What Spooked The FFLs?

[Gbh]

Interesting term use here.

This is the way I understand it, correct me if I am wrong here and I will edit.

NICS has 3 possible responses: PROCEED, DELAY, DENIED

MSP has 3: NOT DISAPPROVED, DISAPPROVED, HOLD

The State of Maryland juxtapositioned itself as the POC between the FFL and NICS for regulated firearms.

For unregulated firearms, the FFL calls NICS directly and gets one of the three possible answers within minutes (been my experience every time). If a DELAY is received, NICS can respond within 3 days with either of the other two responses. Silence is interpreted as PROCEED and the FFL CAN release the firearm.

For regulated firearms, the FFL and the purchaser complete both the State (77R) and Federal (4473) forms. The FFL then sends the State form (77R) to the MSP for regulated firearms. Part of the MSP background check is the NICS check. There are 16 other checks in MD. Somewhere in the process the MSP does a NICS check and records the NTN on the State form. When the State form comes back it has the NICS check number recorded. The FFL then records the NTN on the Federal form.

The MSP has 7 days by law to "DISAPPROVE" or "HOLD" the purchase. Currently they have an infinite amount of time to issue the "NOT DISAPPROVED". The Maryland annotated code gives the FFL the ABILITY to release the regulated firearm after 7 days if a DISAPPROVE or HOLD has not been issued with the word MAY. That leaves it up to the discretion of the FFL. And the FFL can set terms as he/she chooses for that discretion.

Federal Law allows the FFL to release the firearm after 8 days (per Brady Law and POC FAQ) if they have no response. Again, the FFL has the ABILITY to release the firearm.

In the end, the FFL is not breaking any laws by releasing the regulated firearms after 8 days if they sent in the forms and have a record of doing so, and have heard nothing. They gave the MSP the time required to issue the DISAPPROVED or HOLD notice. It remains unclear whether the MSP records receipt on their end or logs incoming 77R's.

BUT... And this is. Huge BUT.... They CAN wait too. And aren't breaking any laws by waiting.

Good summary.

So, If I'm MSP, and did not want firearms released prior to being reviewed, I would be sending out "holds" on every app that has not been looked at within 7 days.

 

[ShallNotInfringe]

Good summary.

So, If I'm MSP, and did not want firearms released prior to being reviewed, I would be sending out "holds" on every app that has not been looked at within 7 days.

Hold appears to be a special condition.

If they issued a hold... Then they have to have a hearing within 45 days...

Article - Public Safety

§ 5-126.
(a) (1) A firearm applicant who is aggrieved by the action of the Secretary may request a hearing by writing to the Secretary within 30 days after the Secretary forwards notice to the firearm applicant under § 5-122 of this subtitle.
(2) The Secretary shall grant the hearing within 15 days after receiving the request.
(b) The hearing shall be held in accordance with Title 10, Subtitle 2 of the State Government Article.
(c) The hearing shall be held in the county of the legal residence of the firearm applicant.

 

[swinokur]

By the statute that was posted, holds can only be issued when the Secretary finds an open legal case involving an applicant, not as admin procedure to delay processing.

Fax machines record incoming phone numbers, dates and times if that featiure is turned on.

 

[smokey]

oh man, this isn't going to happen, but I kind've wish it would....


basspro currently has literally thousands of guns in the cage, waiting for a "not-disapproved" so people can pick them up. It'd be hilarious to me if they released a public statement talking about the negative impacts this has on their business, their legal ability to release them, and then said due to the failure of the state they will begin releasing all of the thousands of guns as they are legally allowed to do. I wonder if the threat of thousands of guns being tossed out without the MSP doing a background check on them would encourage someone to change the POC for md...

 

[Pmbspyder]

Blah. Lgs just told me that msp is working on end of march. That means that it will be AT LEAST 4 months from when i made my early may purchase.

This whole thing reeks of foul play. Veiled threats from the FBI and msp sound pretty damn convincing of this. I wish ffls would just band together, adopt the same release policy and give msp a collective bird. There is strength in numbers...

 

[kohburn]

this should help get things flowing again http://www.mdshooters.com/showthread.php?t=123274

In binding legal statements filed to avoid our lawsuit, the State of Maryland has declared its position, never voiced officially prior to this lawsuit and contrary to many prior unofficial statements, that regulated firearms transfers are permissible after the seven-day waiting period and will not be punished.

Under Annotated Code of Maryland, Public Safety Article Section 5-123(a) and consistent with Code of Maryland Regulations Title 29 Section 03.01.10, a regulated firearm may be lawfully sold, leased or transferred by a licensed firearms dealer or other person after the seven-day waiting period, provided that the dealer or person has not received notice that the application has been placed on hold or disapproved by Maryland State Police (Public Safety Article Sec. 5-125(b)) and the dealer or person does not have actual knowledge or reasonable cause to believe that the recipient is disqualified from possessing a regulated firearm under
Maryland or federal law.

http://campaign.r20.constantcontact...wMrg3k3ErFjNBwdryirbAA-s-eTcK-2WlKESG7cb1KD4=

 

[jonnyl]

I posted this in another thread, but it seems appropriate here. It seems that the Feds expect their POCs to do the NICs early or expect that the firearms may be released without a check. This is the example that seems most like Maryland and is from the ATF website. NOTE especially that is does NOT say that they need to have a NICS# before release.

