R&R to House of Delegates: "We Will Not Comply!"

[fidelity]

...

MODS: PLEASE LOCK THIS THREAD!

Please don't. I've got time, and am looking forward to the discussion.

So we have a moderator on MDS from Texas?

Yes, former Marylander. Good guy from my interactions with him. Please note that the site owner is also in Texas.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

 

[Bolts Rock]

Well, maybe if they find out NICS applies to them too and they have no way to work around it illegally, then they might put forth more effort to change the laws. How does it make any sense to have a NICS check for new gun purchases, but not for a FTF purchase. With the FTF possibility, it is simple to get around NICS. So, either scrap NICS or NICS for everybody. Then, change the disqualifying crimes. I don't even like the fact that criminals are banned from their 2nd Amendment Right. They should get it back upon release from prison. I could live with violent felons needing to do a little bit more to get their 2nd Amendment Right back, but that is about it. Mental records reporting should be shored up. That is my ideal world. A firearm for every free person, except those that are mentally ill.

Newsflash, I'm NICS exempt. I have a pistol permit in a Brady Exempt state. Here's how it works when I buy a gun from a dealer in Alabama:

Me- Hi LGS, I want that gun.

LGS- Fill out the 4473, show me your DL and pistol permit, give me $XXX.XX.

Me- fills out forms, forks over money.

LGS- chucks 4473 in file clerk's inbox to process the Bound Book then file the form. Hands me gun and receipt.

Me- walks out with gun.


How it works with a private seller:

Me- I want that gun.

PS- may or may not ask to see DL and permit.

Me- hands PS money.

PS- gives me gun with bill of sale.

Me- walks off with gun.

The only difference is no 4473 in a dealer's filing cabinet. In Brady Exempt states we like it like that. Here's the best part, I've done it both ways in front of an ATF agent and they don't even bat an eye because it's legal in Alabama and most of Free America. Even better, 24% of the adults in Alabama have pistol permits and are NICS exempt (highest percentage of permits in the nation) and there are 37 Brady Exempt states where permit holders are NICS exempt. When you see reports of 2.X million NICS checks on Black Friday rethink the numbers due to the very significant number of NICS exempt people.

PS- at any given gunshow here 1/4 to 1/3 of the sellers are private. At almost all competitive shooting events, no matter the discipline, private sales are common. Hell, after every monthly match at one cowboy club there will be anywhere from 6 to 12 guns for sale and most of them sell. Same in Tennessee, Georgia and Mississippi.

This recent Gallup poll shows 92% of those polled favor requiring background checks for all gun sales. You have to scroll about 1/4 of the way down and it is the 2nd of a group of statements.

https://news.gallup.com/poll/1645/guns.aspx

https://www.politifact.com/wisconsi...americans-support-background-checks-all-gun-/

Just do a Google search of "Do Americans favor universal background checks" and read up on it. Figure out which way the wind is blowing, and in this case it is pretty much a hurricane. Then, try to fight that hurricane. My only question is whether the NICS check has actually been litigated. If it is Constitutional, then I seriously doubt we will be avoiding universal background checks.

You need to crawl out of that leftist pustule around DC and visit Free America. Almost nobody here likes NICS checks and I have only heard one person say they support UBC. How common is dislike for gun control down here? In AL, GA, MS and TN I've had teenaged counter girls at Burger King, Arby's, Popeyes, the grocery store, the gas station, etc. go off in well reasoned rants against gun control using many of the same arguments and data sources used in the General Asylum just because they saw my Sig gimme cap or 2A t-shirt. None of my black neighbors like any form of gun control but then they know it's based on racist ******** from personal experience. Polls are designed to elicit specific responses from very small sample sizes, that's called confirmation bias and all polls use it. You live in a bubble that does not even come close to the rest of America.

An a liberal would say that "The Constitution being a concrete document" is conservative speak.

The Constitution is open to interpretation by SCOTUS and it is open to Amendment. So, the moderate says "The Constitution is concrete, SCOTUS is a sledgehammer and Amendment is a jackhammer."

