Just got off the phone With the State Police

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    shawn

    Active Member
    Oct 23, 2007
    708
    OK.
    Just Called the licensing division.
    I have been getting mixed opinions on what we can do regarding transporting firearms.

    I first asked about transporting handguns.
    I told him I knew it had to be unloaded and in an enclosed case or holster.
    So i then asked him if unloaded meant an unloaded magazine out of the weapon.
    He said they DO consider a loaded magazine as a loaded weapon.
    He said it is not in the law I referenced but it is probable cause to arrest.
    He went on to say that even if you didnt have a firearm in the vehcile but had a loaded magazine then he could arrest you. It was interesting that he also said they prob could not get a conviction on it but they could still arrest you and search. He also said it isnt worth getting arrested and dealing with all the junk that follows.
    I asked him how I could transport the handgun legally.
    He said magazine unloaded, pistol and mag and ammo can be in the same bag or case but ammo must be in a separate compartment. Like an outside pocket. ( I think this is stupid but hey thats what he told me. Also note that he agreed that this is not in the law BUT it is probable cause to search and arrest.)

    He also talked about lunging distance. I.E. if you could grab it while driving. He said if so he could search and arrest.

    Next I asked him about transporting rifles shotguns and "regulated weapons" AR, AK type.
    He said Regulated weapons are treated exactly the same as handguns.

    He said "hunting" rifles and shotguns have to be in a case and the chamber open. And than ammo has to be in a separate pocket of the case.

    He also said it has to be out of lunging distance.

    Ok so here are the things I learned.

    It is a myth that you HAVE to put firearms in the trunk.

    We CAN travel with a shotgun in the car or truck with ammo in the same case but in a pocket or something.:party29:

    I dont agree with the Sgt that I spoke to about the unloaded mag or "lunging distance", or pistol and ammo in seprate pockets of a bag BUT at least I now know what they will arrest me for.

    Also If I get stopped and a Trooper want to arrest me for having a shotgun and ammo in my truck I can at least say that I spoke with a Trooper at the licensing division and told told me what I could do and not do.
     

    Adams74Chevy

    Hits broadsides of barns
    Oct 3, 2007
    2,699
    Carroll Co.
    I wouldn't count on getting a MSP who will agree with who ever you spoke to. I think the answers will vary depending on many variables such as your behavior, the trooper's mood, the circumstances you are being stopped for, the appearance of your vehicle and the visible items inside. Myself, I'll be safe instead of sorry or turned into a sacrifial scapegoat for the states attorney. Just me $0.02
     

    DD214

    Founder
    Apr 26, 2005
    14,080
    St Mary's County
    What causes me the most heartburn is the "regulated" long guns being treated as handguns. If that is the case it will put a serious hurtin' on my range time during the week.
     

    xd40c

    Business Owner-Gun Toter
    Sep 20, 2007
    2,067
    East Earl, PA
    Sounds like the MSP is legislating from the Barracks. :sad20:

    Agreed. Why would they arrest if they new they would not get a conviction. Sounds like a false arrest.

    "We don't want you to move your guns about so we're going to make it as hard as possible, regardless of the law."
     

    novus collectus

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    May 1, 2005
    17,358
    Bowie
    Oooohhhhh there are so many things wrong with his ********.

    Probable cause...maybe, but arrest for what? He admits no law is broken, so what can he arrest for?

    A loaded magazine is not a weapon. The state of MD and the federal government say the reciever of the frame of a firearm are the "gun" and everything else is a part. Unless it was used as a club or as a stabbing tool, it is not a "weapon" either.

    If a magazine is illegal to be loaded when seperate from the gun, then how does he explain ammo clips and speed loaders? Also if he thinks the reasonableness of a loaded mag making a gun quickly usable, then why does he say having ammo near the handgun is ok? Doesn't he realize it is just as easy to drop a single round in the chamber and use it as a weapon?
    He is talking out of his ass.

    Lunging distance?....the code says we are allowed to have the handgun on our person and if that is nolt within "lunging distance" then I don't know what is.
    Example:
    (3) the carrying of a handgun on the person or in a vehicle while the person is transporting the handgun to or from the place of legal purchase or sale, or to or from a bona fide repair shop, or between bona fide residences of the person, or between the bona fide residence and place of business of the person, if the business is operated and owned substantially by the person if each handgun is unloaded and carried in an enclosed case or an enclosed holster;

    (4) the wearing, carrying, or transporting by a person of a handgun used in connection with an organized military activity, a target shoot, formal or informal target practice, sport shooting event, hunting, a Department of Natural Resources-sponsored firearms and hunter safety class, trapping, or a dog obedience training class or show, while the person is engaged in, on the way to, or returning from that activity if each handgun is unloaded and carried in an enclosed case or an enclosed holster;


    Transport of regulated rifles are not treated the same. The code states this plainly:
    (c) (1) "Handgun" means a pistol, revolver, or other firearm capable of being concealed on the person.

    (2) "Handgun" includes a short-barreled shotgun and a short-barreled rifle.

    (3) "Handgun" does not include a shotgun, rifle, or antique firearm.



    Also If I get stopped and a Trooper want to arrest me for having a shotgun and ammo in my truck I can at least say that I spoke with a Trooper at the licensing division and told told me what I could do and not do.
    Wouldn't be good enough, you need to get it in writing from them.
     

