MSP wanting to verify serial #?

[Threeband]

...
The short version is that the complete info on you and every REGULATED firearm you bought through a dealer or transferred via MSP is on record and available and has been for decades.

FIFY, I hope.

You did mean regulated, as handguns and "assault weapons", as on a 77r, right?

There's no way the database includes long guns transferred on a 4473 alone, right? 10/22s , 870s, 336s, and Mosins.

 

[A1Uni]

FIFY, I hope.

You did mean regulated, as handguns and "assault weapons", as on a 77r, right?

There's no way the database includes long guns transferred on a 4473 alone, right? 10/22s , 870s, 336s, and Mosins.

No, only guns requiring MSP paperwork, e.g.- regulated firearms.

Of course, even unregulated purchases through dealers create a 4473 and A&D entries which, not as easily searchable as regulated purchases, can still be traced back to you.

The ATF and with the new laws MSP (must at least once every 2 years) can walk in and inspect our books and records whenever they want to.

The old boating accident turnip won't work if push comes to shove.

 

[MedInfantry]

Who ultimately has jurisdiction and governance over the firearm laws and are responsible for these type of "spontaneous" health and welfare checks?

 

[Rack&Roll]

It's a Maryland State Police operation, but they sometimes ask local agencies to conduct these prayer meetings on your doorstep...

 

[ShallNotInfringe]

No, only guns requiring MSP paperwork, e.g.- regulated firearms.

Of course, even unregulated purchases through dealers create a 4473 and A&D entries which, not as easily searchable as regulated purchases, can still be traced back to you.

The ATF and with the new laws MSP (must at least once every 2 years) can walk in and inspect our books and records whenever they want to.

The old boating accident turnip won't work if push comes to shove.

On the 4473 side, isn't it a reverse search though? In other words, if they have the serial number, they can trace from the point of origin to the FFL to the transferee through a 4473 search at the FFL's site. According to law, there isn't a registry of unregulated firearms, correct?

So, if a law enforcement agency was interested in what unregulated firearms a particular person has purchased, they would have to know what shop to go to and inspect records, then search for a purchase through the paperwork or the FFL's sales records.

If the person made purchases through many shops, that could end up being a needle in haystack process. Is that what you mean by "not as easily searchable"?

Or can they blanket search/request purchase history from the entire state FFL community on a specific person? That's getting tin foil hat like...

Or is there in fact an unadvertised registry of unregulated firearms with 4473's being used to tie people to firearms purchase history stored in one record?

When they come in to "inspect" do they walk out with records?

As long as I am on a question roll here, how long are FFL's required to retain 4473's? 77R's?

*** The way it’s supposed to work: 1. Read 2. Consider 3. Vote The way it does work: 1. Vote 2. Lie 3. Scramble ***

 

[dist1646]

Or is there in fact an unadvertised registry of unregulated firearms with 4473's being used to tie people to firearms purchase history stored in one record?

Clarksburg, W. Va.

 

[CypherPunk]

1. Police are probably not there to help you, they are there to gather evidence of a crime, build a case, earn overtime and/or justify their budget.
2. Demand govt issued photo identification. Call 911 if someone says they are a LEO and refuses to show ID.
3. Don't talk to police.
4. Refer all questions to your attorney (you have identified a competent atty in advance, right?)
5. Your atty may agree to VERIFY the info the LEO provides, or forward a pic of the serial (only) if they ask nicely and justify their request to your attorney's satisfaction.
6. NEVER invite them in or open your safe in front of them absent a warrant. Close and lock the door behind you when you meet police out front.
7. Train members of your household not to talk to police or invite them on. Role play to practice.
8. Don't talk to police.
9. Consider recording where legal.
10. Don't physically resist, no matter how unlawful. Document well and fight in court later.

