Is it lawful to shoot an intruder who reaches for his waistband behind his back

[lazarus]

So some people want to have a conversation with a home invader and others want to know if it’s OK to shoot them. Is this really a conversation? Are people looking for approval to shoot someone who breaks into your home?

If someone is dumb enough to break into my home they will first have 100lbs of pi$$ed of GSD doing his best to eat them. At that point they will be praying that I shoot them, which I will gladly do. Two to the chest and one to the head and then I will clear the rest of my home. After that’s done I will call the police if my wife has not already done so. Anyone breaking into your house could be there to kill you and your family and I for one will protect my family with my life.

I would rather be tried by 12 than carried by 6.

I guess. I've got a heroin addict who lives in my neighborhood. He HAS pounded on a neighbor's door in the middle of the night (and police did come and arrest him) to the point my neighbor's wife was pretty sure he was trying to break down the door (he did not succeed). He thought his stash was in their house for someone intoxicated reason. Do I think he is completely harmless? No. However, I also chat with him every once in a while, when he is out walking his dog (his parents? He looks to be in his 40s and lives with his parents who are in their 70s). He is really interested in plants and trees so when I am down taking care of my orchard, we end up talking sometimes.

Yeah, if he breaks into my house and is high as a kite and seems like he is just looking for his stash and doesn't actually appear threatening, no, I don't want to shoot the guy. I don't want to shoot some person who is having a mental health crisis who otherwise does not appear violent or threatening. Yes, I WOULD rather put myself and others at greater risk because I take some amount of time (it might be a fraction of a second, it might be several minutes of trying to talk someone down) to try to evaluate is the person a true threat. Not just, did they break into my house or are they trying to break into my house.

Someone has a weapon, they are a deadly threat. Someone advances on me, they are probably a deadly threat. Someone has broken in to or is trying to break in to my house and appears unarmed, they are a threat, but I don't know yet that they are a deadly threat.

 

[Blaster229]

Here's the rub. You never "draw on the drop". Reverse the situation. Bad guy has the drop on you. Do you think you'd actually get to the point where you'd get a shot off? Nope. Same here. You have the drop on the guy. As soon as you see the weapon come around, boom.

But hey, it's your shoot. Shoot it the way you do. I have my "go" time, people should have theirs too. If it's simply on a furtive movement not seeing a weapon, then hope you can articulate why you shot someone with a cell phone, or nothing in their hand.

I just noticed the "intruder" part. You might have a little more leeway inside your dwelling.

 

[Blaster229]

What I'm getting at is a corpse can't be brought into court to testify against you, so if you clearly heard him say "I'm going to kill you" and he was reaching for what you believed was a gun, no one could testify that's not accurate.

This is not legal advice!

Terrible advice.

 

[OMD6dawg]

Yeah, if he breaks into my house and is high as a kite and seems like he is just looking for his stash and doesn't actually appear threatening, no, I don't want to shoot the guy. I don't want to shoot some person who is having a mental health crisis who otherwise does not appear violent or threatening. Yes, I WOULD rather put myself and others at greater risk because I take some amount of time (it might be a fraction of a second, it might be several minutes of trying to talk someone down) to try to evaluate is the person a true threat. Not just, did they break into my house or are they trying to break into my house.

Someone has a weapon, they are a deadly threat. Someone advances on me, they are probably a deadly threat. Someone has broken in to or is trying to break in to my house and appears unarmed, they are a threat, but I don't know yet that they are a deadly threat.

Someone with discernment and sense.

 

[Jimgoespewpew]

Law aside, if you kill a man for scratching his butthole monkeypox, you're probably going to hell.

 

[6-Pack]

Terrible advice.

I wasn’t actually serious. I don’t know why people are continually asking “is it ok to shoot someone if ______?” You won’t know until you are presented with a situation then it’s entirely your call. You need to live with the fact you got it wrong.

My goals are to get the hell out of dodge before ever having to use my gun.

 

[Blaster229]

I wasn’t actually serious. I don’t know why people are continually asking “is it ok to shoot someone if ______?” You won’t know until you are presented with a situation then it’s entirely your call. You need to live with the fact you got it wrong.

My goals are to get the hell out of dodge before ever having to use my gun.

We need a sarcasm font.

 

[teratos]

Even if people pull something out, given the fear/adrenaline, you are very likely to misinterpret it. The part of the brain that identifies things first (the amygdala) is very imprecise. Even a cellphone is likely to make the amygdala scream GUN!!! In the first few milliseconds, before the frontal cortex can correct it. I’ve been reading on this. Interesting stuff.

