Experiences of False Information During CCW Training

[ToolAA]

Thanks for this thread. I've corrected a few folks who got serious misinformation.

Here's one of the worst.. "If you pull out your firearm, you better use it". (wrong on so many levels!)

Although serving in the military "could be" great experience they don't teach Maryland or civilian self-defense law. (at least not while I was in).

If your instructor said it exactly like that verbatim, then I agree it’s wrong. However, the statement “If you pull out your firearm, you better be prepared to use it”. Is more appropriate. In my opinion that means that the situation was one of immediate threat of serious harm. If the attacker ceases his attack then put it back when the threat is gone. However, things can escalate real fast once the firearm is out of the holster.

 

[John from MD]

Totally bad information. LEOs are not empowered to arrest people because they “think” a law was violated. It requires that they have, at minimum, a reasonable suspicion that a law was violated, AND that the person was the one who committed that violation.

The LEO must be able to articulate all of that BEFORE they can make an arrest. To do so, the LEO needs to know the basic particular laws which they are enforcing. Of course they may not be able to recite verbatim, code, and reference. But they damn sure need to know, not THINK they know, that a law was violated. If not, any arrests they make, may be deemed by the court to be a false arrest.

Two and a half decades, I never made an arrest based on what I “thought was a law”, or because I simply “thought that person was guilty”. And I don’t know of any real LEO who would risk being charged with a Civil Rights Violation to do so.

That was the biggest thing drilled into my head during training. The lawyers repeatedly reinforced the fact that people have rights and just because you have a badge doesn't change that.

 

[Biggfoot44]

If your instructor said it exactly like that verbatim, then I agree it’s wrong. However, the statement “If you pull out your firearm, you better be prepared to use it”. Is more appropriate. In my opinion that means that the situation was one of immediate threat of serious harm. If the attacker ceases his attack then put it back when the threat is gone. However, things can escalate real fast once the firearm is out of the holster.

This !

 

[Art3]

This thread has been terribly neglected, and content that should be here is being scattered throughout other less fitting threads.
...and why TF is no one naming names?!?!?

 

[safegunners]

Thought I'd start a interesting topic (at least for myself) about some of the blatant false information given out by instructors during your ccw course for MD?
Please don't take this as bashing all instructors because I know there are some great people out there supporting the cause. I'll list a few of mine from last week.

1) MD's ccw permit isn't recognized in any other state that's why you need our $150 extra AZ ccw package.
2) AZ permit is good for x number of states including SC, PA and Florida. I replied that SC, PA and FL don't accept non resident permits and you could get jammed up if caught carrying. Was told I was wrong! Yes MD does have recip with SC so you're good there!
3)Only one handgun every 30 days no way around it. I replied well or two at one purchase and wait 60 days or sign up for your designated collector and buy all you want. Was told not everyone qualifies to be a collector.

After this, I stfu and did the minimum needed to get the heck out of there with by qualification sheet.

Great post …


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[Diesel-Dad]

This thread has been terribly neglected, and content that should be here is being scattered throughout other less fitting threads.
...and why TF is no one naming names?!?!?

I think naming these places would really help people. Just my opinion.


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[Art3]

I think naming these places would really help people. Just my opinion.


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Sounds worth a shot to me

 

[Crosseye Dominant]

Sounds worth a shot to me

No, veterans must always take the highway. Think about walking a millersville in their shoes.

 

[Mark75H]

Sting approves (ex Police)

 

[Spaceballs]

My neighbor took a MD class over the weekend and learned that MD has a duty to retreat in your home and that you can't assume danger just because someone is kicking your door in at 3am.



He also learned that the firing pin block is the only safety device on a Glock....and that a Glock will immediately go off without a trigger pull if the pin block malfunctions.



Yeah. So....yeah.

My neighbor said the hardest part about the class was sitting there and keeping his mouth shut just to power through it and get his 16 hours.

 

[gtodave]

My neighbor said the hardest part about the class was sitting there and keeping his mouth shut just to power through it and get his 16 hours.

It's funny, in my experience when you call out someone like this, they'll typically backpeddle a LOT with something like: "Yeah well I knew a guy who it happened to once, so it's probably a thing" and when you push more with actual facts, they'll say something like "Well yeah that might be...."

Most of the people giving bad info are blow-hards that just want the attention of being the guy who gave someone radical advice that they will remember. It doesn't matter to them if it's true or not.

 

[Oswaldo87]

My guy in Louisiana 10+ years ago said his first choice and top recommendation is a Taurus 38 J frame revolver. Might have been the fudd mayor of that area. If an instructor engages in the “what if” game too often or at length with his students would be a red flag for me. A lot of the topics are fun to talk about but every situation is different. A perfectly good shoot or the messiest of civilian gun fights will be torn apart by the lawyers and DA. The basic carry course is all good to make you legal but I highly recommend further training to anyone who is just getting into the carry life.

 

[[Kev308]]

I got a good take down today. I just got back from the shooting range testing out a 22lr SP101 I bought a while back. The shooter a couple bays down from me must have been a regular at some point.

A guy walks in and the two of them start chatting. "haven't seen you in a while..." and so on. The shooter explains that he just got his CCW and the friend responds with, "congratulations! yeah I just became an instructor for CCW and HQL. What are you carrying?"

The shooter tells him the model and how he just came from a gun show in VA and bought two 17 round magazines for the pistol.

and then it happens......

"You know, you're only allowed to carry 10 rounds in MD?"
"What? I didn't know that. Wow."

I set down the revolver, and cleared the cylinder and butted in.
Me: "Hey, that's not true. You can carry more than 10 rounds."

Him: "I'm an instructor, trust me. You can't carry more that 10 rounds in MD."

Me: "There's some kind of law that you can't be carrying more than 10 rounds in the commission of a crime, but he's carrying legally so he should be GTG."

Him: "Wait right here, I'll go get the book and BRB."

At this point I went back to missing my targets and he came back with "the book" and didn't find it anywhere and took the L. After he left the shooter came up and thanked me and stated he should have known that if he's teaching classes. I agreed and said hopefully he hasn't taught many classes yet and we had a nice talk about different guns and practicing. I let him shoot one of my revolvers and wished him well and departed.

Thanks MDS for the knowledge.

 

[Mark75H]

Situation normal. NRA Basic Pistol Instructor class is not a prep class for MD W&C. Too many NRA TC's don't know the first thing about MD gun laws.