Pulled Over by MSP/Guns in Car

[honda53s]

I wouldn't of done it any differently... Nice job OP.

 

[Brooklyn]

Exactly. I remember being pulled over for speeding and was asked if I had drugs, firearms, or TANKS!!! I gave him a look and chuckled no. Little did they know.....

Yup.. and that tanks joke is why I think is all coming from command.. but some young probationary officers are going to eat it up.. if the NYC pattern holds, Good cops will retire and it will get worse unless we stop it via the courts. Not even sure the courts will.

 

[ironpony]

If the case had a Bushmaster sticker visibly on it or obviously a gun case, is that probable cause for search? If asked for a license as OP was is it time for a lawyer? I see this may have been worse, maybe??
In these times it just makes one wonder. We do have some of the toughest laws.

 

[goose poop]

Thanks all for the responses. Just to keep things in perspective, the crack in my windshield is pretty bad, about 16" right at driver eye level. I think the Trooper had a rookie with him and they were just runnin and gunnin stops. I never saw him until he was behind me, he may have seen the crack as they were coming up behind or beside me. As to leaving the case in plain sight it will be properly covered up next time. Usually I have a ton of decoys and hunting gear in the Tahoe. Better they miss it being covered up than having your firearms taken. As to being hassled I really didn't have that feeling, nor did I think they were on a fishing expedition, and I definitely knew to cooperate to the degree I felt legally responsible, and kept my hands in plain site. I have had more issues with Federal Game Wardens than anyone else. I know how cops work, their line of questioning, play good cop/bad cop, how they try to trip you up. Bottom line is they were runnin and gunnin stops, came across firearms, and were doing their job making sure I wasn't a prohibited person. Pisser was it took 30 minutes. I have a number of friends that are cops, 1 is a Rockville City LT, another 20yr PO3 with monkey co, and another I hunt with regularly the head of Balt City fugitive warrant task force. They are all good dudes, pro 2a and are just as disgusted with MD as we all are. The 2 troopers yesterday had a job to do and they did it. Scary thing though is talking to my moco bro he said he was attached to MSP for awhile, he said I would be shocked by their real motives. He did not elaborate.

Bottom line it would behoove us all when traveling with our firearms to have a plan of action if one ever finds them self in my situation or worse. Think about what you are willing to say, legally obligated to say, and how to say what you need to say without escalating the situation. I am definitely going to do some more research so I have more than a precursory understanding of MD firearm laws, as archaic as they are, and may make a cheat sheet so I throw some statute numbers at them in case I am ever pulled over again.

BTW I took the scenic route on the way home.

Poop

 

[Brooklyn]

See making sure you are not a prohibited person is fishing.. period.

This is how it starts.. if you think its OK for police to presume without any reasonable suspicion that you may be a prohibited person then you must surely support a foid card to make tgecprocess faster. If we do not make progress in this election foid is on the table.

I object to the presumption of criminality on the part of the police and you should too. If you do not you are digging the choke in which you can bury the rest of your civil liberties.

Mark these words. FOID is coming if this nonsense continues.

.and what make you think that they can't pull up any criminal history you might have to see if you were prohibited?

You were unlawfully detained IMHO. IANAL.

 

[kgain673]

Lots of bad information going on around here again, lots. Most mandated training is focused on how to stop killing and not get yourself killed. But anyway MD rushed these laws and almost no one knows what they are. Also that trooper may have been asking dumb questions on purpose you never know. No one got arrested, no guns got seized, repair order issued. Glass gonna get fixed.

 

[Second Amendment]

Were any dogs shot during this incident?

 

[28Shooter]

"Gun Registration License" - I'm sorry, that's just too basic a screw up. How embarrassing for the MSP!

 

[protegeV]

Were any dogs shot during this incident?

The first good question Ive seen

 

[ericoak]

Part of the "Guns Everywhere" Georgia just signed into law are these provisions:

The police are specifically prohibited from:
1. Stopping and questioning you over gun possession without suspicion of another crime being committed.
2. You are not obligated to tell officers if you are carrying firearms.
3. Creating a database of gun owners

Combined with face to face handgun sales and there is no way they check in their system whether you legally posses a firearm.

Screw the People's Republic of Maryland and their innocent until proven guilty tactics.
Come on down to a real state.

