What's going on with my loads?

[zebramochaman]

I ran two test batches of my first ever reloads. For the first batch I used 140GR Hornady XTP hollow points, Universal Clays powder and CCI #500 primers.
The second batch I used 158GR lead round nose bullets, Universal Clays powder and CCI #500 primers. The powder was the recommended starting load grains.
At the range, the first batch (XTPs) shot fine although pretty dirty. The second batch shot fine but there was a significant amount of unburned powder left in the cases. What would have caused this?

 

[NathanJ]

What type of round? Did the powder compromised my something ?

 

[Mason-Dixon Baseball]

Maybe not the best title for this thread?..... Clandestine commenting 3--2--1------

 

[boule]

Pretty many things possible - from what it looks like there was not enough pressure to get a complete burn.

Did you crimp the bullets? What are the lead bullets sized to?
Usually lead bullets move at a lower pressure than jacketed and thus may lower burn pressure. With that, you can easily get leftover powder in the cases. Also bear in mind that lead bullets should be a little bit oversied; .001 usually.

The solution would be to apply a stout crimp, use a heavier load, use another powder or use a different bullet.

 

[frozencesium]

what boule said....however i wouldn't bother to crimp pistol rounds (other than say .357 sig). You are suffering from lack of preasure causing the powder to not burn. Modern powders burn faster the higher presure they are under. The simplest solution would be to increase your charge weight (remember minimums are just that...minimums) slowly until you find a load that shoots well and fully burns the powder.

BTW Universal Clay's works great in my XD .45ACP.

 

[marlin.357]

Since you are new to this you know that there is Clays, Universal Clays and International Clays and that the loading data is different for each of them?

What Caliber?

And when you say it was the "recommended starting load" what exactly was that in grains?

 

[tkd4life]

You could get much more info, if you provide much more info. What caliber were you shooting? What do you mean there was unburned powder left in the case? Pics? Was there unburned powder left in the barrel? What length is your barrel? What were you shooting? The list goes on.

 

[Marauder]

Judging on your bullet weights, 38 special? or 357 mag? How much crimp? Need more info..

 

[zebramochaman]

What I loaded was 38 Specials. The lead round nose 158gr bullets I used were .358 diameter and I applied a light crimp.
I tested rounds using three of my Rugers (GP-100, 4" BBL, Security Six, 4" BBl and SPS-101, 3" BBL).
My loading bench set up is in the garage where it can get fairly cold. would that have any effect?

 

[zebramochaman]

Since you are new to this you know that there is Clays, Universal Clays and International Clays and that the loading data is different for each of them?

What Caliber?

And when you say it was the "recommended starting load" what exactly was that in grains?

3.5 grains Universal Clays. This is the recommended start load according to my Lee Manual and the load data that came with my dies.

 

[boule]

My loading bench set up is in the garage where it can get fairly cold. would that have any effect?

That depends on how you measure your charges. Some digital scales will have issues with low temperatures since the piezzoelectric elements tend to function differently at temperatures that are way off ambient.

Nonetheless, 358 or 359 bullets should do fine in your gun. Your problem is definately a pressure issue.

The charge indicated does not even push the bullet to 800 fps and the pressure indicated is really low.

First order of business - what crimp do you use and what is your OAL and seating depth? I load .38 spec rounds for CAS with titegroup to these velocities and for a decent burn, they need a really stout crimp. Forget what you read about rifle rounds, strong roll crimp or lee factory crimp will work!
If you don't want to crimp much stronger, some reduction in burn volume (aka seating the bullet deeper) will work as well.
Finally, INCREASE YOUR CHARGE if you don't want to run after your rounds to catch them.

Just as a personal note. Rounds loaded at this velocity usually work fine with three powders. BP, titegroup and trail boss - and by word of mouth american select and VV N430 are fine as well. With many other powders you get positional burn differences, though.

 

[tdt91]

Ask your doctor!!!

