Greetings from Normandy:

[Ngrovcam]

Been offline for a couple of weeks and just now catching up…thanks for the suggestions, gentlemen.

On the other hand, yesterday a friend took my wife and I to lunch in Port St Lucie, FL. 8th AF vet, 101, top turret gunner on ‘17’s, three confirmed 109 kills…shot down, escaped and evaded across Europe thanks to the organized Belgian and French resistance…I never knew what amazingly brave and resourceful people they were…or, how many paid the ultimate price. Someone needs to make a movie about the real deals, not just some stereotype of pretty girl in “The Longest Day” running around with a carbine…these folks were deadly serious.

 

[tallen702]

Been offline for a couple of weeks and just now catching up…thanks for the suggestions, gentlemen.

On the other hand, yesterday a friend took my wife and I to lunch in Port St Lucie, FL. 8th AF vet, 101, top turret gunner on ‘17’s, three confirmed 109 kills…shot down, escaped and evaded across Europe thanks to the organized Belgian and French resistance…I never knew what amazingly brave and resourceful people they were…or, how many paid the ultimate price. Someone needs to make a movie about the real deals, not just some stereotype of pretty girl in “The Longest Day” running around with a carbine…these folks were deadly serious.

So, part of the problem with the resistance is that they pretty much didn't exist in any significance until much later in the war. Sure, there was some partisan resistance at the beginning, but the reality is that much of France really didn't mind the German occupation or the Vichy government until they started the forced labor programs that made service mandatory in very late '42/early '43. That's when the resistance finally started getting traction. Even then, the men who joined the resistance mainly did so out of the fact that their forced labor elsewhere usually meant that their lady friends back home found young German soldiers for company. Nearly a quarter of a million babies of German fatherhood were born from consensual relationships in France between 1940 and 1944.

That's not to say that there weren't any die-hard anti-Nazi resistance fighters from day one. There certainly were, but they were very, very few and far between, and even then, they mainly focused on political resistance and broadsheets instead of actual armed resistance. Add in the fact that many of the early resistance groups were fully communist, and the lack of interest until 42/43 is even more readily understood as the French were extremely anti-communist even before the war. Any movie that showed what they truly were like would have to put the bad in with the good. Same as any movie that truly depicted the 8th Airforce would have to show them killing a lot of French, Belgian, and German civilians instead of bombing targets of importance.

 

[2flhun]

^^^ "Ditto"

Not too many B-26 Marauders floating around...

No there aren't. There is one at Wright-Patterson.
My Father In-Law , 98 yrs old & still chasing the young girls (80 & 70 yr olds) was ordnance on B26s.
I am envious of this trip. I hope to make over to Normandy next year after our time in Bournemouth.

 

[Fushigi Ojisan]

There used to be a B-26 pilot on soc.history.war.world-war-ii back in the early 90s, Arthur Kramer, wonder if he is still around

Sent from my SM-T733 using Tapatalk

 

[Ngrovcam]

So, part of the problem with the resistance is that they pretty much didn't exist in any significance until much later in the war. Sure, there was some partisan resistance at the beginning, but the reality is that much of France really didn't mind the German occupation or the Vichy government until they started the forced labor programs that made service mandatory in very late '42/early '43. That's when the resistance finally started getting traction. Even then, the men who joined the resistance mainly did so out of the fact that their forced labor elsewhere usually meant that their lady friends back home found young German soldiers for company. Nearly a quarter of a million babies of German fatherhood were born from consensual relationships in France between 1940 and 1944.

That's not to say that there weren't any die-hard anti-Nazi resistance fighters from day one. There certainly were, but they were very, very few and far between, and even then, they mainly focused on political resistance and broadsheets instead of actual armed resistance. Add in the fact that many of the early resistance groups were fully communist, and the lack of interest until 42/43 is even more readily understood as the French were extremely anti-communist even before the war. Any movie that showed what they truly were like would have to put the bad in with the good. Same as any movie that truly depicted the 8th Airforce would have to show them killing a lot of French, Belgian, and German civilians instead of bombing targets of importance.

Interesting. Thank you for that insight, which sounds about right to my less-than-well-informed ears.
My friend was shot down in mid-August of ‘43 on the way to Regensburg…which, coincidentally my dad fought through as an infantryman in the 65th Division in ‘45.
My friend, who I expect to see again this weekend, was moved from Belgium, through occupied France, over the Pyrenees, ultimately getting back to an allied stronghold (Gibraltar) about 5 weeks after he bailed out. He recently compared his experience with the Resistance in ‘43, to another vet’s similar experience in late ‘44…they met at the Museum of the Mighty 8th AF in Pooler, GA, back in May. Sounded to me as though the Resistance had gotten really sophisticated by that later time. Regardless of their political tilt (and yes, I knew many if not most had been Communists), I still credit them with bravery and resourcefulness in the rescue of our airmen and others, in their fight against the German occupiers. I did know a former German officer, later with the Afrika Corps, who went into France and served on occupation duty there for a while…he enjoyed the occupation and never felt threatened while there. Other German vets might have had a different view, especially as you indicated, later in the war, and particularly in the year or so leading up to the invasion.
History fascinated me when I read it…even more so when it’s told to me first hand.

 

[tallen702]

Interesting. Thank you for that insight, which sounds about right to my less-than-well-informed ears.
My friend was shot down in mid-August of ‘43 on the way to Regensburg…which, coincidentally my dad fought through as an infantryman in the 65th Division in ‘45.
My friend, who I expect to see again this weekend, was moved from Belgium, through occupied France, over the Pyrenees, ultimately getting back to an allied stronghold (Gibraltar) about 5 weeks after he bailed out. He recently compared his experience with the Resistance in ‘43, to another vet’s similar experience in late ‘44…they met at the Museum of the Mighty 8th AF in Pooler, GA, back in May. Sounded to me as though the Resistance had gotten really sophisticated by that later time. Regardless of their political tilt (and yes, I knew many if not most had been Communists), I still credit them with bravery and resourcefulness in the rescue of our airmen and others, in their fight against the German occupiers. I did know a former German officer, later with the Afrika Corps, who went into France and served on occupation duty there for a while…he enjoyed the occupation and never felt threatened while there. Other German vets might have had a different view, especially as you indicated, later in the war, and particularly in the year or so leading up to the invasion.
History fascinated me when I read it…even more so when it’s told to me first hand.

That jives with what I've heard from other first-hand folks. I had the fantastic luck to be able to talk with Chuck Yeager a bit about his experience flying over Europe. He was shot down in '44 and evaded with the help of the maquis. He said that by that time, they were highly efficient and well coordinated. They got him across the border, through Spain, and to Gibraltar in about 2 weeks according to his memoirs. He definitely commended the resistance folk he dealt with during that time.

 

[Norton]

I might reach out to you on your trip. I think we're going to take the leap this summer and see if we can do it. I want to retrace my grandfather's route across Europe. I know it will take several trips to do it.

 

[tallen702]

I might reach out to you on your trip. I think we're going to take the leap this summer and see if we can do it. I want to retrace my grandfather's route across Europe. I know it will take several trips to do it.

Sure thing! Like I said on the post on the previous page (https://www.mdshooters