 

[American Rifleman]

We'll I called MSP and of course the one lady I talked to had no info and after repeated attempts to ask her who I should talk to at MSP with no answer I gave up. I called the officer back that came to visit and we had a pretty good discussion. I asked if this was a voluntary check and he said no that eventually they (MSP) would come visit. I asked why he was coming to my residence since I am in the county. Apparently he didn't realize I was in the county. The city is actually a stones throw away from here, I can see the confusion. He said that a list was sent out and I guess all the counties/ cities looked through it to get the ones in their area. He said that there was a gentleman in BC that he knew had the list and was going around verifying these numbers. He said he would call him and have him out. I told him no and to just call me. I of course will ask him more info and make sure all is legit. The officer I spoke too said he had a list of like 200 names for the city alone. I wouldn't be surprised if more of you get calls or visits in the coming weeks.

 

[axshon]

So are you raising your profile by saying the following?

I appreciate that you're just doing your job here but since you don't have a warrant, I'm going to take your information and forward it immediately to my attorney. I'll be sure that he contacts you as soon as possible to get everything squared away. I can also give you his contact information if you like. I have it right here in my wallet. Thank you, good bye.

Personally, I don't want to be an a$$hat making a LEOs professional life more difficult but that's not an excuse for unquestioning compliance.

 

[oldman12]

But its okay for the Government to make Law abiding citizens lives more difficult?

 

[axshon]

That's not what I said. A legislator or bureaucrat's ability to make my life difficult does not constitute an excuse on my part to make a LEOs life difficult. I didn't say comply without questioning. I'm of the opinion that one should always be nice until the time comes not to be nice. Cheesy movie line but it works.

 

[oldman12]

I understand be nice but, They should be more concerned about numbers on criminals guns rather than people that bought their firearms legally.

 

[MaraD]

Thanks for the video! Very, very informative and definitely worth the time watching.

 

[drkeg]

Regarding the MGUN database, a few years ago I had a weapon stolen. The info they had in the database was completely wrong, like not even close to the right serial number. Fortunately, I had the records available and had recorded the S/N myself separately. The officer investigating was not surprised at the error.

 

[whistlersmother]

With all the 77R being submitted over the past year, and the outsourcing of those to various agencies, it would NOT surprise me that someone screwed up a bunch of applications.

Perhaps the Connecticut State Police are advising MSP on how to re-build - uh, er, - verify its database...

 

[Bullfrog]

Direct quote from Tokyo Drift.

Not saying that you believe it was just made-up movie dialog, but I can assure you it's not.

I heard the same expression when I was stationed in Japan, twenty years before that movie was made. It came up during a class on Japanese culture led by a elderly Japanese man, pointing out one of many differences. In US culture, being different/drawing attention is good, while in Japan it is generally bad... as he put it "The squeeky wheel gets the grease" vs "The nail that sticks up gets hammered down."

 

[blodter]

Not saying that you believe it was just made-up movie dialog, but I can assure you it's not.

I heard the same expression when I was stationed in Japan, twenty years before that movie was made. It came up during a class on Japanese culture led by a elderly Japanese man, pointing out one of many differences. In US culture, being different/drawing attention is good, while in Japan it is generally bad... as he put it "The squeeky wheel gets the grease" vs "The nail that sticks up gets hammered down."

I was just kidding! I had no doubt that it was a real expression, and a good one at that!

 

[Publius]

Can't they call or mail before knocking at the door? If my wife is home alone with kids and two male strangers knock at the door, three things are certain:
1. She will totally freak out.
2. She won't open the door for two strangers.
3. She will call the police.

The endless forms we fill out on a gun purchase have an abundance of contact data. I really cannot fathom the rationale of a personal police visit being the first approach. The police must know most normal people hate a police visit. If I get one of these that's the final push I need to pack my bags.

P.s.- if there are indeed 200 names for the city alone, it's fair to extrapolate 1,000 to 2,000 names state wide getting police visits!

 

[Docster]

I understand be nice but, They should be more concerned about numbers on criminals guns rather than people that bought their firearms legally.

Agree, and speaking of being 'nice', why can't they MSP give the gun owners a courtesy call before showing up? That would show their respect for us citizens and make it more likely that they would be given that respect back.

 

[oldman12]

This would make sense,instead of treating Law abiding gun owners like criminals.It just seems that the knock on the door is a sneakier deceit,hey pion were the gestapo . I hate this state more and more. Money sucks, haven't been able to buy or shoot since 2012.