Wear and carry course disappointment.

[UCO___]

So I took a wear and carry course and the classroom was more of a "So you've never held a gun before, let us teach you the basics of pistols".
Apparently its a HQL and wear and carry class. I had to show the 3 people next to me how to load a magazine. Now I am all for teaching people about firearms and how to handle them properly, but a wear and carry class is not that place. I can't wait until the range portion next class.
The really sad part is the fact that this is a highly respectable firearms training company. All I will say is it's on the Eastern Shore. If you are over here and want to make sure you don't go there message me privately.

Has anyone else's wear and carry class been like this? I feel like I got jipped on some training, especially for the price I shelled out.

I read thru a multiple pages and the one thing I didn't see is that this required course is a check box and only that. I would not consider this a training course.

 

[mpollan1]

When I took the class, I felt the same way. A high percentage of trainees should have been in some sort of firearm basics course. Even though it will be inconvenient for me, the carry class should be much more rigorous. I train independently of regulations, but many people do not. I am more than a little concerned about the increasing numbers of concealed carry permit holders in Maryland. Just because you can, doesn’t necessarily mean you should. It is not easy to train in Maryland. There are limited public facilities and quality training tends to cost quite a bit. I hope new permit holders look at carrying as a HUGE responsibility and take it very seriously. When I drive around and witness the incompetence of people that “qualified” to operate a motor vehicle, I can’t help but worry about the people who may soon be carrying firearms.

I had a somewhat fleeting/concurrent thought about new carry holders but then thought about the other 43 (?) states and there is not blood flowing in the streets there so I think we'll be OK.

 

[brownie55]

Bless your hearts.

 

[Occam]

Bless your hearts.

When you snark, it's good form to quote the snarkee so we know who to root for, where the send the shinebox, etc.

 

[Mark75H]

When you snark, it's good form to quote the snarkee so we know who to root for, where the send the shinebox, etc.

I think he's a shotgun snarker.

 

[rwbow1969]

What's it like?

Well, it varies from "I've never picked up a gun" to "I'm John Wick" or the phone calls asking "I got that HQL thingy.. is that all I need to carry now.".... "The Supreme Court said we can carry now." "Why do I need this class, I already have a gun." "Will we have to be there the whole time." "Can you just say it was 16 hours" "You know I can shoot, just sign off for me"

Right now.... that's what it's like.. lol.

 

[rwbow1969]

Hey, Rod! Good to see you!

Yes!!! How's that glorious hair??

 

[teratos]

Yes!!! How's that glorious hair??

Well…I’d be lying if I didn’t say…glorious.

 

[Jaybeez]

"Can I use my 25 acp Taurus?"
Do you have a holster for it?
"Why do I need a holster?"
So i can teach you how to carry. Do you have 200 rounds of 25 acp?
"No, where can I get ammo by saturday?"

1 in 10 pay for the class and don't even show up.

"Where can I get a holster for *obscure gun nobody would ever carry*?" Then asks me if *name of local gun shop* would carry them.

I also get the "I'm super experienced, and these are all the great guns I could bring for class, and all the great gear I have, but BTW my wife wants to come too, she's probably going to want to use *giant wrist breaking revolver* or *tiny feather weight magnum* where can I get her a holster and ammo by Friday?"
So yeah, I literally have advanced shooters trying to bring noobs to the same class. I'm getting groups of 3 to 6 that want to take classes together, and their skill levels don't match.
It's normal though. That's always been the case with the HQL classes and NRA classes. Our instruction is results based, students that need extra attention get extra attention. To pass they must show they learned the skills.

I have to say I love all the discussion here. Maybe a Friday afternoon/evening Advanced HQL class for new shooters that want to take the carry class Saturday and Sunday would work.

The next level advanced training is the renewal class, or uspsa, idpa, steel challenge, NRA Defensive pistol, or a combat pistol 102 level class.

 

[mpollan1]

Well, it varies from "I've never picked up a gun" to "I'm John Wick" or the phone calls asking "I got that HQL thingy.. is that all I need to carry now.".... "The Supreme Court said we can carry now." "Why do I need this class, I already have a gun." "Will we have to be there the whole time." "Can you just say it was 16 hours" "You know I can shoot, just sign off for me"

Right now.... that's what it's like.. lol.

Thanks for the courtesy of your reply. Sure sounds like a hot mess. Hope things normalize after this initial surge subsides. I decided to hold off with the class until after said surge coupled with the unfortunate fact that 99% of my time is spent within the confines of Stalag MoCo.

