SBR Question

[rmbstyle]

I'm going to submit a form 1 for a sbr. I haven't fully decided what barrel length I want, I am just trying to get a sbr lower in case the trust route is eliminated. So my question is if I put down a 11.5" on the form 1, but end up getting a 10.5" upper, what would I have to do? Or would it even matter?

Thanks

 

[erwos]

I don't think you're under any real obligation to notify them.

 

[outrider58]

They don't care bbl length, afaik. Just OAL. Give 29.5". That should cover you, assuming we're talking about center fire SBRs.

 

[rmbstyle]

They don't care bbl length, afaik. Just OAL. Give 29.5". That should cover you, assuming we're talking about center fire SBRs.

Okay, thanks!

 

[rmbstyle]

Also does the manufacture of the lower that is used for the sbr have to be on the handgun roster? I keep hearing something along those lines. I have a stripped Seekins SBA15 lower that I would like to use.

 

[NateIU10]

Roster does not matter for Form 1. When you file the form one, technically, the first configuration when you make the firearm must be in the stated configuration.

 

[rmbstyle]

Roster does not matter for Form 1. When you file the form one, technically, the first configuration when you make the firearm must be in the stated configuration.

Great! Thanks for clearing that up for me!

 

[Klunatic]

If you don't end up making a SBR with 11.2" or change to 10.2" in the original configuration you have to notify the NFA of the "permanent change" . If you keep the original configuration and add a 10.2" barrel you don't have to notify them. In the end its just a letter to the NFA, you don't need their permission to make the change.

 

[outrider58]

If you don't end up making a SBR with 11.2" or change to 10.2" in the original configuration you have to notify the NFA of the "permanent change" . If you keep the original configuration and add a 10.2" barrel you don't have to notify them. In the end its just a letter to the NFA, you don't need their permission to make the change.

From what I've read, you always want to 'make' your SBR the smallest allowed. You can later make longer barreled uppers for it without worry but, go smaller and you have to notify ATF. That's the way I've interoperated the rules. IANAL

 

[Klunatic]

I

From what I've read, you always want to 'make' your SBR the smallest allowed. You can later make longer barreled uppers for it without worry but, go smaller and you have to notify ATF. That's the way I've interoperated the rules. IANAL

Actually you can go longer or shorter and the NFA doesn't care as long as you maintain the parts for the original configuration. To the NFA a SBR is an SBR no matter the length of the barrel. You only have to notify the NFA if the change is permanent and you disposed of the original barrel. Maryland on the other hand may not allow a shorter configuration if it is under 29" OAL. There is some uncertainty about the law regarding pre 10/13 lowers.

 

[NateIU10]

Actually you can go longer or shorter and the NFA doesn't care as long as you maintain the parts for the original configuration. You only have to notify the NFA if the change is permanent and you disposed of the original barrel. Maryland on the other hand may not allow a shorter configuration if it is under 29" OAL. There is some uncertainty about the law regarding pre 10/13 lowers.

You actually don't have to notify ATF of any changes, temporary or permanent. They "suggest" you do, but it's not required.

 

[Pinecone]

There is some uncertainty about the law regarding pre 10/13 lowers.

What uncertainty?????

If you did not SBR it before 10/1/13, it must be at least 29" long OAL.

They did approve some last spring for pre-10/1/13 lowers shorter then 29", but have since corrected that.

BATFE and MSP stance is, the date you BUILD the SBR is the critical date. And since any Form 1 filed now is post 10/1/13, they must be over 29" OAL no matter when the lower was purchased.

 

[rico903]

All guess I'm over cautious by the questions I ask but just trying to be safe. If I from 1 an SBR of legal length in MD and at some point move to a gun friendly state would I be allowed to put a shorter upper on it making it less than 21"?

 

[Pinecone]

Yes.

In fact, you can go to a free state with an MD SBR and put a shorter than 10.2" upper making it shorter than 29"

Just don't bring it back into the state that way.

I don't know that MD has ever used constructive intent for having a short upper for an SBR.

 

[Klunatic]

What uncertainty?????

If you did not SBR it before 10/1/13, it must be at least 29" long OAL.

They did approve some last spring for pre-10/1/13 lowers shorter then 29", but have since corrected that.

BATFE and MSP stance is, the date you BUILD the SBR is the critical date. And since any Form 1 filed now is post 10/1/13, they must be over 29" OAL no matter when the lower was purchased.

ATF does not care what you do with a lower SBR, you can make it shorter but you "may" be in violation of MD law. MD law is unclear regarding pre 10/13 lowers. Nowhere in the law does it state the rifle has to have been built as a SBR prior to 10/13. It only says 10/13 prior rifles/lowers must have purchase order prior to 10/13. Post 10/13 you cannot have or transfer a CCW or ALG.

 

[outrider58]

You actually don't have to notify ATF of any changes, temporary or permanent. They "suggest" you do, but it's not required.

I'll get it right one of these days.

 

[Pinecone]

ATF does not care what you do with a lower SBR, you can make it shorter but you "may" be in violation of MD law. MD law is unclear regarding pre 10/13 lowers. Nowhere in the law does it state the rifle has to have been built as a SBR prior to 10/13. It only says 10/13 prior rifles/lowers must have purchase order prior to 10/13. Post 10/13 you cannot have or transfer a CCW or ALG.

BATFE does care, in that they will not approve a Form 1 now to built a <29" SBR (Copy Cat Weapon).

Once you have it tax stamped, then MD law kicks in if you modify it. Although, several places state/recommmend that you NOT go shorter than your Form 1 submittal to not get BATFE mad at you.

IF you built the SBR prior to 10/1/13, you are not limited to the >29" requirement.

And yes, MD law is not clear on building a pre-10/1/13 lower into a banned RIFLE configuration after 10/1/13. Asking the question of the MSP has gotten conflicting answers.

Building a pre-10/1/13 lower into an SBR now gains you nothing, as BATFE will not approve it at <29"

 

[Klunatic]

BATFE does care, in that they will not approve a Form 1 now to built a <29" SBR (Copy Cat Weapon).

Once you have it tax stamped, then MD law kicks in if you modify it. Although, several places state/recommmend that you NOT go shorter than your Form 1 submittal to not get BATFE mad at you.

IF you built the SBR prior to 10/1/13, you are not limited to the >29" requirement.

And yes, MD law is not clear on building a pre-10/1/13 lower into a banned RIFLE configuration after 10/1/13. Asking the question of the MSP has gotten conflicting answers.

Building a pre-10/1/13 lower into an SBR now gains you nothing, as BATFE will not approve it at <29"

It is true that ATF will not approve a <29" OAL on an SBR, but after approval they do not care if you modify the length shorter or longer. That is a question I just got answered by speaking at length with Andrew at the ATF. The ATF recommends you notify them of a change in the configuration if its permanent but it is not required. It is only a question of the ambiguity of MD law regarding pre 10/13 lowers in an SBR configuration.

 

[rico903]

This pre/post 10/13 stuff sucks. I've had my lowers since 2008. Just din't have an inclination to SBR one before.

 

[rayrevolver]

Since the length is stock extended is accounted for, can you use a Law Tactical Folding Stock to buy you 1.2" of additional length?

And then Vltor A5 if you wanted another 0.75" added?

Then you could have an 8.25" barrel and it should meet the 29" OAL requirement.