The Constitution is concrete and even provides a concrete way to change it. It is very difficult to change for a reason. Yet some folks like you are happy to let it be nibbled to death by vermin.

Maybe. However, the Constitution was also meant to be interpreted by the citizenry. The 2A is really an incredible thing, if you think about it. A bunch of guys who came up with a document defining a government...and wait for it....they allowed the People to reserve the power to overthrow that government. All three branches of government were seen as a threat. There is little wiggle room in “shall not be infringed”.

Thee was literally an amendment proposed to allow revolt should gov't become tyrannical but it got dropped.

Both the Demanding Moms and Emo Jen have called, they want you back.

 

[babalou]

dude

I'm not diehard anything. I've thought the matter through and I side with universal background checks and not everything the NRA espouses to ask for more money from me.

Riddle me this, why do I have to go through a NICS check when I buy a new gun, but I don't have to go through a NICS check to buy a used gun? Can you answer me how that makes sense? If you cannot tell me how that makes sense, then I suggest your biggest task be pushing for the scrapping of the NICS check in its entirety or the application of NICS to private sales.

All the hell bent pro-2A people say, "We are all for keeping guns out of the hands of criminals and mentally ill people". That comes out of the right side of their mouth. Then, they are ok with FTF transactions without a NICS check wherein the seller just has to have no reason whatsoever to believe the buyer is prohibited. Seller: "You prohibited?" Buyer: "Nope." Seller: "Good enough for me."

So, dazzle me with some logical reason why the NICS check is good or bad. If it does not work, then dazzle me with something even more logical that will keep firearms out of the hands of criminals and mentally ill people. Or, you can do like teratos and just tell me that you are alright with criminals and mentally ill people having firearms.

Over the past couple of years, I have heard too many incorrect arguments and illogical arguments from our side, while the hand is out for more and more money.

So, dazzle me with actual knowledge and logical reasoning. Make me fall out of my chair as to why NICS on new guns makes sense, but not on used guns from somebody that doesn't know the buyer from Adam. I challenge you to knock me out of my chair.

Dude, you have some odd twisted Munchausen by proxy symptoms where you cause issues for attention. You ride in and talk things to counter attack others yet offer no solution. You like to play both sides and eventually neither will be with you. An example of this is a post you made a while ago where you took it as a badge of honer to be called a conservative by your cycling friends yet a lib by MDS. Whatever. You appear to be a smart man. As such, stop bitching and moaning and pulling a Glum and help with the solutions, and not by giving in all the time to the oppressors. You also like to pull an Urkel where you come in and yell fire in a crowded theater and then shrug to say, " Did I do that?" I really do not care about the hey have I ever told you about me inferences by you. Shut the frig up or help out. the fence rail must hurt after a while.

You can come back on me all you want. I really DNGAF. I met you at the first pig roast and said hi to you. Halfway through my sentence to you, you turned and walked away to talk to someone else. At that time I thought your posts were insightful. After that, I figured your handlers weren't there to tell you to make nice with the peons and it is all about you. If the measure of a man.....

You may be a great guy but after my interactions with you. meh.

Babalou

 

[Some Guy]

Any government action has potential for abuse (future list for confiscation). Any step the antis take is advancement of their continual march to confiscate all private firearms. There is no other ends.

This

 

[clandestine]

So sad

 

[babalou]

I consider friends on MDS that are opposite of each other. Does not matter. No harm no foul. I am on my period lately seeing all this bantering and pissing. I understand some rare issues- like a family, it happens. We are the Addams Family. But seeing it like this is not good. Like in the original Rambo where Brian Dennehy said to his deputies who were infighting in the woods----The Fight is Out There!! SMH

 

[fabsroman]

Newsflash, I'm NICS exempt. I have a pistol permit in a Brady Exempt state. Here's how it works when I buy a gun from a dealer in Alabama:

Me- Hi LGS, I want that gun.

