Montoya Hearing Results....

[protegeV]

White recused herself because she and I have had contact before. She and her husband taught a Utah permit class in my office for about 8-10 people 5 years ago.

Just imagine if west had abstained from Gryphon's vote, due to the fact she was half asleep for his entire testimony...

 

[Stoveman]

Complete pisser. My condolences, Tim, you're a true patriot. Keep on fighting.

 

[ShallNotInfringe]

The part I still don't understand is the process where only one side is represented at these hearings. Why is the MSP permitted to attend, speak and even be present during deliberations, since they are effectively the defense in the appeal process... Would never see such bias elsewhere.

 

[protegeV]

The part I still don't understand is the process where only one side is represented at these hearings. Why is the MSP permitted to attend, speak and even be present during deliberations, since they are effectively the defense in the appeal process... Would never see such bias elsewhere.

Both sides are supposed to be represented as in every other hearing. Tim got screwed over big time with the procedures for his hearing....

 

[montoya32]

The part I still don't understand is the process where only one side is represented at these hearings. Why is the MSP permitted to attend, speak and even be present during deliberations, since they are effectively the defense in the appeal process... Would never see such bias elsewhere.

Reviews only have the MSP there, while they typically have a letter from the applicant. Hearings have both sides present. I had a witness and attorney accompany me also.

 

[Blacksmith101]

Tim,

I am sure you knew this was a definite possible outcome but we always hope for the best. No matter what you decide both you and Gryphon have done the community a great service by getting the truth on the record. I am certain the MSP knows it was in a heck of a fight and you can take some solace in knowing you both no doubt have stirred up a hornets nest behind the scenes on the other side.

 

[ShallNotInfringe]

Reviews only have the MSP there, while they typically have a letter from the applicant. Hearings have both sides present. I had a witness and attorney accompany me also.

Right. I have been.

Why not just let MSP write a letter also? Seems both sides of a matter should be represented equally...

 

[Schipperke]

Both sides are supposed to be represented as in every other hearing. Tim got screwed over big time with the procedures for his hearing....

None being material to the decision.

 

[Klunatic]

I know it's semantics, but it was an appeal of restrictions applied to my permit. I appealed within 10 days of receiving my permit, not within days days of having a modification request denied.

How long did you wait to get a hearing? I requested a hearing 3 months ago and still haven't heard back from the board.

 

[HeatSeeker]

Maybe we should stop applying and just start carrying. I know 4 people that have made that decision already, 2 just since the San Bernardino shooting. If a person legally owns a handgun then they have passed a background check, twice. Next step is to start exercising the 2A. I know this is easier said then done but if and when that time comes for me I believe I will continue to carry.

 

[montoya32]

How long did you wait to get a hearing? I requested a hearing 3 months ago and still haven't heard back from the board.

Then you should email the board, via the admin, and copy Stephen Moyer on your email. It took me from June until November to get a hearing.

 

[Schipperke]

Then you should email the board, via the admin, and copy Stephen Moyer on your email. It took me from June until November to get a hearing.

This is the nonsense that these board are suppose to eliminate, waiting so long. The excuse for many of these panels is to make it expedient and less cumbersome than circuit court. I see Circuit Court cases scheduled quicker than these things.

 

[erwos]

I'm sorry you didn't get your restrictions lifted, Montoya. That sucks.

None being material to the decision.

Pretty much.

The optimistic premise was that Hogan was appointing people to the board (and to MSP superintendent) to shake it up and not just do things the old way. It's pretty damned clear that is not happening. Elections have consequences... except when they don't, it seems.

 

[OrbitalEllipses]

The grammatical errors on the official document template bother me, greatly.

If anyone expected something other than Ehrlich Pt. 2, then they're foolish.

 

[protegeV]

I'm sorry you didn't get your restrictions lifted, Montoya. That sucks.


Pretty much.

The optimistic premise was that Hogan was appointing people to the board (and to MSP superintendent) to shake it up and not just do things the old way. It's pretty damned clear that is not happening. Elections have consequences... except when they don't, it seems.

Howdy stranger

 

[HeatSeeker]

The grammatical errors on the official document template bother me, greatly.

If anyone expected something other than Ehrlich Pt. 2, then they're foolish.

I agree, Hogan seems to be a good man, but he is still a politician. He played on the 2A rights voters to help get elected and then has done nothing to help 2A matters. His HPRB appointees are no better then MSP representatives. What good is a review board when they only allow MSP to be present but not the applicant to plead their case. How can that be a legal hearing?

 

[protegeV]

I agree, Hogan seems to be a good man, but he is still a politician. He played on the 2A rights voters to help get elected and then has done nothing to help 2A matters. His HPRB appointees are no better then MSP representatives. What good is a review board when they only allow MSP to be present but not the applicant to plead their case. How can that be a legal hearing?

The thought has crossed my mind that Hogan may be doing a big @ 2 of the board members. Thinking he was doing the 2A a favor with a couple of "ringers" who have turned out to be wolves in sheep's clothing...

 

[erwos]

Howdy stranger

I think it's fairly well established that Lone Ranger and I are not the same person. For one thing, I don't need to constantly nuke every thread with my pessimism every hour. I can settle for once a day or so.

 

[dblas]

The part I still don't understand is the process where only one side is represented at these hearings. Why is the MSP permitted to attend, speak and even be present during deliberations, since they are effectively the defense in the appeal process... Would never see such bias elsewhere.

MSP, to our knowledge, has never been allowed into the closed sessions for the deliberations, but neither has the person appealing the denial (until recently).

 

[dblas]

Right. I have been.

Why not just let MSP write a letter also? Seems both sides of a matter should be represented equally...

For reviews, MSP does not get to present anything in person, nor are they questioned, unless the HPRB calls them in to question an issue they have had with how MSP did something. For reviews, there is a written statement from MSP and a written statement from the person appealing the denial, no more, no less.