2017 SHED HORN HUNTING

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  • Doco Overboard

    Ultimate Member
    BANNED!!!
    Judge your breeding by when the horns start to drop, no hot does means hormone levels change and some start to cast. A whitetail buck will try to breed year round to a receptive doe, he doesn't have to have antlers to do it but the change will signal new antler growth and other changes as well. You will notice good bucks that are not declining will have more of a bony mass at the base to make way for larger horns, they will look like ball on a hip joint when they're near the top for size. Take notice for when the first fawns appear on your land and count back 220 some odd days to schedule your rut hunt. Take advantage of whatever weapon is pertinent for the season to score. Do not always go by established periods that are based on current seasons with a rut determination made from numbers checked in by telephone which can be misleading. I believe some forecasts are made using this method which is the easiest/ best tool that is available to our biologist use for management and the numbers occur by hunter density/ days in field and they do a pretty good job but don't beat all. This is based solely on 35 years experience and raiding DB-D's elaborate notebooks to make a hypothesis. See ESM proposed new deer regs and the subsequent rant that corresponds with it for more thought provocation. You can also bow shoot a doe on the last day and use what you find inside the to aid the study process. Remember to account for weather and geography interference from others during the note/map making process.
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    50,073
    After a lot of reading and close observations while in the field, I've come to rely on lunar cycles for being the most reliable indicators of doe estrus cycles and solar periods determining buck "rutting behavior". I put that in quotes because I think DoCo O is right when he states bucks are always ready to play. But, there are times when they are more ready than others.

    With bucks, it is the losing of daylight that fires off their aggressive need to reproduce driving them to a peak fervor somewhere between the first and second week of November.

    As far as does are concerned, the lunar cycle is the most influential factor in bringing them into estrus. That being the second full moon of the Autumn Equinox which occurs sometime in November, but can vary widely from year to year. And in there lies the rub. When you have the 'magic' full moon happen within the first two weeks of November, you will experience a perfect storm, if you will, where both parties hit their passions simultaneously. The earlier in November this happens, the hotter and quicker the mating occurs. I have witnessed this many times. One big contributing factor in all this is a good cold snap. That really seems to help get the does rolling.

    Now, on the other end of the spectrum, when the full or "rutting moon" hits later in the month say, after the 16th, things get a little more dragged out for what reasons, I do not know. The does estrus cycles seem to be more "spread out", happening in dribs and drabs rather than like in the beginning of the month where the rut explodes. This has a great effect on the bucks as well. They are all cranked up and ready by Nov. 1st. Unfortunately, the does are not. I like late ruts. The bucks tend to be on their feet during daylight hours for a longer period of time, constantly searching for that one doe. With early ruts it can happen so fast that you can experience two days of hot seeking and chasing and all of a sudden bam! Lock down. With most of the does peaking almost at the same time, a buck can go from one doe to the next in a given area without the need to cruise around searching for dates.

    This, for the last few years has been my guide for pursuing mature whitetail bucks. I may not kill a 'hammer' deer every year, but I can say with much certainty, I will at least be in a position to see the quality of deer I am seeking and usually give myself a decent opportunity to stick one.
     

    Doco Overboard

    Ultimate Member
    BANNED!!!
    100% about shorter daylight hours triggering the rut but in contrast to the moon bringing the does along i have always understood that the pheromones triggered by the shorter daylight and then deposited on rubs/ in scrapes is what in turn further triggers ovulation. Temperatures and weather for sure play in but by the time breeding comes in winter coats are on and cooler temperatures prevail for a active daylight chasing phase. Areas with a more warmer climate can certainly not produce a spike to breeding but a more longer duration with a less definitive peak. I never really counted on the moon to much because Ive seen it both ways but when the moon is visible during the day and its cold they're usually straight off for sure. Interesting stuff for sure, cant wait until next year already.
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    50,073
    100% about shorter daylight hours triggering the rut but in contrast to the moon bringing the does along i have always understood that the pheromones triggered by the shorter daylight and then deposited on rubs/ in scrapes is what in turn further triggers ovulation. Temperatures and weather for sure play in but by the time breeding comes in winter coats are on and cooler temperatures prevail for a active daylight chasing phase. Areas with a more warmer climate can certainly not produce a spike to breeding but a more longer duration with a less definitive peak. I never really counted on the moon to much because Ive seen it both ways but when the moon is visible during the day and its cold they're usually straight off for sure. Interesting stuff for sure, cant wait until next year already.

