One more AK question (Sorry)

[Guderian]

How many own a 5.45 AK and regret it or wish they got a 7.62 AK instead? Yes, ideally you'd have one of each, but I might not be able to swing it before 10/1 for financial and availability reasons.

I already have two AR's (primary and backup) so my only reason for getting an AK is because it will be banned 10/1 and it's now or never if I'm even remotely interested. I will use it for practical carbine matches just so I know another manual of arms and for shooting something different, but otherwise I think and/or suspect I will prefer my AR's more (I don't know for sure since I've never shot an AK) because of ammo, mag and parts availability in the states.

Caliber performance aside, it's my understanding that 7.62 mags and ammo are more readily available. Parts perhaps may also be more available (can anyone confirm this part?).

But, if 7.62's aren't going to be available before 10/1, and my only shot at an AK is a 5.45 now, am I going to wish I either just passed on it or just wait and take a chance 7.62's will be here before doomsday?

How bad is the quality ammo and quality magazine availability for 5.45 AKs? Same question for quality parts.

Thank you for your patience and sorry if this is being asked too frequently these days.

 

[Ganegrei]

5.45 surplus ammo is widely available. Or at least it should be. It's dirty and corrosive but still shoots fine. Magazines I heard were tough but not impossible to find. Also, remember that ammo can be ordered as it becomes available and magazines can be picked up out of state. If you don't have your paws on the rifle by 10/1/13 you never will.

 

[ST19AG_WGreymon]

I had both a 5.45 and 7.62 AK at one point, I had to sell it to my Father in law to clear some debt and I'm kicking myself in the ass for it. I loved my 5.45 AK. 5.45 ammo is cheap the mags aren't too hard to find, you just have to wait for all this panic stuff to blow over. Accesories/parts are usually changeable between the 47 and 74, there might be variations because of reveiver type(stamped vs. milled), muzzle threading, etc. Nothing wrong with buying a 5.45 AK.

 

[surplusfan]

545 is the way to go my friend. Its still pretty cheap. Actually very cheap compared to anything else out there.

Love the low recoil too. Fun guns.

Wouldn't hesitate to buy another. I prefer my 545 ak to any I've used in 762.

You know that you can buy other EBR's after 10/1/13. You are just gonna have to move out of the state.

 

[xdwaiter]

I almost regret not getting a 74 instead of my 47.

I kwant to get a waffen works after my glock 17

 

[Scott7891]

You have to answer yourself based on the pros and cons of each caliber.

7.62 pros
- better stopping power/ barrier penetration
- mags more plentiful and cheaper plus easier to find
- domestic ammo production
- the original AK caliber
- more brands of non-corrosive ammo available if you don't like corrosive ammo
- many accessories can interchange with the '74

7.62 cons
- not going to be as "range" accurate as the 5.45 if you care a lot about groups
- more recoil compared to 5.45
- this caliber always becomes hard to find/expensive whenever panic buying occurs and it will happen again when the next tragedy or gun ban comes around so stock up now

5.45 pros
- surplus ammo is cheap and plentiful/ commercial ammo is priced the same as 7.62
- as mentioned above, 5.45 surplus is still relatively easy to get during panic buying
- more accurate
- less recoil
- still the service round of Russia so there should never be a shortage of that caliber since they love making ammo in vast quantities

5.45 cons
- the cheap ammo is corrosive if that matters to you
- except for Hornady which is pricey all 5.45 ammo is imported and all it takes is an executive order to ban it for life like they did with steel core 7.62x39 ammo
- quality mags are expensive and can be hard to find even more so being a Maryland resident. Any that sell for less than $30 sell out quickly from any vendor

Based on those parameters mentioned you should decide what will work best for you.

If you end up getting the 5.45 AK but still want a 7.62 AK-like weapon you will still be able to get the Vz-58 after 10/1. Many people including AK owners prefer them over AK's. There is no such alternative for the 5.45 AK unless you stick with a HBAR.

 

[Billman]

5.45 is certainly more economical while surplus ammo is available.

 

[Ragnar]

Isn't it also easier to mount optics on 545 AKs than on many "traditional" 762 AKs?

 

[Scott7891]

Isn't it also easier to mount optics on 545 AKs than on many "traditional" 762 AKs?

No they use the same mounting system on both models. Even the aftermarket mounts out today are interchangable on both systems. They are both the same gun the only differences are the thread system, caliber, and size of the bolt/bolt carrier.

 

[aquaman]

whats your budget?

 

[Guderian]

whats your budget?

I'm willing to pay up to retail for an Arsenal.

 

[Guderian]

You have to answer yourself based on the pros and cons of each caliber.

7.62 pros
- better stopping power/ barrier penetration
- mags more plentiful and cheaper plus easier to find
- domestic ammo production
- the original AK caliber
- more brands of non-corrosive ammo available if you don't like corrosive ammo
- many accessories can interchange with the '74

7.62 cons
- not going to be as "range" accurate as the 5.45 if you care a lot about groups
- more recoil compared to 5.45
- this caliber always becomes hard to find/expensive whenever panic buying occurs and it will happen again when the next tragedy or gun ban comes around so stock up now

5.45 pros
- surplus ammo is cheap and plentiful/ commercial ammo is priced the same as 7.62
- as mentioned above, 5.45 surplus is still relatively easy to get during panic buying
- more accurate
- less recoil
- still the service round of Russia so there should never be a shortage of that caliber since they love making ammo in vast quantities

5.45 cons
- the cheap ammo is corrosive if that matters to you
- except for Hornady which is pricey all 5.45 ammo is imported and all it takes is an executive order to ban it for life like they did with steel core 7.62x39 ammo
- quality mags are expensive and can be hard to find even more so being a Maryland resident. Any that sell for less than $30 sell out quickly from any vendor

Based on those parameters mentioned you should decide what will work best for you.

