PRIVATELY MADE FIREARM REGISTRATION?

[marte616]

All,

I have been disconnected from the gun community for a couple of years; hope everyone is well. I researched here for about an hour but could not find a thread addressing a concern regarding the recently passed PMF aka Shadow Gun legislation outlawing lower receivers and requiring serialization/registration (which according to MSI is impossible to comply with).

What happens to say, a military member or expat that goes overseas for a few years but left their gun collection including PMFs (now outlawed) weapons in a storage, but has no idea about the new law, and returns to MD. Do they just become instant felons in absentia?

Whats the remedy?

Can/should they try to get them stamped/registered? Or will they be arrested on the spot for not complying?

Is there a grandfather clause?

Is there an option to take the offending PMFs out of state?

Thanks all for your time and responses on this matter.

 

[Gcs7th]

Many were registered and marked with the laws, I would reach out to an FFL who still may be marking them and see what they say. Some are IPs or have a presence on this forum.

Here’s a list of FFls

https://mdsp.maryland.gov/Organization/Licensing%20Division%20Documents/FFL_Marking_Service_Providers.pdf

 

[smokey]

What PMFs?

 

[FPL53]

What PMFs?

My best guess would be Personally (Privately) Made Firearm, or, something really close to that. Basically, 3-D or 80%ers.

 

[Bullfrog]

All,

I have been disconnected from the gun community for a couple of years; hope everyone is well. I researched here for about an hour but could not find a thread addressing a concern regarding the recently passed PMF aka Shadow Gun legislation outlawing lower receivers and requiring serialization/registration (which according to MSI is impossible to comply with).

I believe I remember you, if I'm not mistaken. Welcome back, shipmate.

What happens to say, a military member or expat that goes overseas for a few years but left their gun collection including PMFs (now outlawed) weapons in a storage, but has no idea about the new law, and returns to MD. Do they just become instant felons in absentia?

You wouldn't be a felon, since you probably stored them outside of MD, right?

Whats the remedy?

Can/should they try to get them stamped/registered? Or will they be arrested on the spot for not complying?

I don't think they can be legally possessed in MD, at all, without a serial, even if not worked on and still at 80%, so you can't just take them to a MD FFL now to get then engraved (you missed the deadline). If you wanted to purchase an 80% in MD, it would have to already have a SN on it and be transferred to you as a firearm.

I believe if you were in another state which does not have similar laws about 80% firearms, and wanted to purchase an 80% that was not yet serialized, you could have an FFL in that state engrave it and transfer it to you (assuming it's a long gun), before bringing it to MD.

It might be possible to take the ones you have now to an FFL in the state you stored them in, have them engrave them and transfer them to you... then bring them home.

 

[Hibs]

Military seems to get exemptions on most things for the reasons exactly as you stated. The "arrest on the spot" scenario is doubtful in my opinion.

I wouldn't rely on a local FFL to know the laws. Most of the time, they don't.

To CYA, if it were me, I would take them out of state to engrave them, if you intend to keep them here in MD. Not a long drive in any direction to get out of Maryland.

 

[cantstop]

I think you have 30 days from the time you brought them into MD to have them serialized. I'm not sure though. Also, if you didn't know they needed to be serialized there was a loophole in the law for that. Of course, the penalty is less than 6 months in jail so you won't become prohibited if you just say they are stolen. LOL! IANAL!!!

 

[smokey]

My best guess would be Personally (Privately) Made Firearm, or, something really close to that. Basically, 3-D or 80%ers.

yes... but the point of them is.... ah hem.... "What PMFs?"

 

[John from MD]

What PMFs?

Those that you lost in the great boat sinking over the Puerto Rico Trench.

 

[Growler215]

My best guess would be Personally (Privately) Made Firearm, or, something really close to that. Basically, 3-D or 80%ers.

Or made the hard way. . .

 

[Growler215]

All,

I have been disconnected from the gun community for a couple of years; hope everyone is well. I researched here for about an hour but could not find a thread addressing a concern regarding the recently passed PMF aka Shadow Gun legislation outlawing lower receivers and requiring serialization/registration (which according to MSI is impossible to comply with).

What happens to say, a military member or expat that goes overseas for a few years but left their gun collection including PMFs (now outlawed) weapons in a storage, but has no idea about the new law, and returns to MD. Do they just become instant felons in absentia?

Whats the remedy?

Can/should they try to get them stamped/registered? Or will they be arrested on the spot for not complying?

Is there a grandfather clause?

Is there an option to take the offending PMFs out of state?

Thanks all for your time and responses on this matter.

Another option: bury them in a sealed 6" PVC pipe and buy some already serialized frames/receivers.

