Future .308 Rifle: MA-TEN build or LMT MWSE?

[BradMacc82]

That is all.

 

[clandestine]

So now an opinion about accuracy and reliably come from behind a work bench not behind the gun on a live range. Guess I've wasted money on buying guns and shooting them.

I test fire the guns I work on and customize, some on the range some just for function depending on the work.

I convery what I see often, dont see often, what works, what dosent, what I like. You dont like me and thats fine but your dislike of me wont silence me, chase me off, or keep me from trying to help people make informed decisions.

 

[clandestine]

That is all.

There wont be any show from me.

 

[JeepDriver]

Low round count test firing isn't a way to judge a gun.

That's like renting a pistol and shooting 50 rounds then saying how great it is because it never jams. Not exactly a true representation of the guns over all performance. Spending a year and a few thousand rounds evaluating a gun and then an opinion is warranted.

 

[clandestine]

Low round count test firing isn't a way to judge a gun.

That's like renting a pistol and shooting 50 rounds then saying how great it is because it never jams. Not exactly a true representation of the guns over all performance. Spending a year and a few thousand rounds evaluating a gun and then an opinion is warranted.

I shoot alot and so do the people I do work for. Like I said what I do cant be learned by reading the internet. Try and marginalize my knowledge, experience, and abilities all you want but my expertise is broader then you like to think. Besides doing I.T. work for my primary employer, I am involved in a weapon program (Private Military Contractor). Ive been gunsmithng for a decade now. I can list my skills in detail in you like.

The guns I service that are social use weapons do get extensively shot by the end users. You really think the people I do work for dont take carbine classes or use them in 360 degree hostile scenarios? When or if they fail I hear about it.

I can go at this all day and night if you like but your not going to bait me like you buddy TZOID tried, and always lost at.

 

[sixfivesavage]

If you ever find yourself in White Marsh Arms for some reason, ask Jaime about mine. He about shit himself when he saw what it was capable of with Prvi 168. I think he did shit himself when the POI shift was less then 1/2" when I put the suppressor on.

If you ever want to test drive one let me know.

Think I know you...kinda. anyway, Jamie has one at the store with a 16 inch Chrome, I was going to buy it till I realized it wasn't a 20 inch stainless like I had asked him to get before. Turns out I can't realy swing that kinda cash at the moment so I'm grabbing the cqb from him next week. A buddy of mine has the mws with a 20 inch stainless and it shoots my m1a load sub moa all day long. They are wonderous weapons in my mind. Heavy bitch though

 

[JeepDriver]

So the fact is, you do not own the gun in question.

You are offering second hand information as your opinion.

You are making a claim that you built AR10 pattern rifles for a PMC that has taken them into a hostile environment and that is where your claim of accuracy and reliably is coming from.

Just trying to get the facts stright.

 

[clandestine]

So the fact is, you do not own the gun in question.

Nope, I dont personally own a LMT .308. I have worked on more than I can count though. Same goes for SR25's and other SR25/AR10 type weapons.

You are offering second hand information as your opinion.

Nope, Im offering my personal preferences based on what I have worked on and shot. If my work was bad they would have complained or returned.

You are making a claim that you built AR10 pattern rifles for a PMC that has taken them into a hostile environment and that is where your claim of accuracy and reliably is coming from.

I used the PMC comment and Gunsmithing experience to relate my first hand experience. Perhaps I should have worded is better so you wouldnt have a chance to try and change what I meant. The PMC's in question dont use AR10/SR25's. Again it was an example to show when I opine Im not regurgitating something I read from someone else, or am relaying from a single example in my collection. The guys I have do work for do on various platforms do use them in classes and training (The MEGA build list to be specific).

I have not tested them all side by side on the same day, but with factory loads such as Black Hills, Gold Match, Hornady,....the MEGA with a Noveske Barrel groups on par with a LMT, LaRue, Armalite, GAP, DPMS, ect....and often outshoot them. With the minor tweaks I do to the feed ramps and various areas they are also easier on the brass so the owner can have less work reworking the brass from damage. My .308 triggers feel better, and the actions are smoother. These tweaks can be done to any other .308 ar and are not something exclusive to the list I made up.

