What do we do after pulling the trigger?

[Huckleberry]

We train, practice and drill with our firearms to prepare ourselves in the event we need to protect our lives, family, home and property.

We attempt to stay current of all the laws and restrictions regarding home and self defense including CCW.

But do we prepare ourselves properly for what comes after we defend ourselves? How do we interact with our attacker? Witnesses? Police? Our Legal System?

This was thread on the PAFOA and merits discussion here on MDS given our different political and legal climates.

http://forum.pafoa.org/general-2/13618-self-defense-guideline-card.html

These are suggested guideline from Clint Smith and Thunder Ranch

Let's keep this professional. No Cop Bashing. Save the BS and Macho Crap for the Water Cooler.

Remember the rules regarding copyright if you reference external sources.

 

[ProShooter]

Good thread.

Much of that is exactly what I tell my students to do as well.

 

[kronusthebonus]

All of it is great advice, most of which is learned from a good training class everyone should take before carrying.

 

[MikeTF]

Once the attack stops immediately assist the attacker in an attempt to resuscitate them, if needed. Repeat to anyone and everyone, 'I'll be happy to answer all questions, in the presence of my lawyer. I was attacked, I feared for my life, I defended myself.'

 

[squirrels]

Once the attack stops immediately assist the attacker in an attempt to resuscitate them, if needed.

I can't agree with this. You're under no obligation to resuscitate a criminal who has broken into your house and/or threatened your person with violence. It's careless to assume that he is incapacitated just because he isn't coming after you any more. You may have only winged him and he could be "playing possum" for all you know, waiting for you to get close enough for him to get the upper hand.

If you approach a man after shooting him, even if it's a good hit, there is no telling what he might do. He may use his last bit of strength to retaliate, possibly producing a knife or other close-range weapon that you didn't know he had. He could also think you're coming over to "finish the job" and then HE is the one "defending himself".

If I ever have to shoot someone in my house, I am not going NEAR him after the shot...I'm going to my neighbor's house and calling the cops.

I agree that you tell them you were "scared for your life"...in fact, if you WEREN'T "scared for your life", you shouldn't be taking the shot anyway. Someone breaking into your house is not a "license to hunt thugs".

 

[kronusthebonus]

I can't agree with this. You're under no obligation to resuscitate a criminal who has broken into your house and/or threatened your person with violence. It's careless to assume that he is incapacitated just because he isn't coming after you any more. You may have only winged him and he could be "playing possum" for all you know, waiting for you to get close enough for him to get the upper hand.

If you approach a man after shooting him, even if it's a good hit, there is no telling what he might do. He may use his last bit of strength to retaliate, possibly producing a knife or other close-range weapon that you didn't know he had. He could also think you're coming over to "finish the job" and then HE is the one "defending himself".

If I ever have to shoot someone in my house, I am not going NEAR him after the shot...I'm going to my neighbor's house and calling the cops.

I agree that you tell them you were "scared for your life"...in fact, if you WEREN'T "scared for your life", you shouldn't be taking the shot anyway. Someone breaking into your house is not a "license to hunt thugs".

Agreed. You also have no idea if this guy has any infections transmittable diseases.

 

[Huckleberry]

I think one point to really consider is pressing charges against a dead perp to help validate your SD and show that th perp's criminal activity and attack against you contributed to his death.

Should help squash any wrongful death accusations against you when his family tries to claim he was really a good boy or too drunk to know he was in the wrong house.

 

[ProShooter]

Quote:
Originally Posted by MikeTF
Once the attack stops immediately assist the attacker in an attempt to resuscitate them, if needed.


Originally Posted by squirrels
I can't agree with this. You're under no obligation to resuscitate a criminal who has broken into your house and/or threatened your person with violence. It's careless to assume that he is incapacitated just because he isn't coming after you any more. You may have only winged him and he could be "playing possum" for all you know, waiting for you to get close enough for him to get the upper hand.

If you approach a man after shooting him, even if it's a good hit, there is no telling what he might do. He may use his last bit of strength to retaliate, possibly producing a knife or other close-range weapon that you didn't know he had. He could also think you're coming over to "finish the job" and then HE is the one "defending himself".

If I ever have to shoot someone in my house, I am not going NEAR him after the shot...I'm going to my neighbor's house and calling the cops.

I agree that you tell them you were "scared for your life"...in fact, if you WEREN'T "scared for your life", you shouldn't be taking the shot anyway. Someone breaking into your house is not a "license to hunt thugs".


+1 That is one of the few things from the thread that I don't agree with. There's no need for you to get that close to your attacker.

 

[Markp]

You bury the body... I thought everyone knew that answer.

 

[4g64loser]

+1. Even in modern CPR classes (we have to stay current because of working in the equipment industry) they are getting rid of the breaths because of communicable diseases. If I don't have a barrier/cpr mask, I'm not giving breaths, sorry. I'm not an EMT or other medical professional.

In the case of self defense shooting, I'm not getting close to the subject. I will keep my weapon trained on him/her/it and not so much as blink or look away until the authorities have the subject removed from the scene. NEVER take chances with your life. It was valuable enough to defend in the first place. Why expose yourself to foolish risk of bodily harm after you have (hopefully) made it through the initial portion of a self-defense encounter alive and unharmed.

 

[HardHatMan]

You bury the body... I thought everyone knew that answer.

S.S.S.

 

[Brychan]

Only get close enough to push their weapon out of their reach with your foot, and wait for the police to arrive.

