Cannot load a full mag in Mini-14 with bolt closed?

[Trepang]

UPDATED: Cannot load a full mag in Mini-14 with bolt closed?

I have never owned a Mini-14 before and I just discovered I cannot load a fully loaded magazine in the rifle with the bolt closed.

I can load a fully loaded 5 round & 10 round mag with the bolt latched open but not with it closed.

I can load an empty mag with the bolt closed without any issues.

The owners manual says "magazine can be loaded with the bolt in either the open or closed position". Well I can't unless they are referring to an empty magazine.

Is this a quirk of the Mini-14 or is something not right with my brand new rifle?

 

[danb]

Hmmmmm. I will have to check, but I am sure I can load it with the bolt closed.

Yes, the mini-14 loads with the bolt closed.

Are you using bona fide Ruger mags? Tilting the mag into the well properly?

 

[smdub]

Did you overload the mag? (can you still press the top round down a little w/ your thumb?)
To insert a mag in a gun w/ the bolt closed, it needs to be able to push the top round down a little. So a 10rd mag really has to have enough space for ~10.5 rounds. SOME mags this gets close enough to 11 that you can jam an extra round in there if you try hard enough. You will not be able to insert the overloaded mag in. Some of my 7rd 1911 mags I can jam an 8th round in if I try hard enough. Same problem.

 

[amoebicmagician]

with stock ruger mags, mine works fine. With some magazines though, it will only close on a closed bolt if there is an even number of cartridges.

It is this way with every mini I've owned.

Odd number of cartridges, it hangs up but you can power it into locking in, even number, no problem.

It's the way the bolt is shaped, as long as the round on top is in the left column, it should be fine.

 

[Trepang]

I am using factory Ruger magazines. I can feel it catching the pin on the front of the magazine, but I cannot get it to lock in.

I tried it by using 4 rounds in the 5 round mag and 9 rounds in the 10 - still doesn't lock in.

I even tried it with one, single round in the magazine - still won't lock in.

When I try to give it a little encouragement, by popping the bottom of the magazine, I end up denting the top round.

Loads perfectly fine with the bolt open.

I will call Ruger tomorrow. I haven't even fired the damn thing yet - not real happy about having a brand new $750 rifle that doesn't function as designed.

 

[amoebicmagician]

Did you overload the mag? (can you still press the top round down a little w/ your thumb?)
To insert a mag in a gun w/ the bolt closed, it needs to be able to push the top round down a little. So a 10rd mag really has to have enough space for ~10.5 rounds. SOME mags this gets close enough to 11 that you can jam an extra round in there if you try hard enough. You will not be able to insert the overloaded mag in. Some of my 7rd 1911 mags I can jam an 8th round in if I try hard enough. Same problem.

my older ruger 20 rounders can accomodate 23 rounds. My 30 round tapcos accomodate 33.

I would not recommend overloading though, under any circumstances. This is not a winky-winky advisory, this is real deal advice.

 

[danb]

I am using factory Ruger magazines. I can feel it catching the pin on the front of the magazine, but I cannot get it to lock in.

I tried it by using 4 rounds in the 5 round mag and 9 rounds in the 10 - still doesn't lock in.

I even tried it with one, single round in the magazine - still won't lock in.

When I try to give it a little encouragement, by popping the bottom of the magazine, I end up denting the top round.

Loads perfectly fine with the bolt open.

I will call Ruger tomorrow. I haven't even fired the damn thing yet - not real happy about having a brand new $750 rifle that doesn't function as designed.

If you can get the mag to load empty, try starting with one or two rounds and see if it works with the bolt closed. If that works, add rounds until it ceases to load. Always be safe, of course.

I see you tried that.

Mine does not seem to care odd or even # rounds. But you might try that.

I strongly suspect your mag follower springs are extra stiff. My mags came from the factory so tight it was difficult to get even the stated # in. They are well broken in now, I can even stuff extra rounds in. If it turns out to be the follower springs, that's easy to remedy.

hmmm. See, if it does not load with the bolt closed, I would be worried it would not fire and strip the next round properly.

 

[Blkhawk870]

I have 3 mini-14s and I've never had an issue like that. If you're having this problem with several factory magazines then it sounds like something may be wrong with the rifle. You may want to contact Ruger.

By the way, where is the round getting dented when you try to insert a loaded magazine? I'm curious as to what it is hitting.

 

[Trepang]

I have done some more poking around on the internet - A LOT of comments / complaints from people having the same issue.

It seems to load perfectly fine if you load the mag with the bolt open. I haven't had a chance to shoot it yet, but if I load it with an open bolt and then cycle the bolt by hand it seems to feed and eject okay.

