Two Old Bitter Enemies - 1942 German Walther PP & 1941 Russian Nagant M1895

[Trepang]

Last week I stumbled across a couple on my list and decided, what the hell....

1942 Walther PP 7.65mm - all matching with Nazi Waffenamts (Proof Marks)
1941 Russian Nagant 1895 - Made at Tula - It was re-arsenaled after WWII

I have found a 1947 Post-war holster for the Nagant and a second correct war-time magazine for the PP I but I am still looking for an early-war PP holster with makers marks.

Both guns are at my FFL on their 7-day Maryland hold. The pics are off the sellers website. I'll post more detailed pics once I get them home.

I am now casually looking for a 1917-1918 .45ACP M1917 revolver to be the next addition.

I appreciate the irony of stacking these in a rack next to each other. I intentionally alternate Allied and Axis guns in the handgun rack in the safe. The idea that these were used on opposing sides of WWII and now they are side by side at my house is kinda cool.

 

[Doctor_M]

Nice.

Pound for pound the infantry long guns (Mauser vs Mosin) were of pretty equal effectiveness between the Germans and Russians. Both hard hitting, robust, and accurate. In side arms however, I think just about every sidearm used by the Nazis outclassed the Mosin-Nagant revolver. That being said, I still think they are cool.

 

[Trepang]

I also have an all numbers matching 1943 P.38. I have had a chance to shoot it - it's nice.

I'd love to have a Russian T-33 Tokarev but all the ones I have come across are ratted out or $$$ so for now I settled on a Nagant 1895 to fill the Russian sidearm hole in my collection.

 

[GiveMeABreak]

Mauser HSc should be the next one and then of course a Luger. I have both the Colt and S&W1917 revolvers. Very substantial pieces of iron!

 

[somd_mustangs]

I really like your PP with WaA135 waffenamts.

I'd grab an Hsc before they start going crazy in price like everything else. FN 1922's and CZ27's are still a great value too.
The Radom vis 35 is already in Luger territory price-wise but that's a great pistol.
Of course it's a lot easier to sit here and spend someone else's money

 

[Trepang]

I really like your PP with WaA135 waffenamts.

I'd grab an Hsc before they start going crazy in price like everything else. FN 1922's and CZ27's are still a great value too.
The Radom vis 35 is already in Luger territory price-wise but that's a great pistol.
Of course it's a lot easier to sit here and spend someone else's money

Thanks!

These are pretty crappy pictures but it's a WaA359 Waffenamt.

I have been looking for a Tokarev but kinda gave up and then I saw that Simpson had this M1895 for sale on consignment at what I thought was a decent price so I jumped on it. It has been re-arsenaled but there are no import marks. It's actually in pretty nice shape. A box of PPU ammo for it came in yesterday. Curious how it shoots. The DA trigger pulls feels to be around 20lbs. lol

I really haven't looked into FNs or CZs yet. That will give me something to over the winter.

For whatever reason, Lugers don't do much for me. but I realize at some point I am going to "have" to get one just for the collection's sake.

 

[mawkie]

-That's a fantastic looking PP! I have an early pre-war police marked PP with the 90 deg safety. Been looking for a matching 90 deg PPK forever with zilch for results. So much so that I've watched market prices on PPKs hovering just below $2K on average, up from about $1K just 5-7 yrs ago. Ugh.
-Luckily Colt and S&W Model 1917s are out there in decent numbers and prices for them haven't climbed quite as much. You can get a really nice example for around $900-1K with a little sleuthing.
-Been watching non-import Nagant 1895s come to market lately as a lot of old collections are hitting the market. Ditto for bring-back Tokarevs though those are fetching a solid $1K-1.5K at auction, about twice what an 1895 will.
-Watched some decent starter Lugers sell cheap yesterday while virtually attending a Illinois auction (no goodies for me in that one, ran against serious competition with deep pockets). More than just about any other military arm you need to knowledge-up when tackling the Luger market. My best advice is to pick a part of the vast Luger world to focus on and grab a good reference book, like any of those authored by the late Jan Still. Lugers at Random is still a useful resource that can be bought for a fraction of Jan's coveted out-of-print books.
-SoMD_mustangs' advice is solid. There's so much out there in the Axis world that is still affordable and interesting. From the CZ27, Beretta 1935, French 1935a, MAB D, Unique 17, Sauer 38H (though these are taking off price-wise), HSc (grab one of these NOW as they have been languishing for decades, not anymore) and the Femaru (also taking off).