Cheers

 

[BurkeM]

So I took a wear and carry course and the classroom was more of a "So you've never held a gun before, let us teach you the basics of pistols".
Apparently its a HQL and wear and carry class. I had to show the 3 people next to me how to load a magazine. Now I am all for teaching people about firearms and how to handle them properly, but a wear and carry class is not that place. I can't wait until the range portion next class.
The really sad part is the fact that this is a highly respectable firearms training company. All I will say is it's on the Eastern Shore. If you are over here and want to make sure you don't go there message me privately.

Has anyone else's wear and carry class been like this? I feel like I got jipped on some training, especially for the price I shelled out.

What you experienced matches the very skimpy course outline provided by MSP to QHIC instructors for the 4 hour HQL training.

Many instructors are not prepared to write military quality lesson plans for 12-14 hours of classroom training (saving 2-4 hours for range time). Therefore, many (not all) simply stretch the 4 hr lesson plan into 12 hours with anecdotes, videos, etc.

Maryland requires “16 hours” of in person training, but gives nearly no guidance on what to cover or to what standards to demand students to achieve.

The average HGP student is what you saw- someone who knows nothing about handguns and has no previous exposure other than movies and TV. Therefore, every instructor must begin with the very basics.

Some instructors use the NRA basic pistol course for 8-12 hours, some use the NRA lesson plan for CCW, some use a mix of the two. USCCA instructors use the USCCA lesson plan for CCW classes.

Perhaps when you are done, you may chose to use your knowledge and experience to become an instructor yourself and compete with the class you’ve taken.

 

[BurkeM]

I can't wait until the range portion next class.


Has anyone else's wear and carry class been like this? I feel like I got jipped on some training, especially for the price I shelled out.

The MGA and MSP don’t even require trainers to teach how to draw from the holster or how to safely holster a loaded handgun.

That’s what should be included, among a dozen other blocks of instruction.

 

[BurkeM]

... If I went for a W&C and got a basic safety class I'd probably be pretty disappointed.

MSP requires all QHIC instructors to provide no less than 4 hours of basic safety training, Maryland laws, etc.

 

[BurkeM]

I wouldn’t be pissed if 500 people were in my class as long as I had a seat. If I didn’t sign up for training on the day of the Bruen decision, it’d be a while before I could otherwise complete it because the weekend classes fill up fast.

100 people in your CCW class means there are 100 new applications in the pool to show Frosh and the MGA that they were wrong. Anything to boost that number is good in my book.

 

[BurkeM]

Same here. I'm training-exempt, but had planned to take a class anyway as to not miss out on all the mega-important info MSP says I need. After reading this thread, I think I'll save my time and money for something else.

I’ll send you the outline drafted by MSP.

 

[BurkeM]

Indeed.

Let me demonstrate basic competency required for the permit without sitting through tedium and/or let me spend my training dollars on something that will demonstrably advance my skill set beyond that which is required. Everyone wins.

But alas, Maryland.

Here’s a solution- don’t take the W&C class at all.

Take one of the basic pistol INSTRUCTOR classes, and become a QHIC yourself. Train yourself to train others.

Then write your own lesson plans and make better trained graduates.

 

[Biggfoot44]

Because 9 years ago , MGA decreed that W&C applicants had to spend 16hrs physically in a Class . Their specific class .

 

[platoonDaddy]

What reasons do you have for why the slingshot is bad and what method do you teach that you feel is better?

If you have blood on your hand, you are unable to use the slingshot method.

One of Pat’s classes at PFT, they had us wipe the slide with a little transmission oil, this simulated blood. There is no way in hell you can use the slingshot method to rack.

Train as u fight.

 

[tashby]

So I took a wear and carry course and the classroom was more of a "So you've never held a gun before, let us teach you the basics of pistols".
Apparently its a HQL and wear and carry class. I had to show the 3 people next to me how to load a magazine. Now I am all for teaching people about firearms and how to handle them properly, but a wear and carry class is not that place. I can't wait until the range portion next class.
The really sad part is the fact that this is a highly respectable firearms training company. All I will say is it's on the Eastern Shore. If you are over here and want to make sure you don't go there message me privately.

Has anyone else's wear and carry class been like this? I feel like I got jipped on some training, especially for the price I shelled out.

Let's be honest the Maryland state police is not going to release their curriculum concerning their firearms training course. The average Joe holding the classes are more like a shade tree firearms instructor. In Western Maryland we are lucky to have a retired state police officer. Check with Garrett College in Deep creek lake, md. Also not everyone should have a wear and carry but to manage that will be the fortitude and dedication it takes to carry daily.

 

[Samlab]

Patience always. When I’ve taken a course professionally and realize I’m more experienced and knowledgeable than the instructor I don’t say or do anything. I take the course and if I know that he/she just confused the entire class I just simply ask a simple question to help the others that just got confused. It’s never about me it’s about everyone else. They have a basic requirements outline that they must cover no matter the level of exposure. They don’t know you personally or anyone else in the class. Look at it that way.