Red Flag info mtg Edgewater AAPD

[HammerII]

working thru the issues now. Mine is not a redflag but the result of a short term (90 day) protective order

 

[44man]

working thru the issues now. Mine is not a redflag but the result of a short term (90 day) protective order

Do yourself a favor and say no more here or anywhere about it that your attorney doesn’t approve of first

No use adding to your troubles

 

[PJDiesel]

Right on. I'd probably consider ditching what was already said as is......

 

[BeoBill]

Living this very nightmare right now

Wishing you the very best. Keep a low profile.

 

[Combloc]

………………………….
And as far as collections are concerned, mine is not worth my life...…...

That's where you and I differ; mine is. It's not even so much about my collection as it is my LIBERTY. You take my car, I'm out a ride. You take my dinner, I'm out a meal. You take my firearm and you deprive me of a God given right.

"Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness" Any grievance on my Liberty so heinous as a red flag law, even if theoretically "temporary" will not be tolerated, especially when I'm innocent.

Some of the responses in this thread make me sick to my stomach. I'm done with it. To those of you who get it....good luck folks, you are not alone.

 

[fabsroman]

How do you PROVE that you are not a threat?

The petitioner has to prove that I am a threat, by alleging certain facts. If the petitioner meets this burden, then I have the opportunity to rebut. I can ask the petitioner if there were any witnesses to the acts/statements that the petitioner alleges. If we had been in a recent argument, I could point that out too. In the case of Mr. Willis, if it all transpired due to an argument between him and his sister in-law, and there were lots of witnesses to this argument, then march all those witnesses in front of the judge and show that she had an ulterior motive. In my case, if there are witnesses to the alleged "threats", then maybe ask the judge for time to produce those witnesses. If not, which would most likely be the case on a BS ERPO, then I would make clear that there are no other witnesses to this alleged behavior of mine other than the petitioner's allegations. It also comes down to the demeanor of the respondent and the track record of the respondent. I'd make it pretty clear that I have owned firearms my entire life and never, ever, threatened a single soul with them and never ever been convicted of anything other than minor moving violations and a minor DNR violation.

Have any ERPO's been denied? If so, how was that accomplished? It does not seem as though each and every single ERPO applied for has been granted.

I wish we had more data on this entire thing than what was just reported in January. Really curious as to how many have been denied at the emergency stage, temporary stage, and final stage. That would be somewhat telling.

 

[fabsroman]

working thru the issues now. Mine is not a redflag but the result of a short term (90 day) protective order

Yeah, keep this between you and your attorney.

However, what I have been saying since this entire red flag law was proposed, was that the confiscation of firearms can already be done through a normal protective order. Granted, the red flag law allows a larger class of people to file for it versus the more limited class on a protective order.

Good luck.

 

[Stoveman]

That's where you and I differ; mine is. It's not even so much about my collection as it is my LIBERTY. You take my car, I'm out a ride. You take my dinner, I'm out a meal. You take my firearm and you deprive me of a God given right.

"Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness" Any grievance on my Liberty so heinous as a red flag law, even if theoretically "temporary" will not be tolerated, especially when I'm innocent.

Some of the responses in this thread make me sick to my stomach. I'm done with it. To those of you who get it....good luck folks, you are not alone.

Statists gonna state.

 

[TexDefender]

Media interviews immediately after had other family members saying it was about an argument and that he (the late Mr. Willis) wouldn't have hurt a fly, and was merely opinionated in ways his sister didn't like, etc. It did indeed sound like a grudge/spite ERPO.

I was wondering was she ever charged with anything? Seems at least perjury would be suitable?

 

[ironpony]

Body cams optional.

 

[TexDefender]

How do you PROVE that you are not a threat?

I could have sworn people were innocent until proven guilty.

 

[daggo66]

Mister Willis' death was necessary once he decided to pick up his handgun in front of the LEOs. My guess is they instructed him not to pick it up, to stop as he approached it, and one even tried to take it away from him before he discharged the firearm.

Once he decided to answer and open the door at 5 am, then it was a matter of following protocol and complying with LEO orders. He was actually lucky he was not shot upon answering the door at 5 am with a gun in his hand. I give the LEO's credit for not shooting him when he opened the door and not shooting him the second he picked up that firearm off the floor IF those are indeed the facts.

Have not read where the ERPO was not necessary and the sister in-law was actually lying. Is there something out there to show that?

Mister Willis could have appeared in Court within what, 3 days, and gotten all his firearms back IF he could prove he was not a threat to himself or others. Him reaching for a firearm while two Anne Arundel County officers stood by him makes me wonder if he was not actually a threat to himself and/or others. Who here would actually reach for that firearm with two officers standing right there? Even if I were stupid enough to reach for it and the officers yelled STOP or DROP IT, I think I could process that command and no matter how much I liked the finish on my handgun, I would have dropped it immediately or stopped immediately. Not complying with LEO orders is a sure way to die.

Is it possible for you to just once stop pretending to know everything as if you were there? The news reports on this have been far from complete. There was more involved than just the ERPO. Furthermore no one (alive anyway) knows what really happened and whether or not he actually picked the gun back up.

 

[daggo66]

Many on here have tried to imagine how they would react if faced with an ERPO. How would you react if faced with an emergency eval order and were about to be cuffed right after you were informed of such?

 

[Not_an_outlaw]

That's where you and I differ; mine is. It's not even so much about my collection as it is my LIBERTY. You take my car, I'm out a ride. You take my dinner, I'm out a meal. You take my firearm and you deprive me of a God given right.