To some these things matter, to some it gives them an advantage, to some it dont. I put that info out there for people to consider and make a decision they are well equipped with info to make. No hard feelings if they dont pick my list or ask me a question.

 

[JeepDriver]

Well now I'm curious, you claim to have worked on more LMT's then you can count. What did you do to a rifle that is still under warranty? What do you do better then LMT ?

 

[clandestine]

Well now I'm curious, you claim to have worked on more LMT's then you can count. What did you do to a rifle that is still under warranty? What do you do better then LMT ?

I dont do anything better than LMT. I offer a personal touch, thats all. I can only say that ones that need some TLC, occasionaly end up in front of me, just like any other high end weapon, some need some tweaking. I also see high end guns from Colt, Daniel Defense, FN, Baer, Wilson, Nighthawk, Brown, SIG, HK, Knights, CZ, ect.... I dont claim to do anything better than they do either, I just fix or tune them when its needed.

For the LMT's it was Triggers that needed smoothing up, Feed Ramps causing feed issues on certain Projectiles. Rough areas eating up the Brass (Tough for Reloading), such as the Feed Ramps, Extractor, Locking Lugs, Magazines, Carriers, Ejection Port, and so forth. 2 Had accuracy issues but it could have been end users induced, the crowns were jacked, a quick recorwn, trigger smoothing and they were back in business knocking out ragged holes.

Mailing guns back isnt something many have the stomach for, its why they bring them to local shops with good reps, wether it be a Pistol, Revolver, Bolt Action, Carbine, Collectible, ect...to local smiths instead of using warranty work. Rugers, Glocks, Smith and Wessons, Tauruses, pretty much every quality manufacturer offers good warranties but the one I have experience with simply use a trusted smith to iron out details. I cant blame owners not wanting to ships guns considering the amount of trouble it is when your not a FFL. I have had my personal guns stolen when shipped and many shippers simply make it difficult.

 

[Jack Gordon]

I dont do anything better than LMT. I offer a personal touch, thats all. I can only say that ones that need some TLC, occasionaly end up in front of me, just like any other high end weapon, some need some tweaking. I also see high end guns from Colt, Daniel Defense, FN, Baer, Wilson, Nighthawk, Brown, SIG, HK, Knights, CZ, ect.... I dont claim to do anything better than they do either, I just fix or tune them when its needed.

For the LMT's it was Triggers that needed smoothing up, Feed Ramps causing feed issues on certain Projectiles. Rough areas eating up the Brass (Tough for Reloading), such as the Feed Ramps, Extractor, Locking Lugs, Magazines, Carriers, Ejection Port, and so forth. 2 Had accuracy issues but it could have been end users induced, the crowns were jacked, a quick recorwn, trigger smoothing and they were back in business knocking out ragged holes.

Mailing guns back isnt something many have the stomach for, its why they bring them to local shops with good reps, wether it be a Pistol, Revolver, Bolt Action, Carbine, Collectible, ect...to local smiths instead of using warranty work. Rugers, Glocks, Smith and Wessons, Tauruses, pretty much every quality manufacturer offers good warranties but the one I have experience with simply use a trusted smith to iron out details. I cant blame owners not wanting to ships guns considering the amount of trouble it is when your not a FFL. I have had my personal guns stolen when shipped and many shippers simply make it difficult.

Remember when you send a gun back to a manufacturer, do YOU know who is working on it. The answer is no. It may be the seasoned vet, but it also may be a rookies first day. Chad works on all my stuff and I know and trust him. He will make it right I know he will. Hell, he will even pull you in the back of that gay chocolate factory and show you how and why he's doing what he's doing. Will colt or lmt or lwrc do that? The answer is no. People that don't know as much as another get jealous easily and that seems like that's whats happening here. Don't take chad the wrong way, he only tries to be informative. He will tell me things I don't wanna hear too, sometimes late at night and i have a hard time getting to bed. But in the end he is always trying to help, don't get your feelings hurt.

