Gun search question at traffic stop based on NRA sticker

[swinokur]

LE is free to ask to search.

You're free to refuse.

 

[pbharvey]

I almost always have a few random cartridges and sometimes an unloaded magazine in my truck. There's also various safety glasses and ear plugs stashed in different compartments - I guess I could make the case that I'm a target shooter. I wonder if I ended up in a search and told them I didn't have guns but they found ammo if I would get the whole Walking Tall truck dismemberment treatment?

(When I know I'm going into DC I try and fish out the ammo)

 

[TheBert]

Yes it's legal we can ask you anything we want. You gave the officer a reason to stop you. Yes your sticker may have led to the police response. Is it right. I can't answer that not enough details.

Although it is legal, it should not be a common practice of pulling over people with just because they had a sitcker on their vehicle. The whole situation and others like it reeks of fishing for a felony.

 

[swinokur]

The OP said he had a tail light out. Perfectly OK for a stop.

 

[rseymorejr]

This reminds me of when I lived in Alabama. I was stopped at one of those "road block" checks for insurance etc, with an NRA sticker on my truck!
When I opened my wallet to get out my license the deputy saw my pistol permit and his only comment to me was "Oh, you got one of the new permits, they sure look better than the old ones"

That's all, no call for back up, no request to search, no trying to make me feel like a criminal.
Different culture I guess, I sure do miss it.

 

[SRD]

I wonder if the question of guns came up because msp ran the tag and not due to the sticker.

 

[good guy 176]

Those f... Howard county clowns need training. That Police chief, maybe he's been replaced by now, retiring I think I read recently, is a dufuss.

He's the same turd who had his officers jumping in front of high speed traffic on 29 and 32 (checking for seat belt compliance) and that procedure backfired on them big time a few years ago when one of his troopers stepped into traffic in front of a woman on 32 and she hit and killed him. I'd bring manslaughter charges against that bastard Chief over that one.

Where or where do we hatch these idiots?!?!

Lew--Ranger63
Unsafe, MD 20769...formerly Laurel but changed in 2008 by a 11-0 city council vote, in the midst of the invasion of Illegals that year, and we will never ever get rid of them.

 

[jkeiler]

The OP said he had a tail light out. Perfectly OK for a stop.

Perfectly ok for a stop. Not for an interrogation.

 

[swinokur]

LE can ask. You're free to be silent.

Nothing illegal here IMO.

IANAL or LE.

 

[Publius]

I had a similar event happen when i was delivering papers a few years back. I was pulled over, and asked if i would consent. i told them no. After calling in a K-9, they claimed he alerted (amusing because I'm strictly straight edge, no booze, nothing), and they pealed my truck open like a 3 month old rotten onion (small grateful dead sticker on the back window). Every possible item IN my car was dumped on the ground (which was great because they found my old deck of nudy cards i thought I'd lost). funny how they didn't search me. Judge was visibly annoyed and threw out all the BS paper they hung on me.

Calling the K-9 after you answered 'no' to a search seems like an old trick to bypass the lack of consent and create a probable cause that legally did not exist. A friend allerted me to this trick more than a decade ago after he was victim of it in another state. And they make you wait all the time in the world for the k-9 to further haras you. I would assume some lower courts would have ruled against this already. Maybe a lawyer here might know.

 

[redeemed.man]

It seems weird to me that MSP would pull you over since the ICC has its own little police force of maryland transportation authority police. I could see them ganging up because they have to be bored out of their minds policing that little road. I wonder if a group of MSP troopers were headed back together for shift change or something?

No stickers for me of any kind. Too many haters out there.

Did your NRA sticker say, "Stand and Fight"?

I love the ICC. It is like the autobahn when the MTAP aren't in sight.

 

[Fishguy]

Um no you can 't and or at least shouldn't unless there is reasonable suspicion of an offense or you need to for safety reasons. Busted tail light alone does not do that. Nor does NRA sticker which also raises 1st Am issue. If officer saw something in the car suspicious or that suggested driver might be armed that is different.

The officer can ask any question he wants, it is a free country. If you want to, you can tell him to pound sand or say nothing, that is your right as well.

 

[redeemed.man]

The officer can ask any question he wants, it is a free country. If you want to, you can tell him to pound sand or say nothing, that is your right as well.

The questions are usually presented as yes or no questions. I don't give yes or no answers.

"There is nothing illegal in here" is the standard answer.

 

[swinokur]

If the K9 alerts to possible contraband, IIRC the vehicle exception applies and the car be searched without a warrant. IANAL or LE BTW. I have no dog in this hunt. I guess a judge will decide what alert of the dog was PC.

Absent that, someone(LE) needs to articulate PC to obtain a warrant. As I said, IMO LE can stop you for a burned out light, and then ask you questions not relating to the original stop.

You are free to refuse to answer. I don't see anyone doing anything illegal in the OP's story.

IANAL or LE

 

[teratos]

Precisely why I don't have stickers. It's a sad day when you feel stickers could make you the target of profiling etc. because we all know hardened criminals and drug dealers run around with Gadsden stickers.

I have a Gadsden, MSI, and a gun logo "coexist". It's my 1A Right to advertise another fundamental right. I usually have some stray ammo in my car, but that would be the worst of it. Never been bothered when pulled over. Would never consent to a search.

My permit says I may carry "when transporting narcotics". I think it makes me the ideal drug-runner....

Perfectly ok for a stop. Not for an interrogation.

They can ask what they please. Action is an entirely different issue.

 

[jkeiler]

Based on the facts as presented by the OP--we don't have the cop's side--this is a problem. The cop can ask a fishing expedition question, as someone said has happened to them as in "got anything I should know about" although I have never been asked such a question though over the years stopped now and again for minor infractions, and I would say even this for a routine traffic stop for a tailight, is pushing it.

But if the cop is focusing on firearms because of a sticker, and calls in three other cars, that is intimidation and improper profiling. Suppose the OP had a bumper sticker supporting that 3d candidate for attorney general--forget her name--who supported legalizing pot. Could the cop have conducted an inquiry about drug possession and use based solely on that alone, called in for support, etc. Absolutely not, and if that were the case, you'd have people in the State up in arms. True, in neither case does the driver have to say a thing, but that doesn't make the cop's conduct correct.

It depends on the cop's actual motivation, what he/she saw, if anything, other than the sticker. But to interrogate based on the sticker, if that is what happened is improper, as is calling in an intimidating backup.

As for the poster who asked about driving to or from the range with a weapon, that is a whole different issue. The cop can inquire because it is a safety issue, for the cop, driver and bystanders. If you have gun case in the back seat, the cop can inquire, same with empty casings, etc. If the OP had something like this in the car in addition to the NRA sticker then the cop had grounds. If not, it was profiling based on an expressed political opinion which is improper.

 

[spclopr8tr]

This reminds me of when I lived in Alabama.

That is a world of difference. Alabama is in America.

 

[Redcobra]

This just fosters the "us versus them" state of mind.

 

[swinokur]

If I was a cop, I'd not give the reason for more questions as "I saw an NRA sticker". That would be wrong.

I'm guessing there'd be a ton of better explanations for a LEO to use to justify more questions.

 

[swinokur]

This just fosters the "us versus them" state of mind.

Indeed.