RIA 1911 problems

[phil]

This is the A1 Tactical model from the big group buy last year.
Is anyone else having problems with their gun or am i only lemon in the bunch? The problem is failure to feed.

Right from day one it would FTF the top round in a full mag. Then starting failing up to 50% of the time; first round, anywhere in the middle, last round, didn't matter.
I'm using Winchester and Federal 230gr, ball ammo.
Tried a mag from a friends 1911 with the same results.

The Mag would not latch up tight against the bottom of the well. Very noticeable looseness especially compared to other guns.

The round is nosing down in the feeding process so it's perpendicular to the feed ramp when it makes contact. Sometimes after the first FTF I can smack the bottom of the mag and it will chamber the round. but not always. Slingshoting the slide hammers the bullet into the shell.

After 300 - 400 rounds without improvement I sent it back to Amscor with a detailed report on the problem.

Per the report returned with the gun, they:
cleaned it,
replaced the recoil spring - it is a much stronger spring
replaced the mag latch - the very noticeable looseness is much reduced
tuned it - no detail on what that is
and finally lubed it - it was dripping oil all over inside.

It is functioning better but still not really right. Still having a problem feeding the first round but it will cycle the balance of the mag without a problem.
My son-in-law today polished the feed ramp to a mirror finish. After 3-4 mags it started acting up again.

On the one hand I don't want to send it back to Armscor again since they didn't fix it the first time, but it is under warranty so I don't want to spend my own money taking it to a local gunsmith. I'm not totally opposed to the having it worked on locally if any of you can recommend someone who really knows 1911's.

Looking for possible solutions / options/ suggestions on where to go from here.
Thanks

 

[PJDiesel]

What brand mags are you using? Ever tried another besides the one time. Tried a Wilson Combat?

 

[jawn]

What mags are you using? A lot of 1911 problems are lube, ammo, or mag related.

 

[BradMacc82]

Specifically what type of magazines have you tried already? - Seems to be the easiest fix, but I'm not a gunsmith.

McCormick and Wilson Combat have been good mags in my limited time with 1911's in general, so if you haven't tried those, may want to.

Hopefully you can get some good idea's before this thread goes to hell - since it involves a 1911, that means it inevitably will go to hell.

 

[Deep Creek Rock]

Out of curiosity - is the mag giving issues an 8 round, or 7 round capacity ?

 

[Bart_man]

This is the A1 Tactical model from the big group buy last year.
Is anyone else having problems with their gun or am i only lemon in the bunch? The problem is failure to feed.

Right from day one it would FTF the top round in a full mag. Then starting failing up to 50% of the time; first round, anywhere in the middle, last round, didn't matter.
I'm using Winchester and Federal 230gr, ball ammo.
Tried a mag from a friends 1911 with the same results.

The Mag would not latch up tight against the bottom of the well. Very noticeable looseness especially compared to other guns.

The round is nosing down in the feeding process so it's perpendicular to the feed ramp when it makes contact. Sometimes after the first FTF I can smack the bottom of the mag and it will chamber the round. but not always. Slingshoting the slide hammers the bullet into the shell.

After 300 - 400 rounds without improvement I sent it back to Amscor with a detailed report on the problem.

Per the report returned with the gun, they:
cleaned it,
replaced the recoil spring - it is a much stronger spring
replaced the mag latch - the very noticeable looseness is much reduced
tuned it - no detail on what that is
and finally lubed it - it was dripping oil all over inside.

It is functioning better but still not really right. Still having a problem feeding the first round but it will cycle the balance of the mag without a problem.
My son-in-law today polished the feed ramp to a mirror finish. After 3-4 mags it started acting up again.

On the one hand I don't want to send it back to Armscor again since they didn't fix it the first time, but it is under warranty so I don't want to spend my own money taking it to a local gunsmith. I'm not totally opposed to the having it worked on locally if any of you can recommend someone who really knows 1911's.

Looking for possible solutions / options/ suggestions on where to go from here.
Thanks

Here is the Details of what was done to mine

http://www.mdshooters.com/showpost.php?p=1298924&postcount=169
here is the result.

 

[BradMacc82]

If it's factory issue mag, I believe that should be an 8 rounder, could be mistaken though.

 

[clandestine]

Hard to say without seeing a picture of the actual malfunction or examing the 1911 in person.

RIA's have crappy springs IMO. A new 18.5# Recoil Spring will help. Many of the ones they use are lighter than 16# in my experience. Some ramp/mouth/throating work and some Extractor Tuning will make it run like a champ unless theres something wrong with the Slide or Frame. In my experience the biggest culprit with RIA's or any finnicky 1911 is the Extractor tension and contour. Next is the recoil spring/guiderod assy, lastly would be the ramp/mouth/throat.

