Headspacing is to short?

[outrider58]

 

[Doco Overboard]

Im still going with #50

 

[3paul10]

I'm going with #58...

 

[omegared24]

Those that say DEX ARMS was blowing smoke or that they never heard anything like they explained, or it's confusing....more then likely have never been in the industry to know what they are talking about. For most of us there are three headspace gauges: No Go, GO, Field. Well there are more especially for AR manufacturers. One is an assembly headspace gauge or manufacturers headspace gauge and is used during assembling the rifle. It could be considered a minimum Go gauges. DEX ARMS told you the truth. They are assembled a "little tight" and after a few rounds the parts wear in and are well within the GO limits. Colt also have a gauge that they use if the bolt on an AR 15 closes on a NO GO gauge and it use is to show if the rifle is safe and still serviceable.

The internet forums are one of the worse places for correct information unless one of the manufacturers happens to be a member on such forum. The best place to go to is the manufacturer first or and real top rated professional gunsmith with expertise in the particular firearm you are having problems with.

Sorry to be so hard on some of you guys, but this thread was just so interesting and funny to read.

Nominated for best troll post on this forum.

 

[starmetal]

Colt does not use a NO GO for manufacturing, they use a 5.56 GO which is different than a .223 GO. There are 12 HS Gauges made for .223 and 5.56.

His Barrel or Bolt caused short headspace and it's not an performance enhancement.

Since you know so much about the AR, perhaps you can share a photo of your workspace and your credentials.

I'll share mine:
Professional Gunsmith for Scott's Gunsmithing 13 years
Technical AR15' Instructor for School of the American Rifle 3 years.

BTW, the tools, gauges, and jigs are completely AR specific.

I knew that this would raise hairs. The meaning about Colt's Go or No or whatever MEANT Colt uses gauges and one gauge they use for the service rifles to get more use out of them most gunsmiths wouldn't use.

 

[clandestine]

I'm going with #58...

That guy Chad don't know nothing bro. He took an AGI Course that had that Libtard from that show All in the Family as the spokesperson.

 

[3paul10]

That guy Chad don't know nothing bro. He took an AGI Course that had that Libtard from that show All in the Family as the spokesperson.

Hey, but Chad told me the AGI course rocked...taught him everything he knows...maybe you should look into it?

 

[clandestine]

I knew that this would raise hairs. The meaning about Colt's Go or No or whatever MEANT Colt uses gauges and one gauge they use for the service rifles to get more use out of them most gunsmiths wouldn't use.

So you were trolling? Can I take a Class from you? I'm willing to learn from others. What is your credentials?

Ill bring all of equipment so Im prepared. I'll need about 6 tables to lay it all out.

 

[3paul10]

I'm

So you were trolling? Can I take a Class from you? I'm willing to learn from others. What is your credentials?

Ill bring all of equipment so Im prepared. I'll need about 6 tables to lay it all out.

 

[omegared24]

I knew that this would raise hairs. The meaning about Colt's Go or No or whatever MEANT Colt uses gauges and one gauge they use for the service rifles to get more use out of them most gunsmiths wouldn't use.

If you knew it would raise hairs then why didn't you post this confusing comment the first time?

 

[Doco Overboard]

Still with #50, it would be nice to hear the happy ending to the not enough head-space mystery. With a chamber that close I would be thinking hard about cook off or an oob. I wonder if the guy ever got his rig ironed out.

 

[starmetal]

So you were trolling? Can I take a Class from you? I'm willing to learn from others. What is your credentials?

Ill bring all of equipment so Im prepared. I'll need about 6 tables to lay it all out.

Nope not trolling. I would like to ask you question though. How many ten thousandths tight do you think his chamber is? If you sized a case and cammed over the press real hard do you think that empty would have chambered?

 

[starmetal]

If you knew it would raise hairs then why didn't you post this confusing comment the first time?

Maybe confusing to you, but if you want a reason to dwell on I'd have to pick where D Arms said they chamber them tight and they loosen up right away. You know that if the back of the bolt lugs having a finish on them and then after so so many rounds they are shiny showing where they wore in.....that wear in...how many hundred thousandths difference was there?

