2/14 House Ways & Means - Firearm Related Legislation Hearings

[Lou45]

We already pay sales tax on firearms and ammo, if only because it's a retail transaction. No different in that than for a baseball bat, a new grill, or even a car.

But, I'm not aware that the sales tax on anything else gets peeled off like this (except maybe the extra 3% on alcohol sales? Sh!t... Does that open up a new avenue for them?)

This seems to be the point of the bill... to ostensibly help a vulnerable segment of the population through encumbering a legal sale with which they disagree.

Exactly.

No questions allowed though.

So many need answered...

So what happened with alcohol tax? Is there a clear history on it somewhere? Might provide a good framework for the assumption approach.

The "car" and "truck" rental "sales and use tax" may also be of some help for you google foos(different tax rate).

 

[Mr H]

Info from the Daily Record from April, 2011...

The move would raise $87 million for the state. Members of the Ways and Means Committee voted to send $15 million to the Developmental Disabilities Administration and use $47.5 million for school construction. Another $21 million was previously earmarked in the state budget for schools, contingent on the alcohol tax increase.

hmmmmm...

Starting to smell funny...

 

[ShallNotInfringe]

Info from the Daily Record from April, 2011...

hmmmmm...

Starting to smell funny...

Maybe they know we're coming and are waiting to up the tax after we stop looking. I'm sure there's folks pouring over the budget right now with calculators, pencils and lots of erasers trying to come up with the ammo tax increase to be proposed on 3/5.

 

[Lou45]

Info from the Daily Record from April, 2011...



hmmmmm...

Starting to smell funny...

Maybe they know we're coming and are waiting to up the tax after we stop looking. I'm sure there's folks pouring over the budget right now with calculators, pencils and lots of erasers trying to come up with the ammo tax increase to be proposed on 3/5.

Smell funny??? I detect a VERY foul odor with this.

 

[Mr H]

I can hear it now...

"Yes, we agree that diverting the 6% sales tax from firearms and ammunition is cumbersome and harming to businesses. Instead, we will set up only a 3% surtax, in order to provide for DDs."

I see 3 big issues, but I'll let y'all do the math.......

 

[Mr H]

More info from the same article...

Vincent DeMarco, president of the Maryland Citizens’ Health Initiative and the driving force behind the 10-cent legislation, said Saturday’s vote was still a win.

“We’re thrilled they’re going to 3 percent now,” he said. “That’s a great public health victory for Maryland.”

Found the bill (SB994, 2011)... Not the Usual Suspects on this one.

http://mgaleg.maryland.gov/webmga/frmMain.aspx?ys=2011rs/billfile/sb0994.htm

Of particular interest (emphasis mine)...

In addition to the amount appropriated in the budget bill for fiscal year 2012, to
11 supplement the appropriation for fiscal year 2012, the following amount to be used to
12 fund a Waiting List initiative for the Developmental Disabilities Administration.
13 Priority shall be given to individuals in the Crisis Prevention and Crisis Resolution
14 categories of the Waiting List:

15 General Fund Appropriation $5,000,000 $15,000,000

Same fund, even...

Methinks someone found a Honey Hole to direct monies elsewhere.

 

[Clovis]

Doing a quick Google search of MDDDA, the whole thing looks like a mismanaged screwed up mess. I don't think I would refer to it as a "honey hole", it sounds more like a black hole where the money designated to help people doesn't get to them, and Federal funding that was supposed to be applied for is not. The folks with Disabilities and their families suffer and they now want us (gun owners and hunters) to try to spend to clean it up.

 

[Mr H]

IMO, it's probably both...

I would love to have the resources to find out who is raiding it, and where it's going.

 

[Clovis]

As a Marylander, I am ashamed something like this is going on in our state. This kind of scandal should bring down the Administration but they only want to raid other sources of revenue to try to cover their behavior. It is apparent the powers that be were aware of the problems and wanted to use sport shooting to try to fix it last session. What a bunch of...

 

[ShallNotInfringe]

Hmmmm... On to something here Clovis...

http://articles.baltimoresun.com/20...isabilities-administration-federal-government

Did you find the IG report? Scrubbing around for it...

 

[ShallNotInfringe]

Another interesting read..

The fiscal notes: http://mgaleg.maryland.gov/2014RS/fnotes/bil_0005/hb0415.pdf

"In the 2011 session, the legislature appropriated an additional $15 million to DDA for fiscal 2012 based on its concern over the lack of services available to meet the demand from individuals with developmental disabilities. Funding was provided through Chapter 571 of 2011, which increased the State sales and use tax rate imposed on alcoholic beverages from 6% to 9% and required a supplementary appropriation of $15 million for DDA to fund services to individuals on DDA’s waiting list."

So in 2011 taxes collected for alcohol were increased from 6% to 9%, funneled into this fund and in late 2013 they were still short on money, caught misreporting to the federal government and now looking for other revenue streams to funnel in to this fund.

Where is this money going?

How long before the tax rate increases from 6% to 9%.

Interesting they are using figures from last year. Sets it up for a "omg, we vastly underestimated the revenue flow and need to increase this use tax" argument next year, if not this year.

 

[Lou45]

I was going to post something here (rant) but I'll let this thread remain on topic without interfering.

