Preventing Rust on Stored Guns?

[axshon]

Internals that you cant get to I SUGGEST: Breakfree clp, g96, or birch wood Casey barricade. They are all eresol and get in areas easily and prevent gumming and rust.

many thanks!

 

[clandestine]

FWIW my customers who use my product suggestions have yet to report any corrosion whatsoever.These are shooters that use 5K carbines and pistols in classes, shoot doubles in competition and in the field hunting that can exceed tens of thousands of dollars, collectors who have guns that shoot blackpowder loads that are thousands if not worth ten or more thousand per unit, and hunters with custom Bolt Guns that start at 5k.

Never a complaint.

 

[ricuser]

What nasty comments? You are the one that is wrong and if you want to compare certifications and years of experience we can do that also.

Welcome to the MDS community. Chad is a respected member of this community and a major contributor. He doesn't need defending BUT I thought you as a new person might not have appreciated how this community works, and the vigorous immune response that you are about to provoke. That would be a shame; you probably have lots of interesting stuff to contribute as long as you don't get shouted down.

You stated that "The ONLY time WATER should be used on a firearm is if you want to start the rust process".

That's not true; a visit to Beretta or LWRC would demonstrate the fact. I have visited LWRC (if we are going to compare certifications).

Moreover corrosive SALTS can only be removed with a polar (ionizing) solvent. There are other ionizing solvents, but water is by far the most powerful, safest and cheapest. I don't recommend formic acid or methanol. If we are going to compare certifications, I have a Ph.D. in electrochemistry and electrophysiology.

Should one use corrosive ammo? In a perfect world, where 5.56x45 costs less than 58 cents/round, no.
http://wideners.com/itemdetail.cfm?item_id=100000851&dir=18|830|845

In the present circumstances, when 5.45x39 costs less than 20 cents/round, I'm going to use some Ballistol and TLC.

Enjoy your time on the MDS board.

Patrick

 

[101combatvet]

Are you serious?

1) Water is fine…have you ever used an ultrasonic cleaner? Provided you get water off and out of the firing pin channel, its fine. I’ve used water on every gun I’ve ever owned, some with round counts that are very high. How are you supposed to flush all of the crap a cleaner removes? If you don’t flush it, it cakes itself right back onto the gun. Your argument is that water promotes rust…which is true. However, you do realize most chemical cleaners also promote rust, right? Many people will follow the usage of water with compressed air, heat, a water displacement product, or a combo of the above to remove excess.
2) CLP isn’t bad…call H&K and ask them what they use and what product they have given out free samples of in the past. For most LE-grade pistols, you do not need anything else. For some which are more finicky, you may. For excessive fouling, it isn’t ideal. I personally like the 1-2 step of chemical cleaner and lubricant/protectant. What is best depends on the user. For many CLPBF is fine.
3) Ballistol is a good multi-purpose cleaner/lubricant but better things exist for metal and especially for resisting burnoff from heat. It is AWFUL for removing fouling compared to modern products such as Blue Wonder or Wipeout. There is no comparison here.
4) Ballistol, like Militec, burns off stupidly fast. Many people advise use of motor oil for this reason. Guns get hot and heat burns off oil. You need oil that will not burn off. Wipeout + Eezox is better than any Hoppes product. A dry lube such as TuffGlide protects metal far better than Ballistol, and it is ideal for saltwater usage. In some cases, Fluoropolymer greases such as Tetra Gun works wonders and unlike many other lubricant, does not quickly burn off with heat (similar to some auto greases gun smiths use to my understanding).
5) A liberal coating of oil and leaving it to soak is NOT advised by most makers. THIS IS A TERRIBLE IDEA. You say this thread has some of the worst information you have ever read…and now you are right because this is perhaps the WORST advice I have EVER heard. Most oils, other than greases and certain dry lubes, migrate easily. One of the few things that could cause a Sig, HK, or Glock to malfunction is excessive lubrication that promotes the buildup of crap. Overlubrication is where most new users go wrong when they cake their LE-grade guns in so much lube that the lube itself causes malfunctions leading them to think something is wrong with the gun. It is a common user error. H&K has told me the biggest mistake people make is allowing excessive lubrication to pool in the firing pin channel leading to unnecessary buildup. Leaving oil on a gun will do just that.

You might want to go back and re-read my posts.... I think I covered most of this. Here are some areas to remember....

1) you can't get remove all moisture

2) multi-purpose is never the best product

3) many good products that remove fouling... mileage may very

4) I only use Ballisol for BP. Other solvents should be wiped off.... not sure why you mentioned this?

5) Allowing oil to penetrate into the surface of the metal is a excellent idea. Never a good idea over a long period.... a few hours only and then it is wiped off to a thin film.

I hope this clarifies it for you.

 

[clandestine]

I want to thank everyone for your kindness and compliments. I have stated my experience and position. I don't need to say much more.

I'm not a chemist but I am always open to learning from those who can teach me.

