Will the AWB ban Stripped Lowers in MD?

[Carlfer]

SCAR and ACR banned. Folding stock plus flash suppressor.

SCAR's do not have flash suppressors. They have muzzle brakes.

 

[bmelton]

a lower is not an AR-15.

From SB281, 3-208, (h) (1) - "Firearm" means a weapon that expels, is designed to expel, or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive; or the frame or receiver of such a weapon.

This, to me, means that an AR-15 lower receiver IS an AR-15, regardless of all else. Considering the "banned-by-name" list incudes "Colt AR-15, CAR-15, and all imitations", it is important to note that Colt bought Armalite, which makes them the holders of the AR-15 name. Any AR-15 is an imitation of the Colt AR-15, because Colt is the "original" AR-15 manufacturer.

Needless to say, the "intent" of the law is obviously to ban the AR-15. Whether or not that actually holds up in court remains to be seen. Of interest, the original California Assault Weapons ban disallowed "AR-series" and "AK-series" firearms from being owned or purchased, until such time as Harrott v County of Kings came along and got that declared as 'too vague'. Since then, they've had to keep the "banned by name" list up to date with each 'imitation' weapon. Of course, the Harrott decision came down from the California Supreme Court, and may or may not be considered precedent in the state of Maryland.

 

[bmelton]

SCAR's do not have flash suppressors. They have muzzle brakes.

From the bill, "FLASH SUPPRESSOR MEANS A DEVICE THAT FUNCTIONS, OR IS INTENDED TO FUNCTION, TO PERCEPTIBLY REDUCE OR REDIRECT MUZZLE FLASH FROM THE SHOOTER’S FIELD OF VISION.

As some 'muzzle breaks' also function, at least partially, as flash suppressors, only time will tell whether or not that distinction holds up.

 

[HarCo2ANewb]

Could you somehow pin the stock of the SCAR?

 

[Markp]

From SB281, 3-208, (h) (1) - "Firearm" means a weapon that expels, is designed to expel, or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive; or the frame or receiver of such a weapon.

Does "firearm" = "assault weapon"? I would assert that it does not! What they are saying is that a receiver is a "firearm", despite it not being a functional weapon and that it is controlled as a "firearm" would be... not as a "regulated firearm", not as a "copycat weapon", not as an "assault weapon". Why are you adding stuff to the definitions below that are NOT there?


(R) “Regulated firearm” means:
(1) a handgun; or
(2) a firearm that is any of the following specific assault weapons or their copies, regardless of which company produced and manufactured that assault weapon:


Does "firearm" = "assault weapon"? If so, then you have banned every firearm receiver manufactured. Because EVERY receiver is less than 29 inches.


(D) “ASSAULT WEAPON” MEANS:
(1) AN ASSAULT LONG GUN;
(2) AN ASSAULT PISTOL; OR
(3) A COPYCAT WEAPON.


(E) (1) “COPYCAT WEAPON” MEANS:

(I) A SEMIAUTOMATIC CENTERFIRE RIFLE THAT CAN ACCEPT A DETACHABLE MAGAZINE AND HAS ANY TWO OF THE FOLLOWING:
1. A FOLDING STOCK;
2. A GRENADE LAUNCHER OR FLARE LAUNCHER;
3. A FLASH SUPPRESSOR;

(II) A SEMIAUTOMATIC CENTERFIRE RIFLE THAT HAS A FIXED MAGAZINE WITH THE CAPACITY TO ACCEPT MORE THAN 10 ROUNDS;

(III) A SEMIAUTOMATIC CENTERFIRE RIFLE THAT HAS AN OVERALL LENGTH OF LESS THAN 29 INCHES;

(IV) A SEMIAUTOMATIC PISTOL WITH A FIXED MAGAZINE THAT CAN ACCEPT MORE THAN 10 ROUNDS;

(V) A SEMIAUTOMATIC SHOTGUN THAT HAS: A FOLDING STOCK

(VI) A SHOTGUN WITH A REVOLVING CYLINDER.

 

[ObsceneJesster]

From the bill, "FLASH SUPPRESSOR MEANS A DEVICE THAT FUNCTIONS, OR IS INTENDED TO FUNCTION, TO PERCEPTIBLY REDUCE OR REDIRECT MUZZLE FLASH FROM THE SHOOTER’S FIELD OF VISION.

