Not quite C&R yet, but interesting ...

[Machodoc]

Those who know me are aware that I'm fond of Spanish, Czech, and Argentine firearms ... and especially pistols. I was looking through the Stars on GB today, and saw a Star BM model for a reasonable buy-it-now price. It had been posted for a couple of days with no nibbles, and the seller didn't mention the meaning of the mark on the firearm. I suspect that he didn't recognize it.

Ever seen this mark? I'll show you the Mark on the pistol, then give you a big hint in the next photo.

 

[Machodoc]

Just to follow up, the CSP were Spain's secret police ... plain-clothes guys who seemed to put a lot of focus on smuggling and any sort of activity that might be deemed anti-government. The Guardia Civil could be bad enough, if they wanted to (but my personal dealings with some of those guys in the late '60s was very pleasant). If you got arrested by the CSP, however, and you weren't 100% cooperative, you might accidentally fall out of an upper-floor window, or trip and face-plant into a wall or concrete floor. People were very accident prone in their care. There were not many CSP agents, so I'm going to assume that not all that many of their pistols are in circulation. This one appears to be in very nice condition. I'll know later this week.

 

[Chaunsey]

very interesting

is there any documentation to confirm the mark?

great buy regardless, and should shoot great too.

 

[Machodoc]

Hi Chaunsey - certainly nothing that was with the pistol, but I knew who the CSP were from the time that I spent in Spain. With enough google-fu, a couple of other mentions of the mark will turn up. Not sure if anyone's published anything about it, if that's what you mean.

CSP = Cuerpo Superior de Policia
CGP = Cuerpo General de Policia
GC = Guardia Civil
ET = Ejercito de Tierra (Spanish Army)
PN = Policia National
FN = Fuerza Naval

 

[yellowsled]

Well, that freakin cool!

 

[Chaunsey]

Ya I was talking about published info.

I wonder if any of the star books mention it , most star contracts seem to be pretty well documented.

Would be interesting to know the size and years of the contract.

Sent from my galaxy s3 using tapatalk 2

 

[Machodoc]

I've seen that info online, Chaunsey, and I presume it came from a book ... but not certain about that. Here are some sources:

http://encycl.opentopia.com/term/Star_Model_BM




And, in http://www.armas.es/foros/armas-de-las-fas-fycs-y-seguridad-privada/star-bm-policia-nacional-es-una-rareza-t938896-10.html is a posting that reads:

"en 1979 se entregaron al CSP ( Cuerpo Superior de Policia ) 1275 unidades con numeraciones comprendidas entre el 1498001 al 1499275 y tambien se entregaron a la PN ( Policia Nacional ) otras 3925 en el año 1981 , con numeraciones comprendidas entre el 1567001 al 1570925"

This was part of a conversation about whether or not the Star BMs were rare or scarce. The conclusion was that they were not, because so many police units carried them. In 1979, the CSP received 1275 units with serial numbers between 1498001 and 1499275. The National Police (PN) got another 3925 in 1981, with serial numbers between 1567001 and 1570925. [The CSP became the CNP during this time. It also appears that the CSP must have gotten some additional Star BMs in 1980.]

 

[Chaunsey]

Wow, so those must really be pretty scarce.



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[Machodoc]

Wow, so those must really be pretty scarce.

The thrust of the conversation on the Spanish board was that the Star BMs are not particularly scarce, because they made a bunch of them* and most of the different Spanish police units were issued a good many. But the ones marked for the Cuerpo Superior de (la) Policia ... CSP ... were a fairly limited run. Added to this is the fact that the CSP was merged into the CSN (National Police) not long after the Star BM went into production, so that makes the CSP-marked pistols even a bit more scarce.

[*While the Star BM was made for many Spanish police and military units, it was also sold commercially.]

 

[Chaunsey]

Ya I was gonna say I still have the j&g flyer from 05 when these were all over for $130

So bm's arent scarce, but that csp one sure is.

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[Alphabrew]

The first rule of the CSP is you don't talk about the CSP

 

[Machodoc]

The first rule of the CSP is you don't talk about the CSP

That's why it's commonly called, "La Secreta"! (No translation necessary.)

Chaunsey - I'm under the impression, based upon postings I've found on boards in Spain, that there are records still around about how many of these were bought by each police unit, the serial number series, and years brought into the organization ... but I've yet to see exactly where those records are. I just see the same numbers cited here and there. It seems pretty clear that some more went to the CSP in 1980, and I've seen a number cited, but it wasn't clear if that was for just the CSP, or if it was for the CSP and CNP combined.

 

[Machodoc]

I noticed last night that the same dealer on GB that I ordered my Star BM (CSP) from has listed several more. They include another CSP (it looks like ... hard to tell), a National Police, and what looked like a general police. This latest bunch seems to be a bit rougher condition, overall, but they are still worth a look.

 

[yellowsled]

I saw one CGP and a couple PN ones.... I might have bought one if they had a FN one for the Navy...

 

[Machodoc]

I saw one CGP and a couple PN ones.... I might have bought one if they had a FN one for the Navy...

Yeah. I've always got my eye out for Navy firearms. It would be neat to find one that could be documented to their carrier, "Dedalo." I spent a fair amount of time standing watches and looking at it.