    Weather plays a big role in that when all things are right(time of year, moon phase, etc.), if it is too warm(above 45 degrees during the daylight hours), deer will do 90% of seeking-chasing-mating in the dark, when temps are lower. Winter coat or not, deer can't sweat, so heat plays a very big role in daytime rutting activity. During these warm periods at prime time rut, it is always a good tactic to 'stand' in lowland areas such as creek bottoms where temps are coolest.

    The spike question...More does are bred by spike(1.5 YO) bucks than any other age class. Anecdotally, I've witnessed this, but I've read this as well.

    As for the moon "over head", I am a firm believer in the "moon overhead" and "moon under foot" thing. Most critters are more active during these two periods. Most these animals have four feeding periods in a 24 hour span(well, sorta). Two major and two minor. The majors occurring when moon is directly overhead, the other when it is directly under foot. Of course there are always other determining factors, weather,wind, etc.
     

    Doco Overboard

    Ultimate Member
    BANNED!!!
    [/ATTACH] Sometimes they get covered up with forest debris and sneak up on you. Once in a while you stumble on other weird stuff too. That old bone shaped thing has turned to stone its so old. I have no idea what it is. I think it must have had a cord strung through it and was worn for decoration or protection. The little arrow head is still sharp after a long time.
     

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    Derwood

    Ultimate Member
    Jun 2, 2011
    1,078
    DC area
    My dog busted three deer bedded down in a draw about 30 yards from where I was walking through the woods in MoCo yesterday. I always love seeing deer in areas I hunt but the best part was when the dog came right back to me instead of chasing the deer for a mile or two.

    Two were for sure does based on body structure but one looked like it might have been an antlerless adult buck. The animal had much broader shoulders and all that. Is that possible/likely? I wouldn't think bucks would be hanging around does once their antlers have dropped but I'm still learning some of this stuff.

    I looked around where they were hanging out but couldn't find any sheds.

    Does anyone use a dog to find sheds? I remember seeing a few pictures on this site. I got a little of that substance you can put on a shed to make it smell fresher. My dog is super into sheds without that stuff anyway so I've never used it. I think the two of us could have some fun searching for sheds over the next couple months.
     

    Doco Overboard

    Ultimate Member
    BANNED!!!
    A buck will hang with does for sure especially in small woodlots. Jumping them in bedding areas will knock them off too so look around good when that happens. Dogs will find sheds easily, I was at a sale on time and wrestled a good one from a shepherd. He kept following me the whole time!
     

    DeathBeforeDishonor

    Wildlife Consultant
    Jan 14, 2017
    50
    Camp Lejeune, NC
    yeah I used to listen to the drury brothers and team realtree too until one hot day during mid October I spotted three mature bucks combat gliding across the baron plain chasing a doe about 30 minutes before darkness set over with a neon moon. i slid my hawken up over top of my horse saddle and took a crack but i had left my modern day TC encore with extra long range barrel and red hot extended range powerbelts back on the homestead. they pranced off into the distance never to be seen again until a week later wandering around the same location feeding off of my brothers corn pile at 2 am. hundreds of pounds of bait is essential for nocturnal movements
     

    stu929

    M1 Addict
    Jan 2, 2012
    6,605
    Hagerstown
    I know many of you collect them but if theres any you wish to get rid of and live in frederick of west please let me know.

    Sent from my SM-G930P using Tapatalk
     

    Doco Overboard

    Ultimate Member
    BANNED!!!
    yeah I used to listen to the drury brothers and team realtree too until one hot day during mid October I spotted three mature bucks combat gliding across the baron plain chasing a doe about 30 minutes before darkness set over with a neon moon. i slid my hawken up over top of my horse saddle and took a crack but i had left my modern day TC encore with extra long range barrel and red hot extended range powerbelts back on the homestead. they pranced off into the distance never to be seen again until a week later wandering around the same location feeding off of my brothers corn pile at 2 am. hundreds of pounds of bait is essential for nocturnal movements
    stay out of my shed horn woods tender foot!
     

    outrider58

    Eats Bacon Raw
    MDS Supporter
    Jul 29, 2014
    50,073
    Finally made it to the woods today. One was so fresh, it still had blood on the pedicle.
     

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