 

[clandestine]

Nope not trolling. I would like to ask you question though. How many ten thousandths tight do you think his chamber is? If you sized a case and cammed over the press real hard do you think that empty would have chambered?

Maybe confusing to you, but if you want a reason to dwell on I'd have to pick where D Arms said they chamber them tight and they loosen up right away. You know that if the back of the bolt lugs having a finish on them and then after so so many rounds they are shiny showing where they wore in.....that wear in...how many hundred thousandths difference there was?

I have the gauges to determine how undersize the chamber is. There is no guessing. A reputable manufacturer would NOT tell someone to use a live round, or empty casing to determine headspace.

Yes, depending on Carrier Weight, Buffer Weight, Spring Rating, Feed Ramp Geometry, Extractor Tension, Ejector Spring Rating, and the Lubrication of said AR, in conjunction with short headspace can allow a round to chamber. There will be pressure indicators on the brass such as a hard claw impact from the extractor, ejector imprint, or flattened or popped primers. Other issues can be failure to extract after firing, hard manual extraction, failures to fire, and a KB if the gun does not lockup fully and the firing pin protrusion is in excess of .036.

You dont "wear-in" a gun that has short headspace by firing it. You swap bolts, barrels, or lap the bolt to the barrel extension which can marry the bolt to the barrel.

So when I say a Barrel Manufacturer is blowing smoke by telling novice AR owners a bunch of ********, try not to look stupid by calling out someone who lives and breathes the AR.

So, for the 3rd time ill ask. What are your credentials? Who have you done work for? Please share pics of your gauges. Mine are on yellow box on the right in the picture. There are 12 Gauges in there, plus I have about 20 others to check undersize chambers and other calibers.

 

[starmetal]

I have the gauges to determine how undersize the chamber is. There is no guessing. A reputable manufacturer would NOT tell someone to use a live round, or empty casing to determine headspace.

Yes, depending on Carrier Weight, Buffer Weight, Spring Rating, Feed Ramp Geometry, Extractor Tension, Ejector Spring Rating, and the Lubrication of said AR, in conjunction with short headspace can allow a round to chamber. There will be pressure indicators on the brass such as a hard claw impact from the extractor, ejector imprint, or flattened or popped primers. Other issues can be failure to extract after firing, hard manual extraction, failures to fire, and a KB if the gun does not lockup fully and the firing pin protrusion is in excess of .036.

You dont "wear-in" a gun that has short headspace by firing it. You swap bolts, barrels, or lap the bolt to the barrel extension which can marry the bolt to the barrel.

So when I say a Barrel Manufacturer is blowing smoke by telling novice AR owners a bunch of ********, try not to look stupid by calling out someone who lives and breathes the AR.

So, for the 3rd time ill ask. What are your credentials? Who have you done work for? Please share pics of your gauges. Mine are on yellow box on the right in the picture. There are 12 Gauges in there, plus I have about 20 others to check undersize chambers and other calibers.

Well damn it. I had a nice post all typed up and accidentally closed out the browser....so I'm not going to retype, I'm just going to say I don't play that credential game as there are many ignoramuses outs there that when you give it to them it means nothing to them along with any college education you have because they know better. I know and worked with many well name people in the industry. I'm just telling you that there AR manufacturers that use a "certain kind" of headspace gauge in ASSEMBLING their AR's. So we'll just have to agree to disagree if you're not liking that one.

 

[omegared24]

Maybe confusing to you, but if you want a reason to dwell on I'd have to pick where D Arms said they chamber them tight and they loosen up right away. You know that if the back of the bolt lugs having a finish on them and then after so so many rounds they are shiny showing where they wore in.....that wear in...how many hundred thousandths difference was there?

You may think you make sense but that would be far from true.

Enough trolling on Easter.

 

[outrider58]

DEZ used to be e reputable company with decent CS. Too bad this seems to have changed.

 

[starmetal]

DEZ used to be e reputable company with decent CS. Too bad this seems to have changed.

They still may be. The OP has to wait to see what they say or do, then who even knows if he'll post back.

 

[outrider58]

Some of the things they told him was hooey.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

 

[starmetal]

Some of the things they told him was hooey.

Sent from my XT1585 using Tapatalk

Yeah, well you know, it may also be a case of he said he said too.