Good Article on "Stopping Power"

[ampdog]

FYI... Enjoy

The Myth of Handgun "Stopping Power"
http://cheaperthandirt.com/blog/?p=19467

 

[glock9mm]

Great article...Thanks for posting!!

 

[Mason-Dixon Baseball]

From the above linked article----

Handguns are not nearly as powerful as the movies, the media, and the firearms industry itself want you to believe. Regardless of your caliber of choice, train often, shoot fast and accurately, and be prepared for a life-threatening fight that continues after you’ve emptied the magazine. When deciding on what ammo to carry, do your own research and don’t believe the hype!

 

[04RWon]

So .40, 9mm and .45, doesnt matter none really help more than the other? Also 1st comment said the 9mm dxp expands to a larger size than most .45 hp's? Meaning that the advantage of a bigger bullet is lost after expansion?

 

[Demoneyes86]

That was a good read thanks.

 

[Dogabutila]

So .40, 9mm and .45, doesnt matter none really help more than the other? Also 1st comment said the 9mm dxp expands to a larger size than most .45 hp's? Meaning that the advantage of a bigger bullet is lost after expansion?

YMMV bullet/cartridge dependant. What IS known is that small light bullets travelling faster have a more consistent expansion then larger slower heavier ones do.


Even if .45 expands larger in the end, I'd rather have a smaller max expansion with more reliability in reaching the max, along with a higher capacity and faster rate of fire.

 

[04RWon]

YMMV bullet/cartridge dependant. What IS known is that small light bullets travelling faster have a more consistent expansion then larger slower heavier ones do.


Even if .45 expands larger in the end, I'd rather have a smaller max expansion with more reliability in reaching the max, along with a higher capacity and faster rate of fire.

I feel even better about buying a 9mm now damn i cant wait for it to come home lol.

This is interesting though. I like where this discussion is going. I did see a video before showing that 9mm penetrates further than 40 using ballistic gel. So with that and the 9 moving faster, technically the 9mm is a better round. So why all the dislike for 9mm from people?(not on this forum) i dont know how many times ive heard, you aint stopping nothing with a 9. Plus lots of pd's switching to .40, fbi switching etc?

 

[hvymax]

There are a lot of variables. If energy transfer is important then there is NO replacement for displacement. I remember an IDPA event years ago. There was a pepper popper and several emptied their 9mm's on it. Only headshots would take it down. 40S&W needed well placed shots. My 44mag almost sent it end over end.

 

[km04]

Good article. Thanks for the read.

 

[Mooseman]

Interesting article. Thanks

 

[04RWon]

Isnt a pepper popper different than a human though? No doubt a .44 mag would blow anything away

 

[Swoop]

From the above linked article----

Handguns are not nearly as powerful as the movies, the media, and the firearms industry itself want you to believe. Regardless of your caliber of choice, train often, shoot fast and accurately, and be prepared for a life-threatening fight that continues after you’ve emptied the magazine. When deciding on what ammo to carry, do your own research and don’t believe the hype!

Great article! If you don’t hit vital areas what is the point of carrying in the first place.

As a side note: When you are looking for the right ammunition for personnel defense you need to factor in the bullet’s weight and the the barrel legnth of your handgun. It is crucial in regards to the expansion and penetration of the hollow point.

 

[Trekker]

Well, time to expose my lack of experience -

After reading postings and links to articles, I have read a good deal about stopping power and performance of different cartridges. In terms of penetration and bullet expansion ballistic gel seems to be a primary test. What I would like to ask is:

Does ballistic gel just simulate meat? Along with skin, fat, and muscle (which I will collectively call meat), animals have bones as well. What information/tests are there to show which bullets break through bones vs. deflecting off them? Has anyone suspended bones in ballistic gel while it congeals as a test?

 

[Fishguy]

What I take away from the story: use a shotgun.