 

[Trepang]

-That's a fantastic looking PP! I have an early pre-war police marked PP with the 90 deg safety. Been looking for a matching 90 deg PPK forever with zilch for results. So much so that I've watched market prices on PPKs hovering just below $2K on average, up from about $1K just 5-7 yrs ago. Ugh.
-Luckily Colt and S&W Model 1917s are out there in decent numbers and prices for them haven't climbed quite as much. You can get a really nice example for around $900-1K with a little sleuthing.
-Been watching non-import Nagant 1895s come to market lately as a lot of old collections are hitting the market. Ditto for bring-back Tokarevs though those are fetching a solid $1K-1.5K at auction, about twice what an 1895 will.
-Watched some decent starter Lugers sell cheap yesterday while virtually attending a Illinois auction (no goodies for me in that one, ran against serious competition with deep pockets). More than just about any other military arm you need to knowledge-up when tackling the Luger market. My best advice is to pick a part of the vast Luger world to focus on and grab a good reference book, like any of those authored by the late Jan Still. Lugers at Random is still a useful resource that can be bought for a fraction of Jan's coveted out-of-print books.
-SoMD_mustangs' advice is solid. There's so much out there in the Axis world that is still affordable and interesting. From the CZ27, Beretta 1935, French 1935a, MAB D, Unique 17, Sauer 38H (though these are taking off price-wise), HSc (grab one of these NOW as they have been languishing for decades, not anymore) and the Femaru (also taking off).

Thanks - I appreciate the info.

SoMD_Mustang has helped me a lot and I sincerely appreciate your input as well.

What I usually do is buy a book or three and then scour the internet for info before I go shopping.

My problem is patience - I look and look and pass on them because I think they are asking too much. Then I get frustrated because I can't find what I am looking for and then I jump on the next one that checks all my boxes so I don't miss out on it.

 

[Sundazes]

Do you have a C&R? Just wondering.

 

[mawkie]

Thanks - I appreciate the info.

SoMD_Mustang has helped me a lot and I sincerely appreciate your input as well.

What I usually do is buy a book or three and then scour the internet for info before I go shopping.

My problem is patience - I look and look and pass on them because I think they are asking too much. Then I get frustrated because I can't find what I am looking for and then I jump on the next one that checks all my boxes so I don't miss out on it.

I'm just the opposite. Like water on a rock I'll grind away forever to get what I want. In the process I miss out on what's right in front of me. You'd laugh at all the messages that I've sent to somd_mustangs griping about getting out-bid on something (German police Steyr Hahn is the perfect example) only to be informed that the hammer price was fair market or even a slight bargain. Arrrg!!!

 

[emerald]

Really neat stuff. The M1895 is one I've wanted for awhile now. Missed out on getting one when they were really cheap. I've recently been eyeing the Beretta M1934. That will probably be my next acquisition.

 

[Trepang]

Do you have a C&R? Just wondering.

Yes

 

[Bob A]

I'm just the opposite. Like water on a rock I'll grind away forever to get what I want. In the process I miss out on what's right in front of me. You'd laugh at all the messages that I've sent to somd_mustangs griping about getting out-bid on something (German police Steyr Hahn is the perfect example) only to be informed that the hammer price was fair market or even a slight bargain. Arrrg!!!

I'll be kicking myself until my dying day for passing a nice Russian T33 at the old Engage for stupid low money. Ignorance costs; I had no idea what I was looking at. So, yes, Arrgh!

However, your hammer price under market was only thus because you weren't bidding. There's no way to tell how it would have gone for you against another motivated buyer.

I've managed to snag a couple of deals off GB by constantly watching for the items I want; it's not unusual to see them sought after by others. When that happens, a couple bidders beat each other up until the price goes absurd. Eventually the market will have satisfied the more rabid types, and the other folks will figure it's not worth chasing the stuff at that price point. Then, if I'm lucky, I'll be the guy who snaps up a nice example because everyone else has stepped back to take a breather.

 

[Trepang]

Found a holster for the PP today, a less common leading edge holster.

An original Nazi "D.R.G.M." Deutsches Reich Gebrauchsmuster or German Reich Registered Design.

The D.R.G.M. marking and the "WALTHER PP" stamp are very clear. The "Akah" mark is pretty much worn away from the stud on the flap rubbing on it but the leather itself and the stitching is in excellent shape.

 

[Combloc]

Stellar pictures!! I wish I could take 'em that well. What are you using?

 

[Trepang]

Stellar pictures!! I wish I could take 'em that well. What are you using?

Actually - I didn't take any of these. They are off the seller's website.

The guns are at my FFL on their 7-day hold.
I just bought the holsters this weekend, they have not shipped yet.

Once it all is home, I'll take some more pics but I doubt they will be this good. lol

 

[Combloc]

Reading is fundamental! I'm an idiot!

 

[Sirex]

Very nice! The Walther looks great. My dad had a Walther Model 4 I think, he gifted to my brother. I am still miffed about that one. I wish I had gotten a P38 before the prices jacked up.

 

[mawkie]

Nice holster! Every pistol deserves a proper home.

 

[Trepang]

Got them home today. Merry Christmas to me.
A quick wipe down with Lucas Oil CLP and some pics.

1942 German Walther PP with correct "Waffen 359" military acceptance proofs on the left side of the slide, frame and the one on the barrel most people miss. Two correct war-time magazines and a war-time D.R.G.M. AKAH leading edge holster.

1941 Russian Tula manufactured Nagant M1895 with a post-war 1947 holster and cleaning rod. I haven't found a leather war-time holster at the right price yet.