Just what is . . .

[zoostation]

With one stipulation...

Most of this "carries a sentence >2 years thus making you a prohibited person" crap only applies within the confines of this sorry-ass state. A person who decides to move from Maryland to America; Virginia, Texas, Utah, etc will most likely find that they are no longer be a prohibited person... It's amazing how that works!

Actually, while I agree with the sentiment the laws here suck, you would still likely be prohibited. Federal standard is greater than a 1 year potential sentence.

 

[swinokur]

That would be Charliefoxtrot.

 

[tc617]

Actually, while I agree with the sentiment the laws here suck, you would still likely be prohibited. Federal standard is greater than a 1 year potential sentence.

I know one thing that we can all agree on... Maryland law is so @$&! up when given any legal question you can get 10 different interpretations depending on who you ask.

 

[2SAM22]

Actually, while I agree with the sentiment the laws here suck, you would still likely be prohibited. Federal standard is greater than a 1 year potential sentence.

Zoo, except state designated misdemeanors with a maximum of 2 years or less. Anything carrying penalty of more than 2 years is prohibiting nationwide.

Legal references in my earlier post.

Telephone misuse in MD carries 3 years IIRC. Craziness.

 

[BadLuckAintNoCrime]

Brother-in-law got popped in baltimore with one in his car that he kept for defense and a week later got his front door kicked in, all his guns taken, and cant own one again. I feel for him but at the same time I don't

 

[iH8DemLibz]

Ever?

 

[93confirmedkills]

Just don't do it. It's not worth losing your right completely.

 

[Pinecone]

The instructions for 11C that states, "...is not prohibited from purchasing, receiving, or possessing a firearm if: (1) under the law of the jurisdiction where the conviction occurred, the person has had been pardoned, the conviction has been expunged or set aside... Persons subject to this exception should answer "no" to 11.c. or 11.i., as applicable."

http://www.mdcourts.gov/courtforms/joint/ccdccr072br.pdf



So after the conditions of PBJ has been satisfied, three years later it is expunged.

ONE MORE TIME< the post I was replying to was NOTHING ABOUT PBJ.

With one stipulation...

Most of this "carries a sentence >2 years thus making you a prohibited person" crap only applies within the confines of this sorry-ass state. A person who decides to move from Maryland to America; Virginia, Texas, Utah, etc will most likely find that they are no longer be a prohibited person... It's amazing how that works!

READ WHAT I WAS REPLYING TO.

 

[Squaregrouper]

Interesting, is there a lawyer in the house?

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Charliefoxtrot is a MD lawyer, and a gun guy. Not quite sure why everyone who is not an attorney is arguing with him.
"Alex, I'll take Maryland attorney for PBJ please"

 

[Armati]

Charliefoxtrot is a MD lawyer, and a gun guy. Not quite sure why everyone who is not an attorney is arguing with him.
"Alex, I'll take Maryland attorney for PBJ please"

Yeah, I get that, but RoadDawg makes an interesting point, and they both could be right. In other words, the Court may clear you, and at the same time, the MSP could still declare you a prohibited person despite the Courts position. I was just looking for clarification on this.

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[ShoreShooter]

Irony:

1) "Ignorance of the law is no excuse."

2) Very bright and well informed people here can't agree on what the law is.

And that is the state of things in the world we now live in.

 

[RoadDawg]

Yeah, I get that, but RoadDawg makes an interesting point, and they both could be right. In other words, the Court may clear you, and at the same time, the MSP could still declare you a prohibited person despite the Courts position. I was just looking for clarification on this.

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This is exactly the issue...

Now... IF (and that is a huge IF) our resident attorney can get PBJ ruled as a "set aside conviction" in open court... THEN the MDSP and the AG would be forced by law to see it that way, and it would be covered under existing law as such.

The instructions for 11C that states, "...is not prohibited from purchasing, receiving, or possessing a firearm if: (1) under the law of the jurisdiction where the conviction occurred, the person has had been pardoned, the conviction has been expunged or set aside... Persons subject to this exception should answer "no" to 11.c. or 11.i., as applicable."

However, it is not that way currently. They still view it as a conviction for the purpose of determining whether or not to allow the transfer.