 

[BigDuphis]

Well, time to expose my lack of experience -

After reading postings and links to articles, I have read a good deal about stopping power and performance of different cartridges. In terms of penetration and bullet expansion ballistic gel seems to be a primary test. What I would like to ask is:

Does ballistic gel just simulate meat? Along with skin, fat, and muscle (which I will collectively call meat), animals have bones as well. What information/tests are there to show which bullets break through bones vs. deflecting off them? Has anyone suspended bones in ballistic gel while it congeals as a test?

That's a good point, I would think the weight of the bullet would be a key factor, as well as the shape when it makes impact...ie a big mushroomed bullet would probably have a better shot of making a square (breaking) impact vs. ball ammo with a rounded front having a higher chance of deflecting. Of course that also raises the question of what is more desirable? I square bone breaking shot is more likely to slow down and not penetrate much further. A deflected shot will be more likely to penetrate further, possibly in a totally different direction.

 

[Trekker]

That's a good point, I would think the weight of the bullet would be a key factor, as well as the shape when it makes impact...ie a big mushroomed bullet would probably have a better shot of making a square (breaking) impact vs. ball ammo with a rounded front having a higher chance of deflecting. Of course that also raises the question of what is more desirable? I square bone breaking shot is more likely to slow down and not penetrate much further. A deflected shot will be more likely to penetrate further, possibly in a totally different direction.

I suppose it would depend on how much power the bullet had. If the bullet would stop or penetrate shallowly after a square impact on bone, then deflection might be preferable. Of course, if I had a bullet capable of crashing through bone and continuing on to its target, then I would feel more confident on the shot going where I want rather than hoping for a deflection heading the correct direction.

What I take away from the story: use a shotgun.

I like this answer. Nevermind 9mm vs .40 vs .45, 12 gauge slug wins hands down.

 

[BigDuphis]

I suppose it would depend on how much power the bullet had. If the bullet would stop or penetrate shallowly after a square impact on bone, then deflection might be preferable. Of course, if I had a bullet capable of crashing through bone and continuing on to its target, then I would feel more confident on the shot going where I want rather than hoping for a deflection heading the correct direction.



I like this answer. Nevermind 9mm vs .40 vs .45, 12 gauge slug wins hands down.

I would also think I wouldn't rule out the pain factor of having rib bones shattered, or possible the shards and pointy ends of those broken bones doing more damage.

 

[Second Amendment]

FYI... Enjoy

The Myth of Handgun "Stopping Power"
http://cheaperthandirt.com/blog/?p=19467

Would love to read it, but my webblocker prevents it. But, it allows me to log in here? Go figure.

 

[Baccusboy]

I feel a 9mm is plenty fine, in general.

Where I'd see a .45 having an advantage, in addition to the somewhat larger average permanent cavity, is the ability to break a spinal column after the bullet has traveled a distance through the body (due to extra weight). A 9mm bullet with higher penetration could equal that, but I see an advantage to having a .45 here. Even still, it's probably not a huge advantage.

I like the 9mm. I like the .45. Haven't shot a .40, but if I handle the recoil well, I'll probably wish I had one.

 

[BigDuphis]

I feel a 9mm is plenty fine, in general.

Where I'd see a .45 having an advantage, in addition to the somewhat larger average permanent cavity, is the ability to break a spinal column after the bullet has traveled a distance through the body (due to extra weight). A 9mm bullet with higher penetration could equal that, but I see an advantage to having a .45 here. Even still, it's probably not a huge advantage.

I like the 9mm. I like the .45. Haven't shot a .40, but if I handle the recoil well, I'll probably wish I had one.

I agree, I think think they're both adequate rounds as long as it's what you practice with and can put the shots where you want them.
I have a .45 in my nightstand because that's what I'm good with, my wife has a 9mm in hers because that's what she's best with.
As has been said, shot placement really is the most important thing over anything else. If you can put several 22's in a vital, it's far better than flailing with a 45 that you can't control and putting one in the arm and one in the wall.