10ga shotgun

[67temp]

Mine was originally a goose gun with a 36" barrel from H&R. In the early 80's it was cut down to 24". It's pretty compact. Here it is next to a Mossberg 500 with a 20" barrel. It hurts my shoulder and wallet when I shoot it.

 

[Doco Overboard]

Has MDS gone woke? Guy wants to buy a big new gun and the first few posts are all trying to talk him out of it...

Surprised to see that as well.
Not long ago someone was on here extolling the virtues of 10 gauge goose and bird shooting at 100 yards.
Evidently they were a well versed and shot bunch of guns and all that but anyway,
I think that’s a pretty good stretch myself but one of the boys hunts with one occasionally. It’s a BPS but ammo is tough, expensive.
I asked him why he liked it and he said makes you think your shots more.
Whether he carries one or more on his boat I can’t say.

 

[Newcomb52]

Mine was originally a goose gun with a 36" barrel from H&R. In the early 80's it was cut down to 24". It's pretty compact. Here it is next to a Mossberg 500 with a 20" barrel. It hurts my shoulder and wallet when I shoot it.

That’s nice

 

[trickg]

I see a 10 ga shotgun kind of in the same firearm category that I see things like the 50 Desert Eagle, 500 S&W, and the Barrett 50 cal - they fall right on that spectrum where they are interesting, theoretically useful, but not very practical.

With that said, I also understand when someone has the desire to obtain something out of that category - practical or not, they are pretty cool. I wish you luck finding what you're looking for.

 

[smokey]

I see a 10 ga shotgun kind of in the same firearm category that I see things like the 50 Desert Eagle, 500 S&W, and the Barrett 50 cal - they fall right on that spectrum where they are interesting, theoretically useful, but not very practical.

With that said, I also understand when someone has the desire to obtain something out of that category - practical or not, they are pretty cool. I wish you luck finding what you're looking for.

I dunno, 10 ga throws a pretty dense shot cloud out there. It offers some pretty big performance benefits over 3.5" 12 ga for hitting geese that are far away. My buddy with the aforementioned bps 10 has taken a LOT of geese with it.

 

[trickg]

I dunno, 10 ga throws a pretty dense shot cloud out there. It offers some pretty big performance benefits over 3.5" 12 ga for hitting geese that are far away. My buddy with the aforementioned bps 10 has taken a LOT of geese with it.

But see - right there you said it - it's kind of a one-trick pony for a specific task - being a longer-range goose gun. I don't hunt geese, so it's not going to be something I'm too keen on adding to my gun accumulation because it's not something I'd shoot recreationally.

 

[Sundazes]

My Super Goose had a 36" barrel. It was fun popping out of blind with it. But I did take geese with it on the Eastern Shore. Definitely Not a range toy. Back then ammo was plentiful and not expensive. Follow up shots were not quick though.
I used to LOVE big boomers with lots of recoil when I was younger. My body cant handle it anymore. I do like me some 45/70 though. Depending on the round, I cant shoot a few to 2 and done.

 

[P-12 Norm]

A hunting buddy years ago took me goose hunting, and my shotgun was not a great fit for that, so he l;oaned me his dad's FIE double 10 ga that was bought in Georgetown (DC) back in the 40's. Recoil was manageable, but shooting a SXS shotgun is a little different than a pump, and I wound up shooting over the geese. But my friend could reach out to 65 yards easily.

 

[Doco Overboard]

Shotguns “accuracy”is based on pattern and percentage of hits without holes etc that a game animal has a harder time escaping through at a particular distance especially while flying or on the wing.
What constitutes pattern is largely based on pressure and size of the shot and how it behaves while being influenced physically by the barrel and other factors like the choke. Range I think is determined by how much the shot becomes deformed as it squeezed under pressure out of the hull and then through the barrel. Pellets that become flattened deformed etc aren’t going to fly any further than but a short bit even when subjected to more pressure and velocity and will peel off from the main shot string and drop off at higher rate once a particular distance is met.
Because the pressure generated by the average charge in any shot shell is probably about 11,000 lbs.
I wonder if a 10 gauge has any actual performance benefits for range/ striking energy due to casting a more balanced charge of shot just because of the diameter of the bore acts in away with less holes in the pattern that makes it appear to shoot farther and be more efficient,than say like a 12 gauge at the same distance with same shot size velocity etc?
Shot travels in a string more so that a cloud is what I always thought that’s why follow through keeping the gun moving is so important.