 

[6-Pack]

We need a sarcasm font.

Yeah. I’m going to try to cut back on the sarcasm. Carry on!

 

[teratos]

Yeah. I’m going to try to cut back on the sarcasm. Carry on!

It’s why I am never sarcastic.

 

[GrimReaper]

I'm talking about a home invader.

I'm sure you could find a knife or other weapon that you could put next to the body. Regular kitchen knife would do, doest matter if it's yours. He picked it up and came after you with it...

 

[JohnnyE]

Even if people pull something out, given the fear/adrenaline, you are very likely to misinterpret it. The part of the brain that identifies things first (the amygdala) is very imprecise. Even a cellphone is likely to make the amygdala scream GUN!!! In the first few milliseconds, before the frontal cortex can correct it. I’ve been reading on this. Interesting stuff.

Like confusing a foil-wrapped hero sandwich for a gun.

- because they thought his hero sandwich was a gun.

Casino (1995) Thriller clip with quote - because they thought his hero sandwich was a gun. Yarn is the best search for video clips by quote. Find the exact moment in a TV show, movie, or music video you want to share. Easily move forward or backward to get to the perfect clip.

getyarn.io

 

[teratos]

Like confusing a foil-wrapped hero sandwich for a gun.

- because they thought his hero sandwich was a gun.

Casino (1995) Thriller clip with quote - because they thought his hero sandwich was a gun. Yarn is the best search for video clips by quote. Find the exact moment in a TV show, movie, or music video you want to share. Easily move forward or backward to get to the perfect clip.

getyarn.io

Exactly. Particularly under stress, your amygdala looks for the worst case scenario, to keep you safe. It’s on an ultra short loop. Your rational brain catches up a few hundred milliseconds after the amygdala gives its opinion.

Training can overcome it.

 

[Huckleberry]

[sarcasm] Whatever you do, don't stand over or close to your attacker for a second kill shot

The diffent ballistic angle or GSR on the perp is a dead giveaway to the forensic experts. Well, at least it was on some NCIS or CSI reruns I was watching at the Holiday Inn Express before I feel asleep.[/sarcasm]

 

[eruby]

[sarcasm] Whatever you do, don't stand over or close to your attacker for a second kill shot

The diffent ballistic angle or GSR on the perp is a dead giveaway to the forensic experts. Well, at least it was on some NCIS or CSI reruns I was watching at the Holiday Inn Express before I feel asleep.[/sarcasm]

Cyril Wecht approves of this post

 

[fishgutzy]

The big problem is the word "reasonably".
Hind sight is 20/20. Jurors are given the hind sight view. DA will always slant the presentation in a manner intended white himself a win without regard for what actually happened in the moment.
I'm overweight, 63, 6 get tall, and stopped training in martial arts a decade ask l ago due to degenerative osteoarthritis in multiple joints.
DA presentation would be "He's a black belt trained in hand to hand combat, the size of an NFL player. Did he have to shoot the intruder?"

As a juror, my view, regardless any instructions with that word "reasonably", is that anyone who breaks into a home, intends to do serious harm to any occupant inside. All use of deadly force is self defense. No second guessing allowed.

Sent from my SM-G998U using Tapatalk

 

[Huckleberry]

Cyril Wecht approves of this post

You got me with that Daily Double, Alex Trebek

I had to search the Interwebz to refresh my memory with that name

 

[JohnnyE]

Exactly. Particularly under stress, your amygdala looks for the worst case scenario, to keep you safe. It’s on an ultra short loop. Your rational brain catches up a few hundred milliseconds after the amygdala gives its opinion.

Training can overcome it.

We have to counter the insta-response of our lizard brain. Work...work...

 

[teratos]

We have to counter the insta-response of our lizard brain. Work...work...

Yep. Train.

 

[Huckleberry]

Even if people pull something out, given the fear/adrenaline, you are very likely to misinterpret it. The part of the brain that identifies things first (the amygdala) is very imprecise. Even a cellphone is likely to make the amygdala scream GUN!!! In the first few milliseconds, before the frontal cortex can correct it. I’ve been reading on this. Interesting stuff.

Almygdala? What about your Medulla Oblongata?

Don't tell me you forgot about your Medulla Oblongata in our response mechanism?

Or did your Mama tell you something different?