School me on steel dueling tree in and outs and safety please

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  • 44man

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 19, 2013
    10,155
    southern md
    I've held off on the 223 just because it would pound the tree. Maybe if I built a dedicated one. I don't think the plates would be the problem. The pipe would probably gouge like crazy and paddles may bounce back. For me 223 distance would depend on optics and shooting position. Standing, iron sights, 50 yds. 3x9 with rest, 100 yds.

    Think I'm going to put together a Texas star, let you know how that goes.

    I will let everyone know how these work out

    Been thinking about a set of 1/2” paddles an a piece of 2” tubestock with a 2” angle welded on the front so there’s no flat area to hit with a 20 degree lean for the 223 build but I have to get this first tree done and tested and then go from there.

    I am going to order a 1/2” silhouette with the holes sit out for a hostage reaction target build next also

    Hopefully I figure out how to post pics
     

    photoracer

    Competition Shooter
    Oct 22, 2010
    3,318
    West Virginia
    Thanks for the replies!

    More specific questions

    Can I use fmj ammo?

    What’s the proper distance to shoot with pistols?

    What’s the proper lean forward on the angles? 11-16 degrees?

    Can I shoot 223? If so at what yardage with 3/8 ar500 plates??

    How big of a base do I need?

    I have plenty of steel and we both can weld just fine so material doesn’t matter.

    45 or 9mm?

    3%antinomy? ( just had to throw that in somewhere)
    In sanctioned matches they limit steel shooting with rifle calibers to a minimum of 100 yards, shotgun 50 yards minimum. Reason is splash-back. Pistol caliber firearms can be as close as 10 yards but you will get some jacket pieces coming back. Best thing is to use either polymer coated lead or plated bullets but most places don't require that so its up to you. Up to you about how far you want to shoot but they arrived at those numbers after testing.
     

    photoracer

    Competition Shooter
    Oct 22, 2010
    3,318
    West Virginia
    I've held off on the 223 just because it would pound the tree. Maybe if I built a dedicated one. I don't think the plates would be the problem. The pipe would probably gouge like crazy and paddles may bounce back. For me 223 distance would depend on optics and shooting position. Standing, iron sights, 50 yds. 3x9 with rest, 100 yds.

    Think I'm going to put together a Texas star, let you know how that goes.
    Home built Texas Stars are not easy. Not only do you need a channel that the base of the plate need to fit exactly into you have to have a spring on it that has the power based on the kind of ammo to be used, light spring for rimfire, heavy for centerfire to keep it in place as the star spins. Easier with a CNC machine to cut the plates and channels. Best thing to do it find one and take pictures and measurements. Our club, MPC, has both centerfire and rimfire Texas Stars plus both types of dueling trees also. Also have one thats like a single dueling tree plate that drops down a step and switches sides every time you hit it until it falls out the bottom.
     

    magwell

    Active Member
    Mar 19, 2015
    183
    Thanks for the replies!

    More specific questions

    Can I use fmj ammo?

    What’s the proper distance to shoot with pistols?

    What’s the proper lean forward on the angles? 11-16 degrees?

    Can I shoot 223? If so at what yardage with 3/8 ar500 plates??

    How big of a base do I need?

    I have plenty of steel and we both can weld just fine so material doesn’t matter.

    45 or 9mm?

    3%antinomy? ( just had to throw that in somewhere)

    ShootingTargets7 has alot of good info on safety, mount angles, shooting distance and calibers vs plate thickness. They have a free downloadable PDF covering the info. Also have great quantity discounts.
     

    Pinecone

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 4, 2013
    28,175
    If you want to shoot closer, you can use frangible ammo.

    When I did a carbine course at Summit Point, we shot steel at 50 yards with frangible.
     

    photoracer

    Competition Shooter
    Oct 22, 2010
    3,318
    West Virginia
    I should add one caveat and that is one reason the rifle and shotgun slug distance is 100 and 50 yards respectfully is also to do with velocity and penetration recommended limits.
     

    vinconco

    Member
    Mar 4, 2016
    20
    Most dueling trees can be had with AR500 plates but the center post is usually soft angle iron. So using a rifle at any distance will result in craters in the center post and spall flying in all directions. Frangible ammo will still crater soft steel.