Seriously disappointed - I prefer to store my guns with a loaded magazine but the chamber empty.

 

[danb]

I have done some more poking around on the internet - A LOT of comments / complaints from people having the same issue.

It seems to load perfectly fine if you load the mag with the bolt open. I haven't had a chance to shoot it yet, but if I load it with an open bolt and then cycle the bolt by hand it seems to feed and eject okay.

Seriously disappointed - I prefer to store my guns with a loaded magazine but the chamber empty.

But if you load it and then cycle the bolt, can you change mags while the bolt is closed?

Where did you get the rifle?

 

[Pinecone]

You need to apply the force at the back of the bottom of the mag or the front (force backwards at the bottom).

You are trying to rotate the magazine to the read, NOT push it straight up into the rifle.

I have had Minis since about 77, and never had a problem loading a full mag with the bolt closed.

 

[Trepang]

I have 3 mini-14s and I've never had an issue like that. If you're having this problem with several factory magazines then it sounds like something may be wrong with the rifle. You may want to contact Ruger.

By the way, where is the round getting dented when you try to insert a loaded magazine? I'm curious as to what it is hitting.

See picture below.

The top round hits the bottom side of the bolt when I try and load a loaded magazine.

I plan to call Ruger first thing tomorrow.

But if you load it and then cycle the bolt, can you change mags while the bolt is closed?

Where did you get the rifle?

No - not easily anyway.

I just went and got it out of the safe and fooled with it some more - I got it to lock in once with the bolt closed but I had to push on it pretty good to depress the rounds against bolt to get it to lock - not something I want to have to fight with.

I bought the gun from Gun Genie via a local FFL

You need to apply the force at the back of the bottom of the mag or the front (force backwards at the bottom).

You are trying to rotate the magazine to the read, NOT push it straight up into the rifle.

I have had Minis since about 77, and never had a problem loading a full mag with the bolt closed.

Yes, I am "rocking" the magazine in.

The magazines all lock in perfectly when loading it with the bolt open and when you release the bolt, it strips off and chambers a round perfectly.

I can also load an empty magazine with a closed bolt without issue.

I Googled "problem loading Mini-14 with closed bolt" and found hundreds of comments from people with the same issue. It seems as though people just stick with loading it with the bolt open and others claim they have had problems with the 5 and 10 round magazines but they can closed bolt load the 20 rounders which I haven't gotten yet.

This link is to reviews of 10 round magazines on Rugers own website. The leading complaint: Cannot load with a closed bolt!
http://shopruger.com/Mini-14-10-Round-Magazine/productinfo/90339/

 

[danb]

I am sure Ruger will send some new mags.

If the 5 and 10 rounders have production issues, the only solution is to take a road trip to free America and buy full size ones.

 

[Trepang]

the only solution is to take a road trip to free America and buy full size ones.

On the schedule for this coming Saturday.

 

[amoebicmagician]

the 30 routers work well, as do the tapco magazines with the reinforced from locking hole. I d not really trust nutnfancy, but he collaborated with them and the gen 2 tapco mini mags are made of stiffer polymer and have that front locking hole reinforced with hardened steel. They work great. Also, don't be afraid to apply some leverage when seating the mag, there may just be some friction between the follower and the mag body as the follower pivots at a strange angle when accommodating the mag into the well

 

[smdub]

I only have 20 & 30 round ones. So maybe the problem is limited to the smaller mags? I did buy one (two?) of the newer tapcos just to try and it does indeed work after a little fixing. The feed lips are high enough they drag on the bolt of both my guns - I'd have to bump it into battery manually on the first round. Either a little filing or simply running it a couple boxes of ammo though it will shave them down.

As much as I hate to say it, some tapco (crapco) mags have gotten better. One AK mag came w/ my PTR32 and its as reliable as any of the various combloc ones I have. The new HK93 ones are getting rave reviews so I picked up a bunch of them last month. At $11ea vs $80ea they are a no brainer for range mags for the 93.

Edit: The HK93 mags are promag - not tapco. Goes to show that companies historically known for crap can produce something decent if they put their mind to it and try.

 

[amoebicmagician]

I only have 20 & 30 round ones. So maybe the problem is limited to the smaller mags? I did buy one (two?) of the newer tapcos just to try and it does indeed work after a little fixing. The feed lips are high enough they drag on the bolt of both my guns - I'd have to bump it into battery manually on the first round. Either a little filing or simply running it a couple boxes of ammo though it will shave them down.

As much as I hate to say it, some tapco (crapco) mags have gotten better. One AK mag came w/ my PTR32 and its as reliable as any of the various combloc ones I have. The new HK93 ones are getting rave reviews so I picked up a bunch of them last month. At $11ea vs $80ea they are a no brainer for range mags for the 93.

Tapco has come a long way. They hired some of the best polymer engineers in the business in 2011, and I've seen damn good things from them.

Their glass reinforced nylon products are generally immensely strong and run very reliably. I generally don't use them for AR mags since there are AMAZING magazines with proven track records for the same price, but the two I have run flawlessly. I bought a bunch of the slab sided bakelite colored ak mags because I got a great deal on LITERALLY a backpack full of them.

I dedicated seven of them to destructive testing and I am here to tell you these things are some rugged motherfathers. Would I rather have something with steel reinforced lugs and feed lips? Yes.
Have I been able to break them under anything resembling real world use? No.

I have run the damn things over with my car, thrown them loaded off the roof, and just generally beat them to shit, they still functioned fine and did not seem any the worse for wear other than cosmetic scratches. I also put a them into my vise and found the only way I was able to break the lugs off at anything less than absolutely crazy pressure was when the magazines were frozen overnight on my freezer's lowest (coldest) setting. If I had to go to war they wouldn't be the first ones I would reach for, but if that's all that was there, I would not be too butthurt about it.

Promag on the other hand, are pieces of absolute shit with the worst follower design ever and the most sub par polymer I've seen in a commercial magazine to date

 

[danb]

Tapco has come a long way. They hired some of the best polymer engineers in the business in 2011, and I've seen damn good things from them.

Their glass reinforced nylon products are generally immensely strong and run very reliably. I generally don't use them for AR mags since there are AMAZING magazines with proven track records for the same price, but the two I have run flawlessly. I bought a bunch of the slab sided bakelite colored ak mags because I got a great deal on LITERALLY a backpack full of them.

I dedicated seven of them to destructive testing and I am here to tell you these things are some rugged motherfathers. Would I rather have something with steel reinforced lugs and feed lips? Yes.
Have I been able to break them under anything resembling real world use? No.

I have run the damn things over with my car, thrown them loaded off the roof, and just generally beat them to shit, they still functioned fine and did not seem any the worse for wear other than cosmetic scratches. I also put a them into my vise and found the only way I was able to break the lugs off at anything less than absolutely crazy pressure was when the magazines were frozen overnight on my freezer's lowest (coldest) setting. If I had to go to war they wouldn't be the first ones I would reach for, but if that's all that was there, I would not be too butthurt about it.

Promag on the other hand, are pieces of absolute shit with the worst follower design ever and the most sub par polymer I've seen in a commercial magazine to date

I bought some Promag mags for my mini-14 when I first got it. They were cheap. They turned my Mini into a jam-o-matic and the feed lips broke.

Just say no!

 

[Trepang]

Called Ruger - they were very responsive - the guy I spoke with said he would go track down an answer and call me back. Within 5 minute he called with "Yeah, they do that - we recommend you load them with the bolt open".

I went ahead and made the trip to VA and got some Ruger 20 round magazines to see if that made difference. Night & Day! They load flawlessly with the bolt closed.

I think maybe it's because they are longer and you have more leverage to rock the magazine in? I don't know but they lock in as smooth as can be and the top round is not dented at all. It charges fine as well when cycling the bolt on a loaded mag. I tried it with 18, 19 & 20 rounds in the mag - it didn't seem to make a difference - they all loaded like I think they should. It is now safely tucked away in the safe with 19 in the magazine and an empty chamber.

I appreciate all the suggestions and help. Problem solved.

 

[danb]

Called Ruger - they were very responsive - the guy I spoke with said he would go track down an answer and call me back. Within 5 minute he called with "Yeah, they do that - we recommend you load them with the bolt open".

I went ahead and made the trip to VA and got some Ruger 20 round magazines to see if that made difference. Night & Day! They load flawlessly with the bolt closed.

I think maybe it's because they are longer and you have more leverage to rock the magazine in? I don't know but they lock in as smooth as can be and the top round is not dented at all. It charges fine as well when cycling the bolt on a loaded mag. I tried it with 18, 19 & 20 rounds in the mag - it didn't seem to make a difference - they all loaded like I think they should. It is now safely tucked away in the safe with 19 in the magazine and an empty chamber.

I appreciate all the suggestions and help. Problem solved.

Maybe its some kind of passive aggressive thing: communist 5 and 10 round mags refuse to seat in an all-american rifle. Must. have. 20. boolits.