LGS- Fill out the 4473, show me your DL and pistol permit, give me $XXX.XX.

Me- fills out forms, forks over money.

LGS- chucks 4473 in file clerk's inbox to process the Bound Book then file the form. Hands me gun and receipt.

Me- walks out with gun.


How it works with a private seller:

Me- I want that gun.

PS- may or may not ask to see DL and permit.

Me- hands PS money.

PS- gives me gun with bill of sale.

Me- walks off with gun.

The only difference is no 4473 in a dealer's filing cabinet. In Brady Exempt states we like it like that. Here's the best part, I've done it both ways in front of an ATF agent and they don't even bat an eye because it's legal in Alabama and most of Free America. Even better, 24% of the adults in Alabama have pistol permits and are NICS exempt (highest percentage of permits in the nation) and there are 37 Brady Exempt states where permit holders are NICS exempt. When you see reports of 2.X million NICS checks on Black Friday rethink the numbers due to the very significant number of NICS exempt people.

PS- at any given gunshow here 1/4 to 1/3 of the sellers are private. At almost all competitive shooting events, no matter the discipline, private sales are common. Hell, after every monthly match at one cowboy club there will be anywhere from 6 to 12 guns for sale and most of them sell. Same in Tennessee, Georgia and Mississippi.



You need to crawl out of that leftist pustule around DC and visit Free America. Almost nobody here likes NICS checks and I have only heard one person say they support UBC. How common is dislike for gun control down here? In AL, GA, MS and TN I've had teenaged counter girls at Burger King, Arby's, Popeyes, the grocery store, the gas station, etc. go off in well reasoned rants against gun control using many of the same arguments and data sources used in the General Asylum just because they saw my Sig gimme cap or 2A t-shirt. None of my black neighbors like any form of gun control but then they know it's based on racist ******** from personal experience. Polls are designed to elicit specific responses from very small sample sizes, that's called confirmation bias and all polls use it. You live in a bubble that does not even come close to the rest of America.



The Constitution is concrete and even provides a concrete way to change it. It is very difficult to change for a reason. Yet some folks like you are happy to let it be nibbled to death by vermin.



Thee was literally an amendment proposed to allow revolt should gov't become tyrannical but it got dropped.

Hmmmmmm, 37 states that are Brady exempt. ATF's website says there are 24 states that have no Brady exemption whatsoever. 50 - 24 = 26 according to my math.

https://www.atf.gov/rules-and-regulations/permanent-brady-permit-chart

What is your source for 37?

Next, let's examine why you are Brady Exempt. It is because you have a permit to carry. Almost all states that are Brady Exempt are that way because the person has a license to buy firearms or a concealed carry license. That is, the person has most likely already gone through a background check. We aren't even Shall Issue here in Maryland. No way Maryland is going Brady Exempt any time soon.

Anybody that does not have a concealed carry permit in Alabama must still go though a NICS check when purchasing a new gun from an FFL.

 

[PowPow]

This is like the leak in the T-tops or sunroof that you can never find. It doesn't stop. The more it rains, the more it leaks. For this thread, the replies are the rain. I pledge to stop the rain right now. See y'all tomorrow in DC!

 

[babalou]

he took over- poor guy

Please don't. I've got time, and am looking forward to the discussion.




Yes, former Marylander. Good guy from my interactions with him. Please note that the site owner is also in Texas.

Sent from my Pixel XL using Tapatalk

When our old leader retired. It was great he did it, and while in Texas.

 

[fabsroman]

Dude, you have some odd twisted Munchausen by proxy symptoms where you cause issues for attention. You ride in and talk things to counter attack others yet offer no solution. You like to play both sides and eventually neither will be with you. An example of this is a post you made a while ago where you took it as a badge of honer to be called a conservative by your cycling friends yet a lib by MDS. Whatever. You appear to be a smart man. As such, stop bitching and moaning and pulling a Glum and help with the solutions, and not by giving in all the time to the oppressors. You also like to pull an Urkel where you come in and yell fire in a crowded theater and then shrug to say, " Did I do that?" I really do not care about the hey have I ever told you about me inferences by you. Shut the frig up or help out. the fence rail must hurt after a while.