As some 'muzzle breaks' also function, at least partially, as flash suppressors, only time will tell whether or not that distinction holds up.

I suppose you could also screw on a Compensator. Wasn't the whole reason why they said Flash Hiders were on the list is because people couldn't see where you were shooting from?

 

[ObsceneJesster]

From SB281, 3-208, (h) (1) - "Firearm" means a weapon that expels, is designed to expel, or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive; or the frame or receiver of such a weapon.

This, to me, means that an AR-15 lower receiver IS an AR-15, regardless of all else. Considering the "banned-by-name" list incudes "Colt AR-15, CAR-15, and all imitations", it is important to note that Colt bought Armalite, which makes them the holders of the AR-15 name. Any AR-15 is an imitation of the Colt AR-15, because Colt is the "original" AR-15 manufacturer.

Needless to say, the "intent" of the law is obviously to ban the AR-15. Whether or not that actually holds up in court remains to be seen. Of interest, the original California Assault Weapons ban disallowed "AR-series" and "AK-series" firearms from being owned or purchased, until such time as Harrott v County of Kings came along and got that declared as 'too vague'. Since then, they've had to keep the "banned by name" list up to date with each 'imitation' weapon. Of course, the Harrott decision came down from the California Supreme Court, and may or may not be considered precedent in the state of Maryland.

By your theory then.....Why wouldn't I be able to purchase a stripped lower receiver for my .22 Rimfire upper? Remember, only Centerfire rifles can be "Assault Rifles".

 

[GBMaryland]

From SB281, 3-208, (h) (1) - "Firearm" means a weapon that expels, is designed to expel, or may readily be converted to expel a projectile by the action of an explosive; or the frame or receiver of such a weapon.

This, however, means that my phased plasma cannon in the 50watt range is perfectly legal!

YES!

-wink-

 

[GBMaryland]

I suppose you could also screw on a Compensator. Wasn't the whole reason why they said Flash Hiders were on the list is because people couldn't see where you were shooting from?

One interesting issue is that of a compensated match handgun where the barrel bushing IS also a compensator.

I have an M9 designed for matches like this.

 

[scottymd]

Also the wording is now folding stock. An adjustable stock is now OK in the bill!

 

[Bravo757]

it is important to note that Colt bought Armalite, which makes them the holders of the AR-15 name. Any AR-15 is an imitation of the Colt AR-15, because Colt is the "original" AR-15 manufacturer.

Get you facts straightened out... Armalite was a subsidiary or Fairchild Aviation Corp. Eugen Stoner was one of the best mecahnical engineers Fairchild had and contributed greatly in the areas of the use of aluminum in aircraft. His input helped to create the formulations we now know as common aircraft grade aluminum. Stoner also worked for a while in Hagerstown, MD but he put his mechanical engineering skills to use leveling the machinery there - again his techniques helped lead the way to many common practices for this vital manufacturing function.

It was under the Armalite name that Stoner developed the AR-10 - which was the first of his designs that went to military trials to replace the M-14. It failed the test largely because of sabotage on the part of the trial board - things like taking hammers to the test sights and using the rifles as hammers to try and bust up the stocks, etc.

Later Stoner brought on 2 of the best minds he could find to help him reduce the size of his AR-10 design so that it could use a high velocity round Stoner thought would produce better battlefield effects and that became the prototype for what was the Armalite design 15 which became the M-16 with the civilian semi-auto version being given the name of the design, hence AR-15. But not just that fast.

A few working prototypes we're sent for the new military trials and again the new design was rejected so a few salesmen were hired to hock the lightweight design "15" rifle and it was a magical summer day when one of those salesman went to a picnic that an Air force General was attending - not a coincidence - and after the meal the salesman asked the good General if he'd like to do a little target practice with a new gun. The officer said sure but they had no targets- the salesman seeing some uneaten watermelons grabbed a couple and set them up. The General was given a brief lesson on the function of the gun and then finally hit one of the watermelons and the rest is history as they say. But here again not so fast readers....