"Life, Liberty and the Pursuit of Happiness" Any grievance on my Liberty so heinous as a red flag law, even if theoretically "temporary" will not be tolerated, especially when I'm innocent.

Some of the responses in this thread make me sick to my stomach. I'm done with it. To those of you who get it....good luck folks, you are not alone.

Concur. I have added one of those to my "ignore" list and it keeps my blood pressure much lower. However, I can still see what these supposedly pro 2A
say when somebody quotes them.

 

[fabsroman]

Many on here have tried to imagine how they would react if faced with an ERPO. How would you react if faced with an emergency eval order and were about to be cuffed right after you were informed of such?

What makes you think they would be putting handcuffs on me? Does the law allow officers to arrest me and have me taken in for a mental evaluation? Of course, an LEO can decide to put cuffs on me for any reason he/she wishes, even if it is not legal.

Show me where cuffs can be put on me and me taken into custody because of an ERPO and I that would really influence my opinion regarding this law.

 

[fabsroman]

Is it possible for you to just once stop pretending to know everything as if you were there? The news reports on this have been far from complete. There was more involved than just the ERPO. Furthermore no one (alive anyway) knows what really happened and whether or not he actually picked the gun back up.

Nobody alive knows what really happened? Are you telling me that the officers both died since the incident? The two of them most certainly know what happened. Whether they are telling the truth, who knows.

Oh, I don't pretend to know everything. In fact, I'm one of the first to admit that I don't know everything. However, I do know more than most.

The problem with several on here is that they take a set of "facts" that support what they want the outcome to be in their minds, and they run with those "facts" without ever thinking that there might be other "facts", or lets say evidence, out there that does not support the outcome they want in their minds. Same goes for how the law actually reads, or what the law actually is.

For instance, Mr. Willis was innocent? Yes, the actual ERPO might have been granted in error based upon perjured testimony from the petitioner. However, Mr. Willis was not "innocent" when it came to his interaction with the LEOs. In fact, I would say that he did not even meet the reasonable person standard. Who in their right mind would have done what he did in that situation, assuming arguendo that the facts set forth by both officers are the true facts. If you have some other set of facts out there other than what the officers have set forth happened, then I am willing to listen and re-evaluate my perception on the matter.

I really wish we had some body cam footage on this one. Body cam footage would probably have put all doubt to rest. Sadly, there is none that I am aware of. So, we are left with only the LEOs' rendition of the "facts".

 

[fabsroman]

Body cams optional.

Does AA law enforcement usually have body cams and they just weren't turned on during this incident, or has the department decided not to use them? If it is the latter, then you guys should be pushing for their implementation. If it is the former, then the officers should receive a couple months of unpaid leave at the minimum.

 

[ironpony]

Does AA law enforcement usually have body cams and they just weren't turned on during this incident, or has the department decided not to use them? If it is the latter, then you guys should be pushing for their implementation. If it is the former, then the officers should receive a couple months of unpaid leave at the minimum.

I think there was a thread on this and IIRC the "budget" could not afford them.




Is there a legal difference between "Red Flag" and ERPO? Either still puts one into an awkward position.

 

[daggo66]

Nobody alive knows what really happened? Are you telling me that the officers both died since the incident? The two of them most certainly know what happened. Whether they are telling the truth, who knows.

Oh, I don't pretend to know everything. In fact, I'm one of the first to admit that I don't know everything. However, I do know more than most.

The problem with several on here is that they take a set of "facts" that support what they want the outcome to be in their minds, and they run with those "facts" without ever thinking that there might be other "facts", or lets say evidence, out there that does not support the outcome they want in their minds. Same goes for how the law actually reads, or what the law actually is.

For instance, Mr. Willis was innocent? Yes, the actual ERPO might have been granted in error based upon perjured testimony from the petitioner. However, Mr. Willis was not "innocent" when it came to his interaction with the LEOs. In fact, I would say that he did not even meet the reasonable person standard. Who in their right mind would have done what he did in that situation, assuming arguendo that the facts set forth by both officers are the true facts. If you have some other set of facts out there other than what the officers have set forth happened, then I am willing to listen and re-evaluate my perception on the matter.

I really wish we had some body cam footage on this one. Body cam footage would probably have put all doubt to rest. Sadly, there is none that I am aware of. So, we are left with only the LEOs' rendition of the "facts".

I meant to write no one other than the officers...

Furthermore they were there for more than the ERPO and that has not been reported. If it had been there would have been much more speculation regarding the outcome,

 

[daggo66]

.

For instance, Mr. Willis was innocent? Yes, the actual ERPO might have been granted in error based upon perjured testimony from the petitioner. However, Mr. Willis was not "innocent" when it came to his interaction with the LEOs. In fact, I would say that he did not even meet the reasonable person standard. Who in their right mind would have done what he did in that situation, assuming arguendo that the facts set forth by both officers are the true facts. If you have some other set of facts out there other than what the officers have set forth happened, then I am willing to listen and re-evaluate my perception on the matter.

I really wish we had some body cam footage on this one. Body cam footage would probably have put all doubt to rest. Sadly, there is none that I am aware of. So, we are left with only the LEOs' rendition of the "facts".

I can't think of anyone on here who contradicts themself more.

Either you were magically able to see what happened or you are accepting one side of the story.

Did Willis do it wrong? Did he actually pick up the gun? What were the LEO's instructions to him? Did he follow them or not?

There was a recent police shooting where they told the guy to hand them the gun. When he started to comply they shot him. His last words were, "You told me to...."