Reports of Mass Disapprovals of eForm 1 Silencers

[redsandman6]

https://www.recoilweb.com/reports-o...4BXhCqi8nVE_nW0iT_n605xG7Ba-4pGHqLv8AyhFTZHx0

anyone hear about this?

 

[magnumpi]

I saw it on a Form 1 Facebook page I follow. Apparently ATF is now denying all form 1 suppressor applications. This is an excerpt from the denials;

"THE PART FROM WHICH YOU INTEND TO MAKE A SILENCER ALREADY MEETS THE NFAS DEFINITION OF SILENCER. THE PART WAS NOT REGISTERED NOR TRANSFERRED IN COMPLIANCE WITH THE NFA, THEREFORE, YOUR EFORM 1 APPLICATION TO MAKE A SILENCER IS DISAPPROVED. "

If I remember correctly nowhere on the application does it have any mention of parts used. How do they know what "PART" the applicant used to build a silencer? The part or parts could be a solvent trap kit or just a raw piece of metal that you plan to machine into a silencer. According to this a block of metal or a piece of pipe could met their definition of a silencer. The ATF is way out of control.

 

[Nickberg500]

Big if true.

 

[Occam]

And I wouldn't want to bother building my own, you gubmint weasels, if you could just let me buy a factory can with paperwork that will come back while I'm still alive.

 

[traveller]

The same line of thought that got everyone who bought parts from Diversified Machining a love letter. If they consider a part to already represent a regulated item but it wasn't sold as such you can't 'build' your own silencer with it.

 

[traveller]

The part or parts could be a solvent trap kit or just a raw piece of metal that you plan to machine into a silencer. According to this a block of metal or a piece of pipe could met their definition of a silencer. The ATF is way out of control.

It's the 'solvent trap' part they consider to already represent a regulated component. Bar-stock and pipes are not the issue.

 

[outrider58]

The same line of thought that got everyone who bought parts from Diversified Machining a love letter. If they consider a part to already represent a regulated item but it wasn't sold as such you can't 'build' your own silencer with it.

It's the "INTENDED FOR USE AS" part that they're going on. I disagree, of course. In reality, if someone bought the "kit" and never altered(finished) it, it isn't a suppressor. Just the usual FTA being dicks...

 

[teratos]

Their ability to define just about anything as a machine gun, suppressor etc. is crazy. WGAS if someone buys parts with the INTENTION of making a suppressor. I am buying bar stock with intention of making a suppressor. As long as they fill out the paperwork before you make it, AFT should have no problem with a legal activity. AFT makes it shady by denying the applications.

 

[Alea Jacta Est]

Tyranny by other words is still tyranny.

They’re just looking to infringe by any and every way they can in hopes of WWNC…

 

[boothdoc]

It sounds to me like they forced their own hand by the one office sending out the diversified letters. This way they feel they are closing any loopholes they created.

I think it is wrong but it is good to be king

 

[magnumpi]

It's the 'solvent trap' part they consider to already represent a regulated component. Bar-stock and pipes are not the issue.

But the point is the ATF does not know if you are using a solvent trap or bar stock to build the suppressor. Nowhere on the application asks what material or parts you are using, just the size and caliber.

 

[TrappedinMD]

So can you build an SBR using rifle parts????? Or do I need to mine the ore to extract the metal to start from scratch??? FJB

 

[whistlersmother]

So can you build an SBR using rifle parts????? Or do I need to mine the ore to extract the metal to start from scratch??? FJB

If you mine the ore with the intent to make SBR or supressor, you need the stamp first.

They just have to spring immediately into existence.

If you apply for stamp, you have intent and therefore are illegally in possession.

/sarcasm

 

[traveller]

But the point is the ATF does not know if you are using a solvent trap or bar stock to build the suppressor. Nowhere on the application asks what material or parts you are using, just the size and caliber.

Could be that they cross-matched their database of pending form 1 for suppressors with the data they mined after the Diversified raid. If you show up as purchaser of now deemed 'illegal' parts they presume (maybe falsely) that you are going to use that part for your build.

As for it being 'mass disapproval'. It may well be that there is a high degree of overlap between 'purchasers of silencer kits' and 'form 1 filers for silencers'. Would be interesting to see if there is a group of people who never had business dealings with one of the kit or 'solvent trap' peddlers and submitted a form 1. If that 'whittled from bar-stock' group gets approvals you have your answer.

 

[erwos]

Could be that they cross-matched their database of pending form 1 for suppressors with the data they mined after the Diversified raid. If you show up as purchaser of now deemed 'illegal' parts they presume (maybe falsely) that you are going to use that part for your build.

I'm skeptical, but it's not impossible.

As for it being 'mass disapproval'. It may well be that there is a high degree of overlap between 'purchasers of silencer kits' and 'form 1 filers for silencers'.

I'm sure the overlap is about 99%, if not higher.

Someone else brought up form 1 SBRs. These are a somewhat different beast given that there are no "SBR parts" like there are "silencer parts", at least as semi-defined in law and regulation. I would not expect any change on SBRs, except for the whole brace thing.

 

[magnumpi]

Could be that they cross-matched their database of pending form 1 for suppressors with the data they mined after the Diversified raid. If you show up as purchaser of now deemed 'illegal' parts they presume (maybe falsely) that you are going to use that part for your build.

As for it being 'mass disapproval'. It may well be that there is a high degree of overlap between 'purchasers of silencer kits' and 'form 1 filers for silencers'. Would be interesting to see if there is a group of people who never had business dealings with one of the kit or 'solvent trap' peddlers and submitted a form 1. If that 'whittled from bar-stock' group gets approvals you have your answer.

Cross matching the Diversified database is a possibility, but some are posting that they never ordered any parts from anywhere and were still getting denied.
Another possibility being floated is that it is a glitch in the new system that they just "improved". Apparently there has been several issues and bugs with it. I guess time will tell.

 

[camo556]

I saw this on the form 1 fb page. tf is going on?

 

[Alea Jacta Est]

Just ATF folks looking to make the list…

Can you imagine telling your friends and family…I WORK FOR BATFE AND WE CONTROL AMERICA. WE DINT NEED NO STINKIN LAWS. WE ARE THE LAW.

May come a day when that’s exhibit one at sentencing, eh?

 

[whistlersmother]

Some "IT" dude writing SQL that can't even figure out how to watch porn on his AFT computer. What's a constraint?

Other possibility is the AFT has no idea who ordered what and just blanket denied everyone. It will now cross-reference any new applications with the records it has gleaned from places like Diversified.

 

[traveller]

Cross matching the Diversified database is a possibility, but some are posting that they never ordered any parts from anywhere and were still getting denied.
Another possibility being floated is that it is a glitch in the new system that they just "improved". Apparently there has been several issues and bugs with it. I guess time will tell.

If there is indeed a group of people who started by mining ore like a Minecraft character, there is a good chance that it was an intentional 'glitch' by the agency to deny everyone with the same stock answer. The agency is now waiting for the bar-stock group to file reconsiderations while the folks who bought pre-fabricated kits may choose to remain very very quiet.