The General saw this new lightweight rifle as thee answer to help secure Air Force bases not as a main battle rifle. It was ordered just for the Air Force at first and then upon the size of the order Armalite wasn't able to fullfill in the short time frame... enter stage left Mr. McNamara the Kennedy wonderboy who "insisted" that this Air Force rifle was the new dream-weapon the administration was looking for and wanted it as the main battle-rifle for the entire US armed forces. This created a real manufacturing problem for little near bankrupt Armalite who was "forced" so to speak into selling all the rights to their Design 15 to the much larger and more government friendly Colt Manufacturing. Colt never bought Armlite just the design and all the rights we know as the M-16/AR-15 family of rifles.

Eugen Stoner went on to develop the AR-18 which is piston driven and other weapons and weapon systems like the Stoner 63 machine gun under the Armalite name and then on his own. Later he joined forces with a younger gun nut name Knight as in Knight's Armament. If you want to see the actual guns Stoner produced, they're at Knight's Armament and many pics are online. My absolute favorite is the original mock-up Stoner made essentially in his garage.

Anyways if we gun loving peoples of the world can't get the facts right then we leave gaps for the mind-bending left to twist and contort the truth - I say stand in the gap and give them noting they can use.

Shoot Safe and Happy Shooting

 

[bmelton]

By your theory then.....Why wouldn't I be able to purchase a stripped lower receiver for my .22 Rimfire upper? Remember, only Centerfire rifles can be "Assault Rifles".

Don't get me wrong, I would love to be proven incorrect here, but honestly, which way do you think MSP is going to rule when you try to buy a stripped AR lower for your .22 upper?

Like has been said, it's a terribly written bill, and there are inaccuracies all over the place, but my money is that the interpretation is going to be pessimistic. The same ambiguous language that we want to see as loopholes could also be interpreted to, as MarkP said earlier, ban every firearm in Maryland.

I'm sure that over time we'll find out what the actual middle ground is, but it won't be until somebody tries to purchase a stripped AR lower to mate to a .22 rimfire upper and lets us know whether he was or wasn't allowed. As it's written, the law could go either way, and frankly, while I don't mean to be pessimistic, I do expect a pessimistic reading of the law by those that have to enforce it.

 

[teratos]

The lower for a .22 would not be able to accept anything other than .22. You will not be able to buy a standard lower using the argument that you are building a .22. Period.

 

[Vile Shadow]

This, however, means that my phased plasma cannon in the 50watt range is perfectly legal!

YES!

-wink-

How about my M41a pulse rifle w/grenade launcher?

 

[SWO Daddy]

SCAR and ACR banned. Folding stock plus flash suppressor.

Someone correct me if I'm wrong, but the PWC is a brake per the ATF, no?

 

[Gbh]

I would like someone to show me a AR15 stripped lower receiver that can be bought that is stamped HBAR and purchased without a 77R. I don't think it exists. So those people saying "depends on what kind of lower" may be misguided.

 

[bmelton]

I would like someone to show me a AR15 stripped lower receiver that can be bought that is stamped HBAR and purchased without a 77R. I don't think it exists. So those people saying "depends on what kind of lower" may be misguided.

That said, you *could* probably buy a Colt Sporter HBAR and replace the upper on it with, I dunno, a CQB configuration or something. At least, if you read the bill optimistically, which I refuse to do.

 

[teratos]

That said, you *could* probably buy a Colt Sporter HBAR and replace the upper on it with, I dunno, a CQB configuration or something. At least, if you read the bill optimistically, which I refuse to do.

You could do this before the ban goes into effect.

 

[bmelton]

Thank you for the correction. That makes sense, but I could easily see a reading where, so long as you purchased the HBAR before Oct 1, and the resultant firearm didn't end up with a bannable combination of 'evil features', you would either have an HBAR, or something you might classify as an assault weapon, but that is grandfathered in.

Like I said though, I prefer the most pessimistic interpretations, because that is how I imagine it will be read by 'those that matter'.

 

[ObsceneJesster]

The lower for a .22 would not be able to accept anything other than .22. You will not be able to buy a standard lower using the argument that you are building a .22. Period.

What about a 545x39 upper? Something truly can't be considered a "Copy Cat" when it isn't even chambered for the same round. In that case, the 762x39 upper as well. Different internals, different cartridge and technically not an AR-15.