 

[JasonD67]

Shot travels in a string more so that a cloud is what I always thought that’s why follow through keeping the gun moving is so important.

Schrader's sporting clays on the Eastern Shore has several stations where you shoot down over a quarry lake. Very interesting to see how your shot string looks when it hits the water. Also easy to see if you are in front or behind the target. Shotkam on the cheap.

 

[smdub]

Shot travels in a string more so that a cloud is what I always thought that’s why follow through keeping the gun moving is so important.

Shot all leaves the muzzle at more or less the same time. Its all sitting in the cup which isn't terribly long. Its not like some pellets are exiting the muzzle while some others are still just getting started back at the breech. Its not how it works.

Technically there is no point to follow through once the shot leaves the barrel. What you do with the gun after its out there doesn't affect it at all. The reason follow through is taught (and still a good idea) is that folks tend to pull the trigger and stop swinging. Well, they anticipate the shot and really stop swinging either during or slightly before they pull the trigger causing them to miss. Smooth is good.

Shot travels more in a flat disc than a cloud. Or maybe think of it as a mostly flat beach ball. It all leaves the muzzle at the same speed (nestled tightly in the wad cup). Shot that isn't perfectly round will start to stray off to the sides. There are then other aerodynamic forces at play. The wake turbulence of the shot in the front causes the ones behind to start to deviate off the to sides too. So by the time it reaches the target it will have dispersed fore/aft a little but a whole lot to the sides.

 

[Doco Overboard]

Shot all leaves the muzzle at more or less the same time. Its all sitting in the cup which isn't terribly long. Its not like some pellets are exiting the muzzle while some others are still just getting started back at the breech. Its not how it works.

Technically there is no point to follow through once the shot leaves the barrel. What you do with the gun after its out there doesn't affect it at all. The reason follow through is taught (and still a good idea) is that folks tend to pull the trigger and stop swinging. Well, they anticipate the shot and really stop swinging either during or slightly before they pull the trigger causing them to miss. Smooth is good.

Shot travels more in a flat disc than a cloud. Or maybe think of it as a mostly flat beach ball. It all leaves the muzzle at the same speed (nestled tightly in the wad cup). Shot that isn't perfectly round will start to stray off to the sides. There are then other aerodynamic forces at play. The wake turbulence of the shot in the front causes the ones behind to start to deviate off the to sides too. So by the time it reaches the target it will have dispersed fore/aft a little but a whole lot to the sides.

Thanks, I know how shot travels having enough experience and a student of Col Askins excellent books not mention being a wing shot for many years now.
Not to mention a pretty good grip on how internal / external ballistics work for how shot shells work.
As far as keeping the gun moving through a target that’s a fundamental practice employed by shooters for the reason just as you mentioned.
But what I’m asking is, what’s the effects of shot shells fired through a ten bore or say like a 12 or a half that’s definitive for keeping the load and ballistic qualities balanced vs pressure characteristics of the shot and pressure exerted to keep patterns without holes to make longer range hits a higher probability with one versus the other.
What makes one better than the other?
Or at least make it that one performs better than other at a greater distance.
Is it density and volume of the shot at rest in the hull or could be pressure over a larger diameter for the same length of time or what? Pellets start moving and become turbulent right then and there and then act differently soon as they emerge from the muzzle, peeling off getting deformed and things of that nature just like you described.
I’m asking trying to learn something here, because I’m interested.

 

[smdub]

There is only 6% difference in their bore diameter (0.775" vs 0.749"). That results in 13% more area for the pressure to initially accelerate the load. Realistically, it probably makes darn near no practical difference in shot dispersion.