You can come back on me all you want. I really DNGAF. I met you at the first pig roast and said hi to you. Halfway through my sentence to you, you turned and walked away to talk to someone else. At that time I thought your posts were insightful. After that, I figured your handlers weren't there to tell you to make nice with the peons and it is all about you. If the measure of a man.....

You may be a great guy but after my interactions with you. meh.

Babalou

Were you wearing a floral blue shirt at the first pig roast? If so, I thought we talked about fishing. Maybe I am wrong, it was 3 years ago. I know I wasn't sitting down when I ran into you, but I have no idea if I was on my way to or from something I needed to do (e.g., bathroom break, drink or food for my dad). How long did I speak to the other person? Was it DA? I remember leaving one conversation to speak with DA. Somewhat hard to spend a ton of time with everybody at these events and get to know them really well. So, I tend to spend most of my time with whomever I am sitting with. Spent most of that event speaking to Outrider58, his wife, Qwertee, Stu, Bigfoot44, and Mrs. Bigfoot44. Saw Outrider58 a week ago today. Spent most of the 2nd pig roast speaking to WillTill, Schipperke, Mrs. Schipperke, and Eruby. Spoke to others, but nowhere near as much as I spoke to those guys. My apologies if I did not spend the adequate amount of time speaking with you to meet your requirement of "good person" material.

As far as the rest of it goes, I find it somewhat comical that I am anti-2A merely because I support UBC. I also supported the scrapping of the HPRB since it appeared that everything was getting appealed to OAH anyway for a de novo trial by MSP. Why make applicants for a permit go through the process twice when MSP is getting paid with taxpayer dollars. Makes sense to me that if the matter is inevitably going to end up at OAH, save applicants time and money, especially if they are represented by counsel, and taxpayer money by having the matter go straight to OAH. Of course, this all goes away with Shall Issue.

 

[Ammo Jon]

NICS check doesn’t always work, I know plenty of people that would be considered mentally ill that have firearms. They shouldn’t have firearms let alone keyboards!

 

[babalou]

ok

This is like the leak in the T-tops or sunroof that you can never find. It doesn't stop. The more it rains, the more it leaks. For this thread, the replies are the rain. I pledge to stop the rain right now. See y'all tomorrow in DC!

Now that is funny. I worked at a dealership in HS where my Pop was a Service Advisor and the GM T-Tops always leaked. You could never, ever find from where it came. hahaha awesome reference!!!!!

It was Covington Buikc in the mid 80's when they were in downtown SS. Had a ton of regal T-Tops and actually had a lot of camaros come in to fix. lol

I am jealous you came up with it.

 

[fabsroman]

NICS check doesn’t always work, I know plenty of people that would be considered mentally ill that have firearms. They shouldn’t have firearms let alone keyboards!

Yep, the keyboard and knowledge is a greater weapon than a firearm nowadays. Computers and internet access should be highly regulated. Then again, maybe we need an Amendment to the Constitution to ensure computer and internet access for everybody so everybody always has access to communication and information. Maybe we actually need to ensure deregulation of computer access and internet access.

 

[fabsroman]

Now that is funny. I worked at a dealership in HS where my Pop was a Service Advisor and the GM T-Tops always leaked. You could never, ever find from where it came. hahaha awesome reference!!!!!

It was Covington Buikc in the mid 80's when they were in downtown SS. Had a ton of regal T-Tops and actually had a lot of camaros come in to fix. lol

I am jealous you came up with it.

The t-tops on the 80's Mustangs had the same problem.

 

[babalou]

was not wearing a floral shirt.

