TS12 is excellent, but almost 4x the price. I moonlight at Masada Tactical and have played with a lot of IWI firearms.Take a look at this Maryland legal Bullpub:
The Tavor TS12 12 gauge shotgun is a gas regulated bullpup shotgun with an innovative design that feeds from one of three (3) individual magazines which can hold four 3 inch shotgun shells or five 2 ¾ inch shotgun shells each. This means that the potential overall capacity from all three (3) individual magazines is 15 rounds plus one additional round in the chamber. The TS12 has a unique feature that automatically loads a round in the chamber once the subsequent loaded magazine is rotated into position. It can be fed and unloaded from either side.
(IWI's lead factory instructor is BK Blankchtein who owns Masada Tactical)
Instructors - IWI Academy
iwiacademy.us
Headedthere
Member
Seems like there'd be a fix for this?
Squaregrouper
Kragaphile
The easy fix would be to buy a shotgun that costs double or triple the price.
For the record, a few months ago @ToolAA and I did some shotgun torture tests. An actual Benelli M4 ($1800) didn't do well with 1175fps shells. Bottom line is low velocity shotgun shells don't do well in semi autos unless it is tuned to those shells specifically.
Aamdskeetshooter
Ultimate Member
LOL! My guess is you were shooting full power "magnum" loads. Try shooting some light target loads next time. Some of the defensive semi-auto shotguns don't reliably feed them but they don't kick like a mule either.
linkstate
Ultimate Member
I agree with the above.
You say you want to get into shotguns and list three arguably niche defensive/tactical options.
I’d be curious what type of shotgun you tried and what load.
Learning to shoot a shotgun well, without pain can be a steep learning curve. There are so many factors including stance, mount, fit, recoil pad, load used, etc. Even then, with stout loads, they still aren’t fun after awhile but at least you have the fundamentals to handle a low round count in a hunting or defensive situation. Tactics and all that aside.
A fun way to familiarize yourself with a shotgun is to take a class at a trap and skeet range. Then move to a more defense use as you gain some experience.
I’m just a casual clay shooter but it took awhile for it to click for me. I claim no expertise especially in a defensive/tactical setting.
You say you want to get into shotguns and list three arguably niche defensive/tactical options.
I’d be curious what type of shotgun you tried and what load.
Learning to shoot a shotgun well, without pain can be a steep learning curve. There are so many factors including stance, mount, fit, recoil pad, load used, etc. Even then, with stout loads, they still aren’t fun after awhile but at least you have the fundamentals to handle a low round count in a hunting or defensive situation. Tactics and all that aside.
A fun way to familiarize yourself with a shotgun is to take a class at a trap and skeet range. Then move to a more defense use as you gain some experience.
I’m just a casual clay shooter but it took awhile for it to click for me. I claim no expertise especially in a defensive/tactical setting.
OMG, they look so scary and would probably shoot you just for spite.
- Aug 17, 2011
- 26,177
EAA/Girsan 312 Tac (basically a M2 clone iirc) - bought one a whim, it’s actually a pretty good semi-auto that does reliably run on low brass. Aftermarket Extended mag tube I added, 9 +1 shell capacity.
Pretty easy on the shoulder too, just a thought.
Pretty easy on the shoulder too, just a thought.
No why would you think that, No feeding issues no Magnum loads I just didn't like it.
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I just listed some shotguns I found cheap because as I said I wanted to get into them. So I didn't know anything about them, I wasn't scared away from them. My son is an instructor. It's just not for me doesn't fit my lifestyle at all thanks for your interest
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The three basic shotguns I would consider ahead of all others are:
Remington 870 (any flavor)
Mossberg 590 (any flavor)
Benelli Nova
They are all entry level shotguns that are relatively inexpensive and very reliable. My first shotgun was a Remington 870 Police Magnum that I bought off gunbroker a long time ago. There are threads floating around here for used models of the above 3. I might recommend trying that as it will save you some money.
[EDIT]Of the above 3, I only own the Remington, but was thinking of trying out the Benelli since it is being sold here for $310 used with a longer tube (more rounds can be loaded) and ghost sights. I am a little put off by the shipping - considering that and the transfer fee, there isn't much savings from new which is why I haven't bought it.
[EDIT x 2]I found a brand new model without the extended tube and without ghost sights for $310 shipped with taxes. You will still need to pay the transfer fee at the local FFL.
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