 

[RoadDawg]

Charliefoxtrot is a MD lawyer, and a gun guy. Not quite sure why everyone who is not an attorney is arguing with him.
"Alex, I'll take Maryland attorney for PBJ please"

Alex... I'll take experience for a $1000.00.

Been there and watched it happen in open court... And seen the LEOs lose their jobs to a more than twenty year old PBJ ruling.

Can't be a LEO if you can't carry a firearm.

 

[CharlieFoxtrot]

Probation before judgment is not a "conviction," and a person who receives probation before judgment is not convicted of the crime for which he has been found guilty, unless the person violates the probation order and a court enters a judgment on the finding of guilt. Thus the law enforcement officer has not been "convicted of a felony" within the meaning of Art. 27, § 730(c) (now § 3-107 of the Public Safety Article) when that officer has been found guilty of a felony but granted probation before judgment. Jones v. Baltimore City Police Dep't, 326 Md. 480, 606 A.2d 214 (1992)

Probation before judgment is not conviction of the crime for which the person has been found guilty. Myers v. State, 303 Md. 639, 496 A.2d 312 (1985).

The exception pertaining to firearms is where the PBJ is for a "crime of violence" or a "domestic related" crime. Read PS 5-101 (b-1). Also where people get confused is there are some prohibitions that kick in if you've ever been "found guilty" or "plead guilty" to an offense. A PBJ will not fix this since a finding or plea is required before you can get to the PBJ

And seen the LEOs lose their jobs to a more than twenty year old PBJ ruling.

Doesn't make sense since you can expunge the PBJ after three years unless you get an intervening conviction for something else. The law clearly states that any crime that's been expunged isn't a prohibition. (PS 5-101(b-1)(2)(ii).

That's all I'm saying about this. You can choose to accept my posts based on 24 years of experience practicing criminal law in Maryland or not.

 

[Armati]

The exception pertaining to firearms is where the PBJ is for a "crime of violence" or a "domestic related" crime.

And am I to understand that in MD, "crime of violence" means felony violent crime? In other words, misdemeanor 2nd degree assault is not "a crime of violence"?



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[RoadDawg]

The exception pertaining to firearms is where the PBJ is for a "crime of violence" or a "domestic related" crime. Read PS 5-101 (b-1). Also where people get confused is there are some prohibitions that kick in if you've ever been "found guilty" or "plead guilty" to an offense. A PBJ will not fix this since a finding or plea is required before you can get to the PBJ



Doesn't make sense since you can expunge the PBJ after three years unless you get an intervening conviction for something else. The law clearly states that any crime that's been expunged isn't a prohibition. (PS 5-101(b-1)(2)(ii).

That's all I'm saying about this. You can choose to accept my posts based on 24 years of experience practicing criminal law in Maryland or not.

Your cited case is from a 1985 court opinion... And predates the current legal opinion of the AG and MDSP on the matter. It also does not reflect changes in Federal Laws with regard to Domestic Violence related PBJ.

I really do respect your opinion on the matter. However, I have seen what was and what is... Therefore, I must accept what is. Please cite a current/recent case wherein the person recieved a PBJ (for a disqualifying offense) AND has been "NOT DISAPPROVED" for transfer of a firearm in Maryland.

I would love to see it work that way... But I have seen it ruled otherwise in my 24 years of enforcing laws in Maryland.

This is not personal... I offered a suggestion in a prior post (#72) that may remedy the problem.


BTW: One person who lost his carry and job was a coworker who took a PBJ to keep the case from dragging on... 22 years before the Federal Domestic Violence law was enacted.

 

[swinokur]

And am I to understand that in MD, "crime of violence" means felony violent crime? In other words, misdemeanor 2nd degree assault is not "a crime of violence"?



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MD 5-101 definitions

see no. 3
.
.

 

[Armati]

MD 5-101 definitions

see no. 3
.
.

Caveat being a sentence longer than 1 year?

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[swinokur]

Both classes of assault have a penalty of more than a year, therefore you become a prohibited person.

I think the penalties are 10 and 25 years respectively.

 

[Armati]

Both classes of assault have a penalty of more than a year, therefore you become a prohibited person.

I think the penalties are 3 and 25 years respectively. But needs to be verified.

Funny, because just using the Googles, the GA website has Para 14-101 showing on assault 1 as does the DPSCS website. Assault 2 is not listed as a "crime of violence".

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