 

[Blackstar65]

Most new officers can't talk to citizens. They get so nervous that the stumble through what they want to say. Its usually our biggest issue to overcome as trainers. The rookie trooper was most likely referring to a HQL License. The FTT (Field Training Trooper) like told him to go back up and ask if their were any weapons in the vehicle because he missed it the first time which is a big officer safety issue. Being that he missed the plain view weapons may have pushed his nervousness to a higher level due to the pending ass chewing when the stop was over. I am not even going to say the paper work question was fishing it may have just been nerves or a misinterpretation of the law which happens with new officers hence the field training program. Fishing would have been asking to search the vehicle. Before E-tix 30 minutes wasn't a long time for stop.

 

[Brooklyn]

Were any dogs shot during this incident?

Perhaps a joke but needlessly argumentative otherwise. We need to work with msp to reach an understanding. Or we need the court to settle this. One is cheaper. One is final. I say we can try the cheap one first.

 

[Streetgang]

Most new officers can't talk to citizens. They get so nervous that the stumble through what they want to say. Its usually our biggest issue to overcome as trainers. The rookie trooper was most likely referring to a HQL License. The FTT (Field Training Trooper) like told him to go back up and ask if their were any weapons in the vehicle because he missed it the first time which is a big officer safety issue. Being that he missed the plain view weapons may have pushed his nervousness to a higher level due to the pending ass chewing when the stop was over. I am not even going to say the paper work question was fishing it may have just been nerves or a misinterpretation of the law which happens with new officers hence the field training program. Fishing would have been asking to search the vehicle. Before E-tix 30 minutes wasn't a long time for stop.

You allude to the fact that asking if firearms are present is SOP. I would hope it isn't. Nor have I been asked that in the past.

 

[TheBert]

He could have been from somewhere where a FOID card is necessary and thats the norm.....who know's. You didn't get a ticket and there was no search.

If he is wearing the uniform of and showing a badge for the MSP I would hope that he has received some education in and has knowledge of Maryland's laws. The excuse that he comes from a place, another state, that has a FOID doesn't float.

 

[Brooklyn]

Most new officers can't talk to citizens. They get so nervous that the stumble through what they want to say. Its usually our biggest issue to overcome as trainers. The rookie trooper was most likely referring to a HQL License. The FTT (Field Training Trooper) like told him to go back up and ask if their were any weapons in the vehicle because he missed it the first time which is a big officer safety issue. Being that he missed the plain view weapons may have pushed his nervousness to a higher level due to the pending ass chewing when the stop was over. I am not even going to say the paper work question was fishing it may have just been nerves or a misinterpretation of the law which happens with new officers hence the field training program. Fishing would have been asking to search the vehicle. Before E-tix 30 minutes wasn't a long time for stop.

Certainly possible.. but about those 2 other units that responded.... sound like a lot of manpower over an sop question. No chance it was for intimidation value, right? ..

Op did well. But he was being detained and questioned. Any idea why?
.

 

[joppaj]

You allude to the fact that asking if firearms are present is SOP. I would hope it isn't. Nor have I been asked that in the past.

SG,

I think Blackstar's point is that the trainer likely saw the cases and told Rook to go back and ask since Rook didn't seem to notice them. If a cop sees cases, I'd imagine they're going to ask.

 

[goose poop]

Were any dogs shot during this incident?

thankfully NO, my boy RAIDER was on my mind big time, 95 degree day, I lip the MSP, get detained, truck towed, guns confiscated for however long, and my dog dies from heat exhaustion. Blackstar 65 understands my take on it, rookie trooper, got flustered.

 

[Name Taken]

Certainly possible.. but about those 2 other units that responded.... sound like a lot of manpower over an sop question.

Did they happen to be driving by and see this stop and drop in? Maybe they were all going to meet for lunch after the stop? If officers are going to a non critical call and see another agency on the side of the road on a stop they almost always pull over and check on them or chat.

It really is standard practice if an officer drivers past another on a traffic stop to pull over and check on them. It's also normal when an officer does a traffic stop if others aren't doing anything to drive over there to check on the officer.

I also think if they were trying to "intimidate" as you described they would have at least asked for a consent search? I mean that's only logical.

 

[vinjet700]

Damned good eyesight to see that crack in your windshield. Where they behind you?

this was my question.... cracked w/s isn't easy to see.... IMO

 

[Doctor_M]

My appologies to the law enforcement community, but every day I am less and less inclined to asnwer anything outside of name, rank, and serial number.

I am surprised that they didn ask if your weapons were loaded.... I would think that would have been a concern. If they had asked to see if the weapons were unloaded, would you have to comply? This stuff makes my head hurt.