 

[Indiana Jones]

Ask your doctor!!! [/QUOTE

or honda53s' wife. heyooooooo

 

[boule]

Ask your doctor!!!

 

[Baccusboy]

I'm friends with a former porn star. Should I ask her?

 

[zebramochaman]

That depends on how you measure your charges. Some digital scales will have issues with low temperatures since the piezzoelectric elements tend to function differently at temperatures that are way off ambient.

Nonetheless, 358 or 359 bullets should do fine in your gun. Your problem is definately a pressure issue.

The charge indicated does not even push the bullet to 800 fps and the pressure indicated is really low.

First order of business - what crimp do you use and what is your OAL and seating depth? I load .38 spec rounds for CAS with titegroup to these velocities and for a decent burn, they need a really stout crimp. Forget what you read about rifle rounds, strong roll crimp or lee factory crimp will work!
If you don't want to crimp much stronger, some reduction in burn volume (aka seating the bullet deeper) will work as well.
Finally, INCREASE YOUR CHARGE if you don't want to run after your rounds to catch them.

Just as a personal note. Rounds loaded at this velocity usually work fine with three powders. BP, titegroup and trail boss - and by word of mouth american select and VV N430 are fine as well. With many other powders you get positional burn differences, though.

I appreciate the input. In fact, when I weighed the charges I was coming up a little short of the starting loads. Not by much, but being a newbie in the art of reloading I wanted to err on the side of caution. From the responses, I am tending to agree that the problem I am experiencing is due to too light loads. I will try ramping up the charge and increasing the crimp. You experienced re-loaders may think I am being overly cautious but being a total newbie I have visions of blowing up my gun and injuring myself or bystanders or creating a run of squib rounds. I will eventually get it right with the help of my more experienced cohorts on this site. My thanks to all contributors.

 

[zebramochaman]

I know that there may be powders that will work better for specific rounds but I chose Universal because it can be used in most of the pistol calibers I intend to reload. After 38 Special, I will create some 357 Magnums.
My plan is to get proficient in loading straight-walled cases and then progress to rifle necked cases. One of my favorite sidearms is chambered for 357 SIG. I would love to be able to create a ton of reloads in this caliber (I have hundreds of once fired brass in this caliber). I also shoot a lot of .30 Carbine, .223 in my AR-15, 7.62x39 in my SKSs as well as other calibers. I just need to get the basics right.

 

[dan8480]

I've heard of people having the same problems with universal clays. You definitely could benefit from some more pressure. I've also heard of the same thing happening when using that powder for 45 acp loads as well. You could increase the crimp, which may be my first choice, but personally I wouldn't set the bullet any deeper. I would maybe consider using a different powder, maybe bullseye? It is also a versatile pistol powder, and it's perfect for 38 spc and 357. You may need to load them closer to the +p range to get a good burn.

 

[boule]

In fact, when I weighed the charges I was coming up a little short of the starting loads.

There is a reason it is usually called minimum starting load. Many times, it just does not work below. If you are new, try not to undercut the suggested loads.

You experienced re-loaders may think I am being overly cautious but being a total newbie I have visions of blowing up my gun and injuring myself or bystanders or creating a run of squib rounds.

That is how you come to appreciate a certain darwinian element in the hobby of reloading.


May I ask what your target velocity is? That will somewhat determine which and how much poder you should use.

 

[pcfixer]

I ran two test batches of my first ever reloads. For the first batch I used 140GR Hornady XTP hollow points, Universal Clays powder and CCI #500 primers.
The second batch I used 158GR lead round nose bullets, Universal Clays powder and CCI #500 primers. The powder was the recommended starting load grains.
At the range, the first batch (XTPs) shot fine although pretty dirty. The second batch shot fine but there was a significant amount of unburned powder left in the cases. What would have caused this?

If your crimping, and seat at COAL; I'd try increase of powder from minium
since you didn't say what it is I can't check your load. Try mid range
powder charge.
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