    Here is one that I use as a reactive rifle target but not as a "dueling tree"
    Its FULLY ARMORED and very heavy duty.
    Front armor is 3/8 AR500
    Mounts on a T Post so it can go anywhere....even on a hillside and it won't fall over.
    Hang Fast Targets sells them.

    FKLi2mc.jpg
     

    44man

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 19, 2013
    10,155
    southern md
    I should add one caveat and that is one reason the rifle and shotgun slug distance is 100 and 50 yards respectfully is also to do with velocity and penetration recommended limits.

    The more I read I believe I will only use my new dueling trees for pistols, and the pads are AR500 by 3/8” plates except for the rimfire pads

    Most dueling trees can be had with AR500 plates but the center post is usually soft angle iron. So using a rifle at any distance will result in craters in the center post and spall flying in all directions. Frangible ammo will still crater soft steel.

    Here is one that I use as a reactive rifle target but not as a "dueling tree"
    Its FULLY ARMORED and very heavy duty.
    Front armor is 3/8 AR500
    Mounts on a T Post so it can go anywhere....even on a hillside and it won't fall over.
    Hang Fast Targets sells them.

    FKLi2mc.jpg

    I purchased a at 500 by 1/2” hostage- reactive target to set up outside 100 yards for the rifles and at 50 yds, or possibly closer, for pistols.

    All I gotta do is finish the welding and paint them and set them up.

    Just so damn busy at work, it’s killing me not to be shooting right now
     

    vinconco

    Member
    Mar 4, 2016
    20
    Frangible ammo on dueling tree close range

    I made a video for a target client that asked if frangible 223 ammunition could be used on our target systems at close ranges.

    I shot the targets then painted them to reveal the extent of the damage to the steel. Bullets were sinterfire 45 gr.

    https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=xRuKvpOhSVk
     

    44man

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 19, 2013
    10,155
    southern md
    How the heck do I post a picture?
     

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    44man

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 19, 2013
    10,155
    southern md
    Ok, first attempt at the dueling tree and first attempt at posting pics

    Dueling tree came out better than them sideways pictures

    Still need to work on the base, touch up the angle and do some grinding and paint it but I am happy with it

    What do y’all think?
     

    AlanInSilverSpring

    Banned
    BANNED!!!
    Apr 25, 2017
    1,645
    did what I could
     

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    inkd

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 4, 2009
    7,546
    Ridge
    Ok, first attempt at the dueling tree and first attempt at posting pics

    Dueling tree came out better than them sideways pictures

    Still need to work on the base, touch up the angle and do some grinding and paint it but I am happy with it

    What do y’all think?

    Looks good to me!!!
     

    44man

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 19, 2013
    10,155
    southern md
    did what I could

    Many thanks, and how the heck did you do that?


    Looks good to me!!!

    Getting closer to a day of shooting every day

    I am going to build one more tree and I have a rifle thickness hostage steel silhouette target setting here waiting on me to weld a base for it but it will have to wait a little longer, my backs singing right now

    Still wanna shoot when these are done and we get a decent day?
     

    CSHS

    Active Member
    Apr 21, 2015
    197
    Tree looks great. Take your picture, open in Windows Paint or something else and then resave it. This should give the right orientation when posting. I don't know why.
     

    inkd

    Ultimate Member
    Aug 4, 2009
    7,546
    Ridge
    Many thanks, and how the heck did you do that?




    Getting closer to a day of shooting every day

    I am going to build one more tree and I have a rifle thickness hostage steel silhouette target setting here waiting on me to weld a base for it but it will have to wait a little longer, my backs singing right now

    Still wanna shoot when these are done and we get a decent day?

    Absolutely!!!!
     

    44man

    Ultimate Member
    MDS Supporter
    Feb 19, 2013
    10,155
    southern md
    Tree looks great. Take your picture, open in Windows Paint or something else and then resave it. This should give the right orientation when posting. I don't know why.

    Ok, it took me an hour just to get that pic up and I am on my iPhone. I wish I knew exactly what your saying but I am just an old redneck, lol
     

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