If you end up getting the 5.45 AK but still want a 7.62 AK-like weapon you will still be able to get the Vz-58 after 10/1. Many people including AK owners prefer them over AK's. There is no such alternative for the 5.45 AK unless you stick with a HBAR.

I'm not terribly worried about round performance or corrosiveness. My main worry is buying a particular caliber and then not being able to find quality ammo to shoot through it (corrosive is okay although metal rules out indoor ranges), quality magazines to run it so it doesn't malfunction and parts to repair it, god forbid something breaks.

With regards to magazine availability, I own an M&P and 17 round magazines are hard to find, but I know they will be available at some point and I have 10 for now. Because these are foreign, I'm just worried ammo, mags and parts may dry up for one caliber more readily than the other caliber. I know 47 has been around longer, but 74 is what Russia currently uses. I know we can't predict changes in law though.

 

[rob-cubed]

As long as cheap corrosive 5.45 surplus is plentiful, that's what I like to shoot. Eventually it will be comparable to x39, but as surplus dries up domestic manufacturing will pick up... and Wolf/Barnaul/etc are already exporting new production steel case.

Mags aren't *as* available as x39 but we had a glut just a year ago, and you could get quality milsurps for $9 all day. They will come back down in price.

But all the underfolders and pre-bans are in the original caliber. So sort of depends on what you are looking for. You can always dress up a 5.45 in classic wood but nothing beats some of the details found on older pre-ban rifles. I prefer either older Chinese in x39 or newer poly folders in 5.45.

 

[erwos]

I have a 5.45x39 AK and a 5.45x39 AR-15. I have no regrets whatsoever investing in that caliber. The ammo is almost always available online, it's always cheap (at least relatively so), stores easily, and it shoots great. OK, 7N6 is corrosive... deal with it. I'd shoot corrosive 5.56x45 if I could find it for that pricing, and I bet everyone else would, too.

The AK-74 mag situation isn't great, but I did find used sanitized Russian plums for $25 a piece online, and loaded up while I was in FL. More than I'd pay for 5.45x39 AR-15 magazines, but good enough. I sometimes think we're spoiled by the AR-15 and AK-47 magazines situation... $15 for a rifle mag isn't really the norm for other guns.

Also, I'm not totally sold on "domestic production" of 7.62x39 being a real advantage. Those cartridges tend to be priced high enough that they're never going to be suitable for bulk plinking... and that's what I care about, mostly.

 

[HT4]

I'm willing to pay up to retail for an Arsenal.

I believe that Engage just got a big shipment of Arsenal SGL-31-68's... IMO, that's about the best option out there right now.

 

[Scott7891]

Also, I'm not totally sold on "domestic production" of 7.62x39 being a real advantage. Those cartridges tend to be priced high enough that they're never going to be suitable for bulk plinking... and that's what I care about, mostly.

They will be if any administration decides to go full retard and ban importation simply by executive order. They did it before and we are high time for another one since every administration since Reagan has done some sort of ban on an imported firearms and ammo even Bush Jr. with the barrel ban.

Not saying its a first choice to buy that stuff, I agree. Yet if what happens above does we will be glad to have it rather than not being able to shoot the stuff ever again at reasonable prices including the steel ammo that made it stateside. One only has to look at the Chinese ammo. Yea its been banned for almost 20 years and yea you can still find it but it isn't cheap.

 

[armed ferret]

the obvious answer, as always, is "get both".

 

[Scott7891]

the obvious answer, as always, is "get both".

+1.

Of course if finance is the issue if it were me and I could only get one firearm before the ban I would do AK in 7.62x39 and continue to use AR's for the .22 caliber shooting or buy the AK-74 and get a Vz-58 later on after the ban.

 

[Guderian]

I believe that Engage just got a big shipment of Arsenal SGL-31-68's... IMO, that's about the best option out there right now.

Yea, I'm considering Engage. Atlantic Firearms has them listed on their website now too. I think Atlantic is getting folders next week too, but the 21's aren't coming end of June as originally hoped for. Don't quote me, but it's more likely August, which I'm translating as September, which is too close to 10/1 for comfort.

South Texas Armory has SGL 31-95's for $1,240.95 and free shipping. I'm in contact with the owner, and would be willing to try a group buy if there is enough interest.

 

[Scott7891]

Yea, I'm considering Engage. Atlantic Firearms has then listed on their website now too. I think Atlantic is getting folders next week too, but the 21's aren't coming end of June as originally hoped for. Don't quote me, but it's more likely August, which I'm translating as September, which is too close to 10/1 for comfort.

South Texas Armory has SGL 31-95's for $1,240.95 and free shipping. I'm in contact with the owner, and would be willing to try a group buy if there is enough interest.

If you want the basic Arsenal I would go with Engage. Atlantic Firearms is a good company too but you will get raped in fees with sales tax, shipping, transfer fee, plus the regulated background fee it is honestly not worth it unless you move out of Maryland.

The SGL-31-95 is a sweet deal. One of the best and most authentic to what the Russians currently use in service on the market out there. It would probably cost you twice as much to have it done paying someone else to do it from a basic Saiga.