 

[Mr H]

So in 2011 taxes collected for alcohol were increased from 6% to 9%, funneled into this fund and in late 2013 they were still short on money, caught misreporting to the federal government and now looking for other revenue streams to funnel in to this fund.

Where is this money going?

How long before the tax rate increases from 6% to 9%.

Interesting they are using figures from last year. Sets it up for a "omg, we vastly underestimated the revenue flow and need to increase this use tax" argument next year, if not this year.

This has been my point on this.

There's something going on with this fund, and we know how they play with taxes...

Put that together with tying it to firearms and ammo?? Open the floodgates, and someone's getting even richer off the leak in the fund.

 

[Mr H]

I was going to post something here (rant) but I'll let this thread remain on topic without interfering.

If it involves the potential ass-raping this bill opens up...???

 

[Lou45]

If it involves the potential ass-raping this bill opens up...???

That ^^^ and a lot more.

 

[Clovis]

Another interesting read..

The fiscal notes: http://mgaleg.maryland.gov/2014RS/fnotes/bil_0005/hb0415.pdf

"In the 2011 session, the legislature appropriated an additional $15 million to DDA for fiscal 2012 based on its concern over the lack of services available to meet the demand from individuals with developmental disabilities. Funding was provided through Chapter 571 of 2011, which increased the State sales and use tax rate imposed on alcoholic beverages from 6% to 9% and required a supplementary appropriation of $15 million for DDA to fund services to individuals on DDA’s waiting list."

So in 2011 taxes collected for alcohol were increased from 6% to 9%, funneled into this fund and in late 2013 they were still short on money, caught misreporting to the federal government and now looking for other revenue streams to funnel in to this fund.

Where is this money going?

How long before the tax rate increases from 6% to 9%.

Interesting they are using figures from last year. Sets it up for a "omg, we vastly underestimated the revenue flow and need to increase this use tax" argument next year, if not this year.

Yes all that and much more.

Auditors are finding a huge mess and reports of a whistle blower from 2011(?) reporting problems and the only person fired was the whistle blower. The former director of the DDA was not fired but put into another position. The other issues seem to be with involvment with medicare/medicaid and taking payments for services that do not appear to be delievered to the people who are in need.
Yeah, where is the money going? Why aren't the media in the state really hopping mad about people with developmental disabilities being abused in this way?

 

[ShallNotInfringe]

Yes all that and much more.

Auditors are finding a huge mess and reports of a whistle blower from 2011(?) reporting problems and the only person fired was the whistle blower. The former director of the DDA was not fired but put into another position. The other issues seem to be with involvment with medicare/medicaid and taking payments for services that do not appear to be delievered to the people who are in need.
Yeah, where is the money going? Why aren't the media in the state really hopping mad about people with developmental disabilities being abused in this way?

Are you going tomorrow? Wanna have lunch and trade notes? This is an interesting rabbit hole and maybe we can bring this to light with our objections to the redirect of funding?

Here's the IG report btw: http://oig.hhs.gov/oas/reports/region6/61200051.pdf

What, do they think firearms owners are too stupid to pop open the hood?

This really smells bad.

 

[ShallNotInfringe]

"Maryland’s beleaguered Developmental Disabilities Administration, with thousands on its waiting list for care, left $25 million in state funding unspent over the last two years, and wound up having to return the money to the state’s general fund, according to the agency’s executive director. The agency also had a $12 million surplus in its federal Medicaid match, meaning there was a total $38 million left over."

"After years of lobbying by advocates for more funding from higher alcohol taxes, the DDA will get a $15 million boost in fiscal 2013 from the new 9 percent sales tax in July, far less than the amount the agency couldn’t find a way to spend in previous years."


http://thedailyrecord.com/2011/11/09/maryland-disabilities-agency-leaves-38m-unspent/#ixzz2tEl8ruU9

 

[Mark75H]

"Maryland’s beleaguered Developmental Disabilities Administration, with thousands on its waiting list for care, left $25 million in state funding unspent over the last two years, and wound up having to return the money to the state’s general fund, according to the agency’s executive director. The agency also had a $12 million surplus in its federal Medicaid match, meaning there was a total $38 million left over."

"After years of lobbying by advocates for more funding from higher alcohol taxes, the DDA will get a $15 million boost in fiscal 2013 from the new 9 percent sales tax in July, far less than the amount the agency couldn’t find a way to spend in previous years."


http://thedailyrecord.com/2011/11/09/maryland-disabilities-agency-leaves-38m-unspent/#ixzz2tEl8ruU9

Was told my daughter might qualify for some help thru some DDA programs (job training & placement), but there was an 18 month waiting list

 

[Clovis]

Are you going tomorrow? Wanna have lunch and trade notes? This is an interesting rabbit hole and maybe we can bring this to light with our objections to the redirect of funding?

Here's the IG report btw: http://oig.hhs.gov/oas/reports/region6/61200051.pdf

What, do they think firearms owners are too stupid to pop open the hood?

This really smells bad.

I can't think we shouldn't object to throwing more money at a problem which has shown money is not the issue is going to solve anything. At best it looks like incompetent mismanagement; at worst, people should be in handcuffs.

This is the problem they have created with the FSA2013, too many people start getting interested in just what the heck THEY are doing.