The appeal of 10ga was more shot. AFAIK, they are all 3.5" shells. The 3.5" 12ga wasn't introduced until ~1988 (I had to look that up)

Since 12ga is rated to higher SAAMI pressures (14ksi vs 11ksi) a 3.5" 12ga should be able to deliver almost as much shot at considerably higher velocity even though its running at a very slight area disadvantage.

Now if the OP had wanted an 8ga...

 

[Bountied]

There is only 6% difference in their bore diameter (0.775" vs 0.749"). That results in 13% more area for the pressure to initially accelerate the load. Realistically, it probably makes darn near no practical difference in shot dispersion.

The appeal of 10ga was more shot. AFAIK, they are all 3.5" shells. The 3.5" 12ga wasn't introduced until ~1988 (I had to look that up)

Since 12ga is rated to higher SAAMI pressures (14ksi vs 11ksi) a 3.5" 12ga should be able to deliver almost as much shot at considerably higher velocity even though its running at a very slight area disadvantage.

Now if the OP had wanted an 8ga...

Shhhh 8ga is illegal for waterfowl.

 

[AlBeight]

Shhhh 8ga is illegal for waterfowl.

And dredge boats!

 

[Doco Overboard]

There is only 6% difference in their bore diameter (0.775" vs 0.749"). That results in 13% more area for the pressure to initially accelerate the load. Realistically, it probably makes darn near no practical difference in shot dispersion.

The appeal of 10ga was more shot. AFAIK, they are all 3.5" shells. The 3.5" 12ga wasn't introduced until ~1988 (I had to look that up)

Since 12ga is rated to higher SAAMI pressures (14ksi vs 11ksi) a 3.5" 12ga should be able to deliver almost as much shot at considerably higher velocity even though its running at a very slight area disadvantage.

Now if the OP had wanted an 8ga...

I think its the powder. Double based or progressive burning bulk powders.
The pellets at the bottom of the shot column while in the cup, have pressure with modern powders applied to them more slowly initially, but for a longer period.
Also the initial push is when the pellets are still in the hull which is located in the chamber. With quicker burning or older nitro powders, the initial shock is where pellets begin to move and transmit energy against one another which continues until well after they leave the bore. That's also where patterning starts and is the most profound effect for a "balanced load" and why wad technology is a big deal. Maybe Ill look to see how much difference there is a chamber drawing between the two or someone has reloaded for the both the ten and 12 !/2 and they can speak to powder selection.
I never loaded for a 10 gauge in a cartridge gun.

 

[smdub]

Re 8ga: OP didn't say he was hunting.

If you are running old 10ga loads, paper hulls/wads, etc. then yes things will be different. Apples/oranges. But w/ modern 10ga loads everything should be roughly equivalent - wads and powder technology. Federal makes many of the same loads for both gauges: (click the 3.5" 'shell length' filter to get just to 10 & 12ga)

12 Gauge, 20 Gauge, 16 Gauge, 10 Gauge Shotgun Ammo | Federal Premium

Federal Ammunition

www.federalpremium.com

 

[Newcomb52]

Mine was originally a goose gun with a 36" barrel from H&R. In the early 80's it was cut down to 24". It's pretty compact. Here it is next to a Mossberg 500 with a 20" barrel. It hurts my shoulder and wallet when I shoot it.

That looks cool I have an old Stevens pump with the 36in barrel take down model those long barrels are cool

 

[Sam Salvati]

10gauge is a riot! Put out a request here and was accommodated perfectly with a single shot in short order. It is awesome, slugs and buck and bird it’s like shooting a cannon!

 

[Mark75H]

I dunno, 10 ga throws a pretty dense shot cloud out there. It offers some pretty big performance benefits over 3.5" 12 ga for hitting geese that are far away. My buddy with the aforementioned bps 10 has taken a LOT of geese with it.

Back in the stone age, one of my classmates used to hunt in the mornings before class; a 115 pound blonde knockout. She put a lot of waterfowl on her family’s table with that 10 gage and embarrassed a lot of the neighborhood boys just lugging that thing out to the blind.