    Half-cocked

    Senior Meatbag
    Mar 14, 2006
    23,937
    So in their eyes, a citizen going on a peaceable journey to the range deserves the same contempt as a criminal, and "needs" to be arrested... for what? To teach them a lesson?

    Never mind that they're not breaking the law, as it's written into the books - they'll arrest you, even knowing they'll probably lose in court? Again, why? "Because we can"???

    I am moving out of this farking state, as soon as I have the first opportunity.
     

    novus collectus

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    May 1, 2005
    17,358
    Bowie
    Here's a question......if I am pulled over for speeding on the way to the range, should I say I have an unloaded firearm in the back or keep it to myself unless specifically asked?
    Personally I would wait to be asked and even then I might say it is none of his business depending on the attitude he or she has.
    Generally though I would be cordial and say I am on the way to the range.
     

    Half-cocked

    Senior Meatbag
    Mar 14, 2006
    23,937
    Here's a question......if I am pulled over for speeding on the way to the range, should I say I have an unloaded firearm in the back or keep it to myself unless specifically asked?

    Never, ever, ever, ever tell a cop that you have a firearm in your vehicle... there is just no reason to.... ever. If asked, you can't lie without breaking the law, but I doubt you'd ever be asked unless you were being arrested for something. In which case, they'll find it anyway.
     

    alucard0822

    For great Justice
    Oct 29, 2007
    17,711
    PA
    Sounds like the MSP is legislating from the Barracks. :sad20:

    Basically threatening to make anyone transporting within their legal rights a test case.
    There is also not a word about the "action open" for rifles, and as Novus pointed out, their guidelines (or that particular troopers take on it) are in excess of the law, and would likely get thrown out of court, after someone has been wrongly arrested, imprisoned, bailed out, and spent a fortune on legal representation. Then again an anti-gun judge could determine almost anything, and it would stand unless the decision was appealed and overturned. If that's not infringement, I don't know what is. OTOH, in PA, I can carry a leaded pistol darn near everywhere, and take them to the range any safe way I can.
     

    shawn

    Active Member
    Oct 23, 2007
    708
    i agree this all ******** and the only thing i regret is not asking him to put this in writing and i hate to say this but they can basically arrest you for whatever they want it will take a court case challenging this type of this for the troopers to change how they act i am a wuss because i DO NOT want to be the test case
     

    novus collectus

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    May 1, 2005
    17,358
    Bowie
    i agree this all ******** and the only thing i regret is not asking him to put this in writing and i hate to say this but they can basically arrest you for whatever they want it will take a court case challenging this type of this for the troopers to change how they act i am a wuss because i DO NOT want to be the test case
    I will continue to transport with loaded mags not in the empty handgun in the enclosed case or enclosed hoslter.

    If for some reason you call him back, ask him if the "lunging" rule still applies when someone is going to the range on a bicycle or motorcycle without a storage compartment.
     

    fivepointstar

    Thank you MD-Goodbye
    Apr 28, 2008
    30,714
    3rd Rock from the Sun
    Why not just be honest??

    Never, ever, ever, ever tell a cop that you have a firearm in your vehicle... there is just no reason to.... ever. If asked, you can't lie without breaking the law, but I doubt you'd ever be asked unless you were being arrested for something. In which case, they'll find it anyway.

    First of all.....if you're transporting a firearm for legal purposes, don't do anythign stupid like speed or run a red light to draw attention to you. Tranporting a firearms is totally legal as long as its done to the letter of the law. As long as the ammo is seperate and locked away from firearm that is LOCKED away then you should be good. Any cop, even a rookie, would be able to figure out that its not "concealed" and carried for an unlawful purpose. As others have suggested locked the firearm in the trunk and if you can lock the ammo in the "not in the trunk" if you can lock it in a seperate case that would be preferrable.

    Second.....I disagree with "never tell a cop you have a gun" and to "lie"....Don't hide something if you NOTHING TO HIDE. You're doing nothing wrong and you're not breaking the law so why lie??? Cops are no dummies!! What you don't need is them to build PC to search a vehicle. Terry v. Ohio (Terry Stop/Frisk) can extend to a vehicle if the officer/trooper can articulate.

    LISTEN, how easy is it to articulate that an officer beleives there's a gun in the car.
    1. you wear a shirt and hat that a pistol range logo and name
    2. there hearing protection in your front seat
    3. there is eye protection in your center console
    4. you have the box trash of used ammo on the floor board of your car.
    5. you have free gun magazines/catalogs that you get from the range.

    To sum things up: If you have a gun in the car, don't do stupid sh*t to draw attention to you.
     

    fivepointstar

    Thank you MD-Goodbye
    Apr 28, 2008
    30,714
    3rd Rock from the Sun
    i agree this all ******** and the only thing i regret is not asking him to put this in writing and i hate to say this but they can basically arrest you for whatever they want it will take a court case challenging this type of this for the troopers to change how they act i am a wuss because i DO NOT want to be the test case

    Troopers really can't arrest you for "whatever they want" there has to be probable cause that a crime has occurred. Right now I don't see any crime. And as far as court....."Innocent until proven guilty" (OJ is innocent?)
     
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