 

[JeepDriver]

Remember when you send a gun back to a manufacturer, do YOU know who is working on it. The answer is no. It may be the seasoned vet, but it also may be a rookies first day. Chad works on all my stuff and I know and trust him. He will make it right I know he will. Hell, he will even pull you in the back of that gay chocolate factory and show you how and why he's doing what he's doing. Will colt or lmt or lwrc do that? The answer is no. People that don't know as much as another get jealous easily and that seems like that's whats happening here. Don't take chad the wrong way, he only tries to be informative. He will tell me things I don't wanna hear too, sometimes late at night and i have a hard time getting to bed. But in the end he is always trying to help, don't get your feelings hurt.

Do you know me ? I've seen his work, I'm unimpressed. This isn't the first time you've jumped in to protect you little friend.

Maybe if there was a decent smith locally I would use them for some things. Until then I'll buy quality guns and use out of state people.

 

[Markp]

What left you unimpressed?

I don't have a dog in this fight, but I know that it's not easy to do high quality work. It takes time, knowledge, and a lot of attention to detail. Chad certainly seems to have a fair bit of knowledge, I haven't seen his work though.

 

[boomboom929]

Is there an actual working model of this gun?

http://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=70019


This thing drives nails at 400 yds and is a dream to shoot.

 

[clandestine]

Do you know me ? I've seen his work, I'm unimpressed.

Name the work you have seen that so umimpressive.

Drilling and Tapping
Scope Mounting
Lathe Work/Barrel Contouring
Screw Head Repair
Milling/Sight Work
Polishing
Stippling/Checkering
Barrel Installing
Forging
Backboring
Honing
Chambering/Reaming
SLide Install
Fitting Safeties
Troubleshooting
Clearing Siezed Loaded Weapons
Knowing countless guns intimately and NOT needing Youtube or a Manual to Service/repair
Dehorn Work
Refinishing
Removing Seized Parts and Scews
Fire/Water and Rust Restoration
Enhancements for Disabled Veterans
Choke Tube Installation
Custom Modifications
Chop Jobs
Pillar Install
Soldering
Welding
Crowning
Trigger Job
Stock Work
Recoil Pads
Porting
Tmining Break Action and Revolvers
Threading
Ramp Work
Action Work
Heat Treating
Chamfering
Bedding
Floating
Engraving
Bead Install

 

[clandestine]

Remember when you send a gun back to a manufacturer, do YOU know who is working on it. The answer is no. It may be the seasoned vet, but it also may be a rookies first day. Chad works on all my stuff and I know and trust him. He will make it right I know he will. Hell, he will even pull you in the back of that gay chocolate factory and show you how and why he's doing what he's doing. Will colt or lmt or lwrc do that? The answer is no. People that don't know as much as another get jealous easily and that seems like that's whats happening here. Don't take chad the wrong way, he only tries to be informative. He will tell me things I don't wanna hear too, sometimes late at night and i have a hard time getting to bed. But in the end he is always trying to help, don't get your feelings hurt.

I didnt think about the personal aspect of it. Good point and thanks for the laugh about the gay.

 

[clandestine]

What left you unimpressed?

I don't have a dog in this fight, but I know that it's not easy to do high quality work. It takes time, knowledge, and a lot of attention to detail. Chad certainly seems to have a fair bit of knowledge, I haven't seen his work though.

From the day I joined the forum Jeepdriver has had issues with me. It was way before I started being more colorful. Hes tries to act like I dont know what Im doing and as soon as I answer his questions he moves along to something else vague or makes an attempt to insult, and when I answer that he tries another.

 

[Weber]

Love my MA-TEN!

 

[Markp]

Name the work you have seen that so umimpressive.

Drilling and Tapping

This is the only one I hear complaints about... most of it from women... but occasionally young men as well.

 

[clandestine]

This is the only one I hear complaints about... most of it from women... but occasionally young men as well.

Just dont drill it crooked, you can break your bit.