MSP wait times and a class action

[WiseOldMan53]

Be patient?

Senate Puts Condition on State Police Funds
By Craig Whitlock and Amy Argetsinger
Washington Post Staff Writers
Saturday, March 27, 1999; Page B07

http://www.washingtonpost.com/wp-srv/local/longterm/mdleg/police032799.htm
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[WiseOldMan53]

When it comes time to actually do some work to protect our rights, this thread gives me a pretty good idea of how many people will participate. Pathetic...
You know in other states there's absolutely no wait after you pay for the gun? Then you can go to the store the next day and buy another! Imagine that!

At least once a week my son in Oklahoma asked me, "What color do you want me to paint your room?"

 

[KD999]

Wow. I wasn't here then. So, if at that time failing to get it done in 7 days allowed FFLs to release the firearms why isn't that done anymore? What changed?

 

[Ab_Normal]

I said it in the class action thread I started a month ago and I will say it again: Now I know why this state is in the shape it is.

 

[widowman]

I can't understand how wait times have continued to increase.

Shortly after the Newtown incident, gun stores were completely packed and I would see a dozen people filling out paperwork at the same time. Wait times went from 7 to 21 days.

These days, supply seems to be dried up and even though when stores get inventory it goes quickly, I don't see the massive purchases that I did a few months back.

Now, the MSP has said to have increased staffing, added computers and faxes, ect. Applications can't possibly be as many as a few months back yet, wait times have increased to over 40 days.

Some thing is not right here.

 

[WiseOldMan53]

Wow. I wasn't here then. So, if at that time failing to get it done in 7 days allowed FFLs to release the firearms why isn't that done anymore? What changed?

The clause to release after 7-days was amended into the original bill by some of our friendlies in Annapolis at the time. It was put in there as a safeguard against the possibility of them [in the future] pulling some BS like defunding Maryland State Police Licensing and putting into effect a De Facto gun ban.

Back when Christ was a Corporal, the dealer would call NICS and get a NICS Transfer Number (NTN) for your federal form 4473. They would hold onto your 4473 and send your Maryland form (77R) off to MSP for the 7-day wait and background check. After 7-days the law said the dealer could release the firearm (since he already had the NTN on your 4473).

Fast forward years later and, after continued failure to meet the 7-day deadline, someone (still not sure who!) made the Maryland State Police the Point of Contact for NICS. Now, both of your forms for a regulated firearm go off to MSP and only they can get an NTN for your 4473.

If any Maryland Firearm Dealer calls NICS for a regulated firearm, they are told NO.

 

[fivepointstar]

Good luck!!!!! I think they will just laugh at you! Then if you take them to court, the investigators doing the backgrounds will be in court so expect even longer delays.

 

[teratos]

I don't get it. Why are you worried about your purchase if there is some sort of fix in the works as you intimated in an earlier post? Is there really some imminent solution, or are you just saying that people are "looking at it." Hell, we are all looking at it. Big steaming pile of it.

Depends on who is looking at it, doesn't it? I am very close to this fight. I would like to see a solution. Am I confident that he best people are on the job? Yes. Can I say with any certainty that a solution is in the works? Not so much..... We will all have to wait and see what happens.

 

[Ab_Normal]

If the laws get passed that are being heard in the legislature then the best thing that can happen is that the excessive wait times will continue through the enactment of any laws passed.

 

[Mark75H]

I can't understand how wait times have continued to increase.
Shortly after the Newtown incident, gun stores were completely packed and I would see a dozen people filling out paperwork at the same time. Wait times went from 7 to 21 days.
These days, supply seems to be dried up and even though when stores get inventory it goes quickly, I don't see the massive purchases that I did a few months back.
Now, the MSP has said to have increased staffing, added computers and faxes, ect. Applications can't possibly be as many as a few months back yet, wait times have increased to over 40 days.
Some thing is not right here.

Its been 40~ days for a while. In the most recent batches, a bunch of applications came back in less than 40.

Its a pretty good chance that we are over the hump and the delay will start to ease up week by week. The last numbers I heard were that applications were down about 20% from the peak numbers in January.

There are tons of guns being sold via the internet ... just because local shops don't have inventory, doesn't mean they haven't been submitting transfer paperwork.

The numbers DO add up to me.

 

[TopShelf]

I have an email in to SAF. They seem to be the ones winning the 2A cases I will report back on their reply. If you are not an SAF member, I recommend join up - you can find them here: http://saf.org/

As for the posts telling you to, in short, do nothing...I have to respectfully disagree. Even a 7-day wait is unacceptable. IMO, priority 1 is stopping and watering down HB294. After that, there are more battles to fight. This does not end with the current MD legislative session...