 

[ffemtreed]

Doing CPR on a gunshot victim is like doing CPR on a broken computer. Neither is going to do any good to fix the problem.

CPR is only intended to buy time until the underlying problem that caused the heart to stop can be fixed.

 

[traveller]

The 'card' posted by the OP said this regarding the attacker:

If the attacker has been shot and has been disarmed, and no longer a threat try and assess his injuries and render first-aid if possible.

I think that's entirely reasonable.



Just look at the Gerald Ung incident (fresh of the presses). Having called an ambulance and coming to the assistance of DiDonato while on the phone with 911 certainly helped him to make his claim of self-defense to the jury.

 

[MikeTF]

I can't agree with this. You're under no obligation to resuscitate a criminal who has broken into your house and/or threatened your person with violence. It's careless to assume that he is incapacitated just because he isn't coming after you any more. You may have only winged him and he could be "playing possum" for all you know, waiting for you to get close enough for him to get the upper hand.

If you approach a man after shooting him, even if it's a good hit, there is no telling what he might do. He may use his last bit of strength to retaliate, possibly producing a knife or other close-range weapon that you didn't know he had. He could also think you're coming over to "finish the job" and then HE is the one "defending himself".

If I ever have to shoot someone in my house, I am not going NEAR him after the shot...I'm going to my neighbor's house and calling the cops.

I agree that you tell them you were "scared for your life"...in fact, if you WEREN'T "scared for your life", you shouldn't be taking the shot anyway. Someone breaking into your house is not a "license to hunt thugs".

I think I saw someone post once that they would give the victim CPR if needed (i.e. the victim was bleeding and they needed help with getting the blood out quicker, guaranteeing their death. Yes, they were joking around.).

I'm not into killing anyone, I just want to stop the threat. Then, if I'm absolutely sure that the threat is neutralized and that I can safely administer first aid to the person that I just shot (who is incapacitated), I will. It is the right and morale thing to do before professional medical help can arrive.

Remember that 80% of those shot to the body will survive. 50% of the head shots will survive too, if you're using a handgun. The victim is more likely to survive than die. If you go to trial, wouldn't it look better that you tried to save the person rather than waiting for them to die?

My focus is on stopping a threat by any and all means practical, not killing someone.

 

[Unit3960]

I'd have to dial 9-11. I'm not an EMT so if I try to resucitate him and fail then I'm getting sued by the family, not to mention all the safety factors that many have posted prior. I saw him as a threat, feared for my family's a safety and my life and I took action. As they say, it's better to be judged by 12 than to be carried by 6. Huckleberry great thread.

 

[parbreak]

I think I saw someone post once that they would give the victim CPR if needed (i.e. the victim was bleeding and they needed help with getting the blood out quicker, guaranteeing their death. Yes, they were joking around.).

I'm not into killing anyone, I just want to stop the threat. Then, if I'm absolutely sure that the threat is neutralized and that I can safely administer first aid to the person that I just shot (who is incapacitated), I will. It is the right and morale thing to do before professional medical help can arrive.

Remember that 80% of those shot to the body will survive. 50% of the head shots will survive too, if you're using a handgun. The victim is more likely to survive than die. If you go to trial, wouldn't it look better that you tried to save the person rather than waiting for them to die?

My focus is on stopping a threat by any and all means practical, not killing someone.

Death to an attacker is simply one possible outcome of you stopping the threat. You did not "kill" anyone. You preserved your life and/or the lifes of your family. You should under no conditions approach or adminster aid to the attacker. You are not obligated to and you put yourself in harm's way by doing so, both physically and possibly legally. You have to suppress your "better angels" and let the professionals do their job.

 

[jmac]

All of it is great advice, most of which is learned from a good training class everyone should take before carrying.

That is great info. I do have a question, I live in St. Mary's county, can anyone recommend a training course/instructor down my way? Also I would assume topics like this are covered when you take the course to apply for a CCW license, is this correct?

Thanks

 

[ProShooter]

Also I would assume topics like this are covered when you take the course to apply for a CCW license, is this correct?

Thanks

Well, yes and no. It all depends on what instructor you take classes with and what program they are teaching. Some instructors shy away from giving what they deem to be legal advice. Some offer their advice and opinions and have no practical experience whatsoever to back that up. Many people go into a training class with the thought that certain things will be taught/learned, and sometimes they are let down. You really need to do your research on the instructor and training program to see who offers what you want.

I tell my students that I am not an attorney and what I offer them is the viewpoint from someone who carried a gun for 12 years in LE and who now carries every day as a civilian. If you attend a class given by an attorney, remember that they are not giving you legal advice unless you are paying them to be your attorney, and that each situation is unique. Self-defense doesn't always come with black and white answers.

 

[jmac]

Thanks for the the heads up ProShooter!

Well, yes and no. It all depends on what instructor you take classes with and what program they are teaching. Some instructors shy away from giving what they deem to be legal advice. Some offer their advice and opinions and have no practical experience whatsoever to back that up. Many people go into a training class with the thought that certain things will be taught/learned, and sometimes they are let down. You really need to do your research on the instructor and training program to see who offers what you want.

I tell my students that I am not an attorney and what I offer them is the viewpoint from someone who carried a gun for 12 years in LE and who now carries every day as a civilian. If you attend a class given by an attorney, remember that they are not giving you legal advice unless you are paying them to be your attorney, and that each situation is unique. Self-defense doesn't always come with black and white answers.