I just read what Armscor did, so it sounds like it could be something more going one, but I cant say without seeing it. The home polishing was likely a bad idea. More 1911's get ruined by people doing that and now knowing tolerances and angles.

I dont charge to examine potential work, it will take me about 15 mins to tera it down and take a look at it and tell you what I think. If you decide to use me reliability work the cost starts at $125.00 for the labor if no parts are needed. Customer should provide ammo to save shop ammo test fire costs.

Just a FYI, WWB is not great .45 ammo, I would try something like Magtech, Federal, etc......

 

[NathanJ]

Probably need the extractor tuned and a slight polish on the frame

 

[Indiana Jones]

Hard to say without seeing a picture of the actual malfunction or examing the 1911 in person.

RIA's have crappy springs IMO. A new 18.5# Recoil Spring will help. Many of the ones they use are lighter than 16# in my experience. Some ramp/mouth/throating work and some Extractor Tuning will make it run like a champ unless theres something wrong with the Slide or Frame. In my experience the biggest culprit with RIA's or any finnicky 1911 is the Extractor tension and contour. Next is the recoil spring/guiderod assy, lastly would be the ramp/mouth/throat.

I just read what Armscor did, so it sounds like it could be something more going one, but I cant say without seeing it. The home polishing was likely a bad idea. More 1911's get ruined by people doing that and now knowing tolerances and angles.

I dont charge to examine potential work, it will take me about 15 mins to tera it down and take a look at it and tell you what I think. If you decide to use me reliability work the cost starts at $125.00 for the labor if no parts are needed. Customer should provide ammo to save shop ammo test fire costs.

Just a FYI, WWB is not great .45 ammo, I would try something like Magtech, Federal, etc......

The spring chad mentioned fixed mine as soon as he put it in. I was having problems with feeding after a refinishing job with it. A tiny little ramp polish/clean up of excess park, and new spring and it has worked like a charm ever since.

 

[Mooseman]

Are these common problems with the RIAs? I was thinking about getting one but this may change my mind.

 

[Indiana Jones]

Are these common problems with the RIAs? I was thinking about getting one but this may change my mind.

Not really sure. As far as my problem, it worked great and 100% until I refinished it and ditched the duracoat. After chad tweaked it, it's worked great. For the money they are very good. Never needed TLC until I messed with it.

 

[clandestine]

Are these common problems with the RIAs? I was thinking about getting one but this may change my mind.

Its something you have to be conscious of unless you want to spend $1600 or more on a 1911 IMHO. The only other recomendation I can make is buy the gun from a shop with a reputable Gunsmith that stands behind their sales.

If Scotts sells a 1911 we will make the gun right on our dime. We stock as many 1911's as we can. I do all the warranty work most of the time because Im do alot of the pistol work there.

If you have $500-$600 get an American Classic or Taurus (RIA is my 3rd choice), for a Grand get a Smith and Wesson, if you have $1600 get a Les Baer.

Odds of a Les Baer needing work is slim, odds of a S&W needing minor work is likely like 1/10, odds of a American Classic needing minor work is 1/10, Taurus and RIA have about 1/5 needing minor work. These are just off the cuff estimates.

 

[Dino]

If you have $500-$600 get an American Classic or Taurus (RIA is my 3rd choice), for a Grand get a Smith and Wesson, if you have $1600 get a Les Baer.

Odds of a Les Baer needing work is slim, odds of a S&W needing minor work is likely like 1/10, odds of a American Classic needing minor work is 1/10, Taurus and RIA have about 1/5 needing minor work. These are just off the cuff estimates.

I'm surprised to see Taurus mentioned.
And why no love for Springfield Armory?

 

[clandestine]

Im glad we arent fighting on the issue, but I think you are misrepresenting my
position on 1911's.

To be clear, I have never claimed RIA was even close to being a Baer. My 1911 advice always is based off a potential buyers budget and what I see that works best within those budget paramaters. I usually group ceratin brands into categories of price and amounts of issues I see with each brand.

Its why I give Springers, Paras, Colts, and Kimbers a hard time, its not because they will explode or fall apart, its because for a 1K pistol they should not need to be tuned IMO in that price range.

Not every Kimber, Springer, Colt, or Para needs attention but 1K is ALOT of money for many gun consumers. All it would take is 15 mins with a skilled laborer at a fadtory to address these tweaks. In the manual they can say what brands of mags, lube, and ammo that are suggested and 99% of the problems with these guns would vanish.