Were you wearing a floral blue shirt at the first pig roast? If so, I thought we talked about fishing. Maybe I am wrong, it was 3 years ago. I know I wasn't sitting down when I ran into you, but I have no idea if I was on my way to or from something I needed to do (e.g., bathroom break, drink or food for my dad). How long did I speak to the other person? Was it DA? I remember leaving one conversation to speak with DA. Somewhat hard to spend a ton of time with everybody at these events and get to know them really well. So, I tend to spend most of my time with whomever I am sitting with. Spent most of that event speaking to Outrider58, his wife, Qwertee, Stu, Bigfoot44, and Mrs. Bigfoot44. Saw Outrider58 a week ago today. Spent most of the 2nd pig roast speaking to WillTill, Schipperke, Mrs. Schipperke, and Eruby. Spoke to others, but nowhere near as much as I spoke to those guys. My apologies if I did not spend the adequate amount of time speaking with you to meet your requirement of "good person" material.

As far as the rest of it goes, I find it somewhat comical that I am anti-2A merely because I support UBC. I also supported the scrapping of the HPRB since it appeared that everything was getting appealed to OAH anyway for a de novo trial by MSP. Why make applicants for a permit go through the process twice when MSP is getting paid with taxpayer dollars. Makes sense to me that if the matter is inevitably going to end up at OAH, save applicants time and money, especially if they are represented by counsel, and taxpayer money by having the matter go straight to OAH. Of course, this all goes away with Shall Issue.

Damn wish I had a floral shirt. Like I said, I do not need your acceptance. The fact you turned and walked away was a donk move, dude. Just say thanks and move on. No harm no foul.

 

[clandestine]

NICS check doesn’t always work, I know plenty of people that would be considered mentally ill that have firearms. They shouldn’t have firearms let alone keyboards!

People forget that when things like 9/11 happened NICS crashed. They are not staffed for emergencies so when/if UBC's are made law, essentially everyone's 2A rights get put on a complete hold when a disaster or emergency happens.

Same happened after Obama won, and after Newtown. There was a rush for guns and everything was getting put on hold or NICS didn't answer.

 

[babalou]

oh yeah

The t-tops on the 80's Mustangs had the same problem.

I almost purchased an 87 T-Top red one from Hill and Sanders. Forgot about that.

 

[Some Guy]

So, dazzle me with some logical reason why the NICS check is good or bad.

https://www.sciencedirect.com/science/article/pii/S1047279718306161

NICS has not proven to reduce firearm crime. It doesn't work. Criminals gonna crime.

If it does not work, then dazzle me with something even more logical that will keep firearms out of the hands of criminals and mentally ill people.

Violent crime should equal a criminal penalty effective enough for future deterrence.

Institutionalize mentally ill persons who are a threat to others.

Change behaviors. Gun violence is behavioral. Emphasis should be put on changing behaviors, similar to what we've seen in trying to reduce drunk driving. Vehicles were never banned or more rigorously regulated. Instead, behaviors were addressed.

Work harder to communicate and advocate for the importance of family so people don't grow up fatherless.

Tax alcohol sellers and producers to fund these activities.

Tax those who produce violent media content to fund this. (This week on jfpo there was a very good reprint of an older article about the connection between media, tv and violent behavior.)

These things can reduce gun violence. NICS hasn't and probably never will. NICS will, however, create a registry. Registration = confiscation. Confiscation = Pol Pot, Stalin, Mao, Hitler, et al.

 

[fabsroman]

I almost purchased an 87 T-Top red one from Hill and Sanders. Forgot about that.

Dad bought the 1980 Fairmont from Hill and Sanders. I bought the 2010 Focus from what is now Lindsey.

 

[babalou]

Fairmont

Dad bought the 1980 Fairmont from Hill and Sanders. I bought the 2010 Focus from what is now Lindsey.

Awesome!!!!

hopefully without the faux wood side

My Pop retired from there as a Service Advisor a couple years ago. Forgot you lived all over Monkey County. Even up my way in Germantown. Moved here in 89 when there was NOTHING up here. Now more crime and tons of traffic. I think you said you got the heck out a few years ago from Germantown.