 

[101combatvet]

Welcome to the MDS community. Chad is a respected member of this community and a major contributor. He doesn't need defending BUT I thought you as a new person might not have appreciated how this community works, and the vigorous immune response that you are about to provoke. That would be a shame; you probably have lots of interesting stuff to contribute as long as you don't get shouted down.

You stated that "The ONLY time WATER should be used on a firearm is if you want to start the rust process".

That's not true; a visit to Beretta or LWRC would demonstrate the fact. I have visited LWRC (if we are going to compare certifications).

Moreover corrosive SALTS can only be removed with a polar (ionizing) solvent. There are other ionizing solvents, but water is by far the most powerful, safest and cheapest. I don't recommend formic acid or methanol. If we are going to compare certifications, I have a Ph.D. in electrochemistry and electrophysiology.

Should one use corrosive ammo? In a perfect world, where 5.56x45 costs less than 58 cents/round, no.
http://wideners.com/itemdetail.cfm?item_id=100000851&dir=18|830|845

In the present circumstances, when 5.45x39 costs less than 20 cents/round, I'm going to use some Ballistol and TLC.

Enjoy your time on the MDS board.

Patrick

I would reload my own.... it's non-corrosive and cheaper.

 

[101combatvet]

I want to thank everyone for your kindness and compliments. I have stated my experience and position. I don't need to say much more.

I'm not a chemist but I am always open to learning from those who can teach me.

It's all good.... it wouldn't be fun if we all thought the same.

 

[ricuser]

I would reload my own.... it's non-corrosive and cheaper.

You are right. There is a temporary problem finding primers and powder but otherwise I can cast bullets and reuse cases. Cleaning the lead out is a PITA but needs must when the devil drives.

Patrick

 

[Indiana Jones]

Hearing a "gunsmith" pushing corresive ammo is like a brain surgeon pushing a lobotomy. Bad idea... avoid whenever possible. The old addish comes into play... you get what you pay for.

The word you are looking for is "adage" not "addish".

The "facts" you are pushing ive heard before. Its Fudd Cleaning 101. And it is ********. I guess you also think all AKs are full auto, never break, and are also EXCLUSIVELY made in Russia. Regale us with some outrageous hunting stories like a grizzly vs knife or 10/22 vs moose. Fudds love to tell those after talking about water causing insta-rust and how Hoppe's came down from the mountain in Moses' pocket right next to a can of PBR and the ten commandments.

 

[vector03]

The word you are looking for is "adage" not "addish".

The "facts" you are pushing ive heard before. Its Fudd Cleaning 101. And it is ********. I guess you also think all AKs are full auto, never break, and are also EXCLUSIVELY made in Russia. Regale us with some outrageous hunting stories like a grizzly vs knife or 10/22 vs moose. Fudds love to tell those after talking about water causing insta-rust and how Hoppe's came down from the mountain in Moses' pocket right next to a can of PBR and the ten commandments.

 

[clandestine]

It's all good.... it wouldn't be fun if we all thought the same.

Its not all good. If you apogize then Ill consider things squished. I wasnt replying to you, I was thanking people who said kind things about how I helped them and my contributions.

You have made claims with no support, attacked my profession, and trolled this thread. Whenever people respond with facts and technical data you come back with comments that have nothing to do with the technical aspects of what you quoted. Just bickering.

There's lots of people that read this board and giving BAD advice to impressionable people about maitenance is in poor form.

Perhaps you behave this way with your friends but you are new here and its not a good idea to jump in and post like you have.

 

[madness3120]

Gesh just a message board people. Keep Calm. Dont raise your blood pressure. LOL

 

[briwayjones]

What's so bad about WD-40 as a protectant (not a lubricant)? WD-40 was created as a way to protect bare metal from rusting. We have been using it on our guns for decades with no trouble, no gumminess or anything.

 

[clandestine]

What's so bad about WD-40 as a protectant (not a lubricant)? WD-40 was created as a way to protect bare metal from rusting. We have been using it on our guns for decades with no trouble, no gumminess or anything.

It does gum up moving parts. WD40 is one of the main reasons Remington 700s had trigger/safety issues. WD40 is only OK if you blow all of it off and out of the moving parts.

WD40 has made gunsmiths ALOT of money for decades by making guns gum up and not work.

 

[101combatvet]

What's so bad about WD-40 as a protectant (not a lubricant)? WD-40 was created as a way to protect bare metal from rusting. We have been using it on our guns for decades with no trouble, no gumminess or anything.

Depends on what you use it for. It is a penetrating oil.... I would not recommend using it on a carry gun.

 

[vector03]

101combatvet, could you please change your Avatar to Abe Simpson....PLEASE????

 

[101combatvet]

101combatvet, could you please change your Avatar to Abe Simpson....PLEASE????

I can only change it to any one of my five combat patches.... sorry.

 

[Indiana Jones]

Ever own a full auto AK.... very shoot one.... ever capture one? Go back to eating your milk and cookies.

I prefer coke with my cookies. Vanilla or cherry are a bonus

 

[Indiana Jones]

I can only change to any one of my five combat patches.... sorry.

Oh, youre that guy.

 

[Semper Noctem]

I can only change it to any one of my five combat patches.... sorry.

You sound important.