 

[kdmag88]

The way it was written any existing 80% receivers, finished or not, had to be serialized and/or registered before the deadline (depending on how it was serialized). Completely handmade guns (like 3d printed or pipe guns, etc.) can still be built and you have 30 days to get them serialized. So it depends on which type pf PMF you are talking about. 80% is likely near impossible. A completely handmade design would be easier, but even so it's going to be tough to find an FFL who knows that caveat and is willing to touch them.

 

[Crazytrain]

No one is going door to door looking for them. While the ATF has been known to occasionally haunt a range or two looking for malfeasants, I don't think it's common and doubt they'd be trying to get the spooky shooters. I haven't heard of any enforcement yet. I doubt we ever will.

This law I think is more of a chilling law, scaring the law abiding into compliance, without the effort of putting money and manpower into compliance checks. I can't see how it is conceivably constitutional. Tyranny, as usual. Unless you get rolled up in some other legal action I doubt you'll ever have a problem.

We all have our own tolerances for risk and tyranny. You probably can't legally fix the issue. So comply by getting rid of them, or be a scoundrel by ignoring the law. I doubt many here will judge you.

YMMV. Not legal advice. Don't call me for bail money.

 

[babalou]

yes... but the point of them is.... ah hem.... "What PMFs?"

premenstral females?

 

[Kharn]

Not just completed 80%s had to be engraved, any untouched 80% had to be as well. So everything would have to go and the person would have to start fresh.

The law gives 30 days after you make a new one (from raw materials, ie billet aluminum or 3d printed) to have it engraved. So create/print, assemble, home anodize/paint/coat/whatever, test fire it a few times, then take it to the FFL for engraving once you're sure it works.

I wouldn't say it's worth it for ARs and Glocks anymore, you can buy AR receivers from Palmetto for almost cheaper than shipping+transfer, and take-off receivers are available for Glocks from various places (they strip guns and sell the parts kits for a mark up to California, etc), but for some, it is the craftsmanship that counts. Polymer 80 also sells receivers through FFLs if it's the frame shape that is of interest.

 

[marte616]

What PMFs?

Personally

Many were registered and marked with the laws, I would reach out to an FFL who still may be marking them and see what they say. Some are IPs or have a presence on this forum.

Here’s a list of FFls

https://mdsp.maryland.gov/Organization/Licensing%20Division%20Documents/FFL_Marking_Service_Providers.pdf

Thank you!

 

[marte616]

What PMFs?

Privately Manufacured Firearms as per the MDSP website.

 

[marte616]

I believe I remember you, if I'm not mistaken. Welcome back, shipmate.



You wouldn't be a felon, since you probably stored them outside of MD, right?



I don't think they can be legally possessed in MD, at all, without a serial, even if not worked on and still at 80%, so you can't just take them to a MD FFL now to get then engraved (you missed the deadline). If you wanted to purchase an 80% in MD, it would have to already have a SN on it and be transferred to you as a firearm.

I believe if you were in another state which does not have similar laws about 80% firearms, and wanted to purchase an 80% that was not yet serialized, you could have an FFL in that state engrave it and transfer it to you (assuming it's a long gun), before bringing it to MD.

It might be possible to take the ones you have now to an FFL in the state you stored them in, have them engrave them and transfer them to you... then bring them home.

Yes, FOR SURE, they have been stored OUTSIDE of Maryland... =0|

 

[marte616]

Military seems to get exemptions on most things for the reasons exactly as you stated. The "arrest on the spot" scenario is doubtful in my opinion.

I wouldn't rely on a local FFL to know the laws. Most of the time, they don't.

To CYA, if it were me, I would take them out of state to engrave them, if you intend to keep them here in MD. Not a long drive in any direction to get out of Maryland.

Agree. It is good to spread the risk...

 

[marte616]

Not just completed 80%s had to be engraved, any untouched 80% had to be as well. So everything would have to go and the person would have to start fresh.

The law gives 30 days after you make a new one (from raw materials, ie billet aluminum or 3d printed) to have it engraved. So create/print, assemble, home anodize/paint/coat/whatever, test fire it a few times, then take it to the FFL for engraving once you're sure it works.

I wouldn't say it's worth it for ARs and Glocks anymore, you can buy AR receivers from Palmetto for almost cheaper than shipping+transfer, and take-off receivers are available for Glocks from various places (they strip guns and sell the parts kits for a mark up to California, etc), but for some, it is the craftsmanship that counts. Polymer 80 also sells receivers through FFLs if it's the frame shape that is of interest.

Thanks for the info. This is so effin confusing. Gone for a couple of years and everything is illegal now.