SBR and SRS ruling by MSP

[teratos]

Good news for many on this thread. A few pieces of info from an inside source. It is currently the understanding within MSP that the Grandfather clause applies to the 3/20 advisory. More specifically, pre 10/1 lowers may be SBR'ed under Form 1 without concern for OAL requirements. In addition, pre 10/1 Form 4 are good to go.

Need it in writing, or we will just assume it is April 1.

 

[HumbleEinstein]

Need it in writing, or we will just assume it is April 1.

It is already written into the law. You're never going to get an advisory spelling it out. The best confirmation is to just test it in practice.

 

[erwos]

Does your inside source tell us whether SBRs are ever considered ALGs?

 

[teratos]

It is already written into the law. You're never going to get an advisory spelling it out. The best confirmation is to just test it in practice.

Not meaning to be argumentative, but testing it in practice is not the greatest option. It isn't specifically written into the law. The law says nothing under 29". If you are wrong, or if some trooper/prosecutor gets a bug up their ass, it can be very expensive. FWIW, I view it the same way. The pre-10/1 stuff can be made into whatever you want.

 

[clandestine]

It is already written into the law. You're never going to get an advisory spelling it out. The best confirmation is to just test it in practice.

I named my source. Do you even own a form 1/4 weapon?

 

[Inigoes]

Not meaning to be argumentative, but testing it in practice is not the greatest option. It isn't specifically written into the law. The law says nothing under 29". If you are wrong, or if some trooper/prosecutor gets a bug up their ass, it can be very expensive. FWIW, I view it the same way. The pre-10/1 stuff can be made into whatever you want.

This one is easy to test. It's called a form 1, which is a permission slip (nothing is built yet) to get the MSP to sign off on.

 

[HumbleEinstein]

I'm not sure if they intend to strictly define them as ALGs. I didn't address this issue, but my sense is that they can because it is not hard to classify something as a "copy."

However, this probably isn't news but, I have confirmation that post 10/1 SBRs can be copycats. For instance, you can SBR a post 10/1 AR15 HBAR, but it will need to meet the OAL requirement.

THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE

 

[HumbleEinstein]

I named my source. Do you even own a form 1/4 weapon?

I'm not naming my source, out of respect for the source. You can disregard everything said, if you wish. Just trying to be helpful.

I don't own any Form 1/4 at the moment, but that doesn't really have any bearing on what I'm saying. For the time being, all I have are future plans for a couple Form 1s and other priorities.

 

[HumbleEinstein]

Not meaning to be argumentative, but testing it in practice is not the greatest option. It isn't specifically written into the law. The law says nothing under 29". If you are wrong, or if some trooper/prosecutor gets a bug up their ass, it can be very expensive. FWIW, I view it the same way. The pre-10/1 stuff can be made into whatever you want.

There is no issue with anyone getting a "bug up their ass." All you have to do is file an application and see what happens.

The grandfather clause is written into the law. That's all you need as long as you satisfy its parameters.

THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE

 

[teratos]

This one is easy to test. It's called a form 1, which is a permission slip (nothing is built yet) to get the MSP to sign off on.

There is no issue with anyone getting a "bug up their ass." All you have to do is file an application and see what happens.

The grandfather clause is written into the law. That's all you need as long as you satisfy its parameters.

THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE

I don't doubt you will still be able to make a SBR > 29", and for most AR's that is what people will build. It will be interesting to see what happens when people submit Form 1's for SBR's < 29". Also, I am skeptical of being able to build a SBR with all of the evil features. Post 10/1, I don't think you will be able to make a SBR with a folding stock. When you send in the Form 1 or Form 4, it only give the length of the gun with the stock extended/unfolded. It doesn't take into account flash suppressors, or folding stocks. These were made illegal without exception.

Recall, we recently found out that MSP will be treating SBRs as both a rifle and a handgun. Whatever suits their agenda. I don't believe they will be OK with turning an HBAR into a SBR with a folding stock, flash hider, and non-HBAR barrel.

 

[HumbleEinstein]

I don't doubt you will still be able to make a SBR > 29", and for most AR's that is what people will build. It will be interesting to see what happens when people submit Form 1's for SBR's < 29". Also, I am skeptical of being able to build a SBR with all of the evil features. Post 10/1, I don't think you will be able to make a SBR with a folding stock. When you send in the Form 1 or Form 4, it only give the length of the gun with the stock extended/unfolded. It doesn't take into account flash suppressors, or folding stocks. These were made illegal without exception.

Recall, we recently found out that MSP will be treating SBRs as both a rifle and a handgun. Whatever suits their agenda. I don't believe they will be OK with turning an HBAR into a SBR with a folding stock, flash hider, and non-HBAR barrel.

In your scenario, the critical question is if it's a pre or post 10/1 receiver. That will make the difference.

THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE

 

[Inigoes]

All the people who filed Form 1s around 10/1 for the MSP signoffs should be getting written feedback soon.

 

[LeadSled1]

So with pre-10/1 lowers and previously having owned handguns and regulated firearms do I need a HQL now to submit a form 1?

 

[aaronn]

I'm not sure if they intend to strictly define them as ALGs. I didn't address this issue, but my sense is that they can because it is not hard to classify something as a "copy."

However, this probably isn't news but, I have confirmation that post 10/1 SBRs can be copycats. For instance, you can SBR a post 10/1 AR15 HBAR, but it will need to meet the OAL requirement.

THIS IS NOT LEGAL ADVICE

Would the same apply to a post 10/1 9mm AR? Can it be a copycat too?

 

[teratos]

Would the same apply to a post 10/1 9mm AR? Can it be a copycat too?

It can be a copycat.

 

[Maverick0313]

I don't doubt you will still be able to make a SBR > 29", and for most AR's that is what people will build. It will be interesting to see what happens when people submit Form 1's for SBR's < 29". Also, I am skeptical of being able to build a SBR with all of the evil features. Post 10/1, I don't think you will be able to make a SBR with a folding stock. When you send in the Form 1 or Form 4, it only give the length of the gun with the stock extended/unfolded. It doesn't take into account flash suppressors, or folding stocks. These were made illegal without exception.

Recall, we recently found out that MSP will be treating SBRs as both a rifle and a handgun. Whatever suits their agenda. I don't believe they will be OK with turning an HBAR into a SBR with a folding stock, flash hider, and non-HBAR barrel.

Agreed.

 

[Drew1340]

this thread should be dropped, any more questioning of this whole sbr sbs will only result in further definition of what md will say is no longer acceptable and lead to eventual confiscation or some other ridiculous ******** Maryland wants to do....
don't ask questions you don't want answers to this is something I learned when I was very young obviously a few of you haven't learned that... I don't care if you want answers on sbrs if no one demanded a damn ruling it would have been fine in the gray areas....

 

[Inigoes]

You guys are forgetting that there is a lawsuit going on.

The more the MSP makes ridiculous assertions, the better the SB281 nonesense will be struck down.

 

[Klunatic]

You guys are forgetting that there is a lawsuit going on.

The more the MSP makes ridiculous assertions, the better the SB281 nonesense will be struck down.

This

Let them tie themselves in knots and put it in writing. The 1st thing you do in when in a court case is, shut up. Obviously, MSP doesn't understand this.

 

[clandestine]

The MSP has shut up about certain things. They answered my OAL question but ignored all of my HBAR questions. There's a reason for that and I know there's other things going g on behind the curtain.

Those who say its no big deal are of no consequence to me because THEY, nor their biased advice will save my ass if the State goes after me for FSA2013 violations. The law is screwy and vague and needs to be clarified. Ill ask questions and help however I can but I won't be the martyr for anyone.