I just try to inform people on what I see with various brands. I percieve "value" in a gun with several things in mind. I dont consider a gun a "value" if new gun owner has a $1600 budget and buys a Les Baer and now has no money for training, extra Mags, Gun Care/Range Gear, and Ammunition. While the gun may never need work and will have outstanding accuracy it isnt the best advice I can give. If a person has that same budget I can tell them to buy a S&W 1911 and a case of ammo and some instruction. For that same budget they can but a American Classic from a Smith that supports the sale they have less to worry about, yet they can afford a good set of leather, some spare mags, a case of ammo, some instruction and gun care. Once they become confident with the gun its has solid bones to upgrade the FCG, Barrel and Sights.

There has to be a balance of what peoples budget is and what works best within that budget, and how much experience the consumer has when I suggest something. Im not like this with just 1911's, Im the same way with Shotguns, AR15's, AK's, Battle Rifles, Polymer Handguns, Revolvers, etc.....

Im not here to sell out on a certain brand or manufacturer. My recomendations evolve/change constantly as manufacturers improve their lines or if they decrease in quality. I simply relay what I see at a work bench and when live firing weapons to people interested in hearing the from someone whos not trying to be a saleman or a fan. Im just someone trying to be helpful and honest.

The only thing I put out when I discuss 1911s that can be remotely self selling is that if someone gets a 1911 from my employer I fix it for free regardless if its a $400.00 1911 or a $4000.00 1911. To clarify, I make no money or comission off that recomendation, Im an hourly employee and it make no difference to me if I have 100 AK's or 100 1911's in front of me for repair or custom work.

 

[clandestine]

I'm surprised to see Taurus mentioned.
And why no love for Springfield Armory?

I see very few Taurus 1911's for issues and for $300 cheaper than a Comparable Springer, they are better finished to many Springers with the same features. The fitting and finish work on Taurus 1911's are very good to the price.

I believe both are made in Brazil unless its a Springer Custom Shop/TRP gun.

Both guns ahve a lifetime warranty but my experience with both guns tells me youll likely use the Springer Warranty before the Taurus.

Before anyone has a cow, Im NOT saying ALL Taurus guns are great. Im saying the do a good job with 1911's. They also do a good job with Beretta Clones as well. Im not much of a fan of any other Taurus Products though from my experiences with them.

 

[hairba111]

Maybe somebody forgot to click "Submit Reply".

 

[phil]

Just got back to the computer after Walking Dead and laundry, etc.
Thanks for all the feed back. Some answers to your questions.

I'm using RIA supplied mags, single stack, 8 round. Don't recall the friends brand of mag that I tried. I've heard here and else where that mags can be a problem. I assumed that related to using "other" brand mags in your gun. Why wouldn't a gun run with the factory supplied mags?

Between Winchester and Federal value pack stuff it seems to like the Winchester better but not much.

Don't know the strength of the replaced spring but it is very much stronger than the original.

The polishing done was with a Dremel felt wheel and jeweler's rouge. I really doubt any angles or tolerances changed.

 

[Magnumite]

The rounds are stalling horizontally at the bottom of the feedramp. Getting the round higher on the feedramp is what is needed.

First, lock the slide back and look at the feedramp. If the bottom of the feedramp is well above the bottom of the slide stop "window" in the frame, you may need have the feedramp recut. You will probably see bullet metal at the front magwell wall just where it meets the bottom of the feedramp. I am suggesting you NOT do anything to the feedramp if you observe those indicators, cutting the angle and final depth is a critical step, but something to look at. Get a pro to do it if that is observed. A set of calipers and some measurements would shed some more light on that issue.

The looseness of the mag in the magwell was indicated as being improved but you mentioned you can still get it to feed by smacking the bottom of the mag sometimes. RIA probably used one of their own mag catches which is probably closer to blue print. You'd be surprised how the mag catch ledge vertical position varies on the mag catches out there. You may consider an EGW mag catch. They sell one that holds the mag .020" higher than blue print and does help. If your feedramp is cut shallow, this may help you out. The EGW mag catches are made very close to size of the cuts in the frame, so it will need to be carefully fitted, it is not a drop in.

 

[jimbobborg]

I've noticed with my particular RIA that the magazine it comes with is okay with FMJs but won't feed JHPs. I put a Wilson magazine in and it feeds FMJs and JHPs reliably. I noticed the feed angle with the RIA mag is lower than the Wilson's. Ditch the crap RIA mag and get some better mags, the problem should go away.