 

[bobthefisher]

Started the transfer process on one pistol and three regulated rifles, and yes I'm a MD designated collector. The paperwork was sent and received Jan 22nd and still has not received a notification from MSP. My FFL is pretty good about contacting the MSP every week on all their transfers, and to my knowledge and multiple personal past transfers, has NEVER filled out the forms incorrectly. That's 47 days folks! I'm done. I'll be personally contacting an attorney next week, unless someone here has already started dealing with the matter, then PLEASE PLEASE PM me and let me know what I can do to help. I have resources (other legal council) and funds willing to put forth on resolving this matter. We should be forwarding this outrage to Douglas F. Gansler, Maryland's Attorney General office. At this point i don't give two sh!ts what the forms say, this is unconstitutional and my patients has officially ran out. Period!

 

[uneven]

Started the transfer process on one pistol and three regulated rifles, and yes I'm a MD designated collector. The paperwork was sent and received Jan 22nd and still has not received a notification from MSP. My FFL is pretty good about contacting the MSP every week on all their transfers, and to my knowledge and multiple personal past transfers, has NEVER filled out the forms incorrectly. That's 47 days folks! I'm done. I'll be personally contacting an attorney next week, unless someone here has already started dealing with the matter, then PLEASE PLEASE PM me and let me know what I can do to help. I have resources (other legal council) and funds willing to put forth on resolving this matter. We should be forwarding this outrage to Douglas F. Gansler, Maryland's Attorney General office. At this point i don't give two sh!ts what the forms say, this is unconstitutional and my patients has officially ran out. Period!

If you cant prove damages, harm, business loss or other direct injury I cant imagine a lawyer touching it.

 

[bobthefisher]

If you cant prove damages, harm, business loss or other direct injury I cant imagine a lawyer touching it.

That would be true if weren't adverse to constitutional law. This is not dirty city drinking water we're talking about.

 

[JR9390]

I cant blame any dealer for not wanting to even chance releasing a regulated firearm on the 8th day without a NICS # from MSP. If some bureaucrat doesn't like it the headache the dealer will get isn't worth the 30-40 days they saved you.

 

[Right2Carry]

PA and VA use the same NICS system, and the customer walks out the door minutes later with gun. Maryland simply wants to make sure the person purchasing the weapon is documented.

 

[uneven]

That would be true if weren't adverse to constitutional law. This is not dirty city drinking water we're talking about.

If they are making clear good faith effort to comply with all regulations, Im willing to bet a lawsuit would fail, assuming you find an attorney who would touch it.

My view, this is like suing Walmart because you have to wait in line because you went shopping the day a storm hit.

 

[L0gic]

Maryland simply wants to make sure the person purchasing the weapon is documented.

Isn't that in itself illegal?

(Federal Law 18 U.S.C. 926 (http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/926) being:
No such rule or regulation prescribed [by the Attorney General] after the date of the enactment of the Firearms Owners Protection Act may require that records required to be maintained under this chapter or any portion of the contents of such records, be recorded at or transferred to a facility owned, managed, or controlled by the United States or any State or any political subdivision thereof, nor that any system of registration of firearms, firearms owners, or firearms transactions or disposition be established. Nothing in this section expands or restricts the Secretary's authority to inquire into the disposition of any firearm in the course of a criminal investigation.

 

[Ab_Normal]

If you cant prove damages, harm, business loss or other direct injury I cant imagine a lawyer touching it.

Breach of contract. The MSP is taking your money and not upholding their end of the contract - perform a background check in 7 days.

Rights delayed are rights denied.

 

[Ab_Normal]

Isn't that in itself illegal?

(Federal Law 18 U.S.C. 926 (http://www.law.cornell.edu/uscode/text/18/926) being:
No such rule or regulation prescribed [by the Attorney General] after the date of the enactment of the Firearms Owners Protection Act may require that records required to be maintained under this chapter or any portion of the contents of such records, be recorded at or transferred to a facility owned, managed, or controlled by the United States or any State or any political subdivision thereof, nor that any system of registration of firearms, firearms owners, or firearms transactions or disposition be established. Nothing in this section expands or restricts the Secretary's authority to inquire into the disposition of any firearm in the course of a criminal investigation.

The Md. form is for the application to purchase/voluntary registration so technically no they aren't breaking the law because you sign at the bottom that you are doing it voluntarily. Like you have any other choice.