From Here:http://www.atf.gov/firearms/faq/brady-law.html#comply-brady-law

Q: If a State is acting as a NICS point of contact (POC) and State law has requirements regarding the amount of time that a licensee must wait before transferring a firearm after contacting the State, should the licensee comply with the State requirements, the Federal requirements, or both?

The licensee must comply with both State and Federal requirements.

Example: State D is acting as a POC for NICS checks. State law requires a background check prior to the transfer of any firearm. State law also requires the licensee to wait 10 days to get a response from the State. The licensee must contact the State POC for a NICS check and a State background check. The licensee must comply with both Federal and State law by waiting 10 days for a response prior to transferring the firearm. If the licensee has not received a response from the State after 10 days, he or she may transfer the firearm.

EDIT: a further thought is that all these laws (as heinous as some of them are) are written such that the state can't have a de-facto gun ban by sitting on apps.

 

[buzzsaw]

Was I just dreaming? Or did anyone else see a letter from BATFE (I think Smiegel posted it on his blog) that ATF said dealers can initiate the own NICS checks for long guns and receivers ("Other"), but NOT handguns in Maryland?

 

[Ranchero50]

Was I just dreaming? Or did anyone else see a letter from BATFE (I think Smiegel posted it on his blog) that ATF said dealers can initiate the own NICS checks for long guns and receivers ("Other"), but NOT handguns in Maryland?

Yep, it went back to how it was in May. Regulated receivers and long guns still go through MSP but non regulated receivers and long guns go through NICS.

Nothing really changed.

 

[shocka04]

I had a FFL recently tell me that they were told to stop releasing early. I didn't ask for any more information so I dont know who told them that.

 

[Pmbspyder]

Yep, it went back to how it was in May. Regulated receivers and long guns still go through MSP but non regulated receivers and long guns go through NICS.

Nothing really changed.

What the heck is a "non-regulated" receiver? All lowers are regulated.

I'm going to give my ffl a few days to hopefully learn about the pending end of the lawsuit and such and then I'll call to see if his policy has been updated. I will respect their decision either way, but it doesn't mean I agree with it in the least.

 

[ELEMENT94]

What the heck is a "non-regulated" receiver? All lowers are regulated.

I'm going to give my ffl a few days to hopefully learn about the pending end of the lawsuit and such and then I'll call to see if his policy has been updated. I will respect their decision either way, but it doesn't mean I agree with it in the least.

I assume it means the receiver of a bolt action rifle, or most all shotgun receivers.

 

[swinokur]

The receiver on a non regulated firearm is not regulated. C & C.

ie Colt HBAR.

 

[ELEMENT94]

The receiver on a non regulated firearm is not regulated. C & C.

ie Colt HBAR.

Then "non-regulated receiver" is FUBAR.

 

[jvegas]

What the heck is a "non-regulated" receiver? All lowers are regulated.

I'm going to give my ffl a few days to hopefully learn about the pending end of the lawsuit and such and then I'll call to see if his policy has been updated. I will respect their decision either way, but it doesn't mean I agree with it in the least.

Don't forget AR10 receivers. Dedicated 9mm/.22Lr AR receivers.

 

[hogrider]

what about this

Gun Shack, Mount Airy: "We have been told not to release without a nic# from the ATF and they will not give us one because of MD" 6/18 will not return my correspondence.

 

[jvegas]

what about this

Gun Shack, Mount Airy: "We have been told not to release without a nic# from the ATF and they will not give us one because of MD" 6/18 will not return my correspondence.

Told by who? ATF doesn't provide the NICS #.

 

[KD999]

Many if not most FFL's have specific conditions for an 8 day release, ie. DC letter, CCW, previous purchases, etc. Few to my knowledge are just releasing firearms to unknown customers.

Yes this is how the MSP memo was worded that if FFLs have a reason to believe an individual is not prohibited, they can do the 8th day releases by following the process layer out.

 

[JohnnyE]

I don't know how many FFL's there are in Maryland, but rather than each one hiring their own attorney to analyze state and federal law regarding the release of firearms, they should pool their resources through the Maryland Licensed Firearms Dealers Association and hire a top-flight attorney who is a specialist in these matters to prepare an opinion to be shared by all.

 

[A1Uni]

It's not the lawyers at this point.

It is the danger of prohibited persons taking advantage of a dealer who releases with no restrictions or checks simply based on an 8 day wait, and I don't believe there are many or in fact any that do it that way.

Consider the unpleasant possibilities, respect your FFLs business decisions and direct your anger in the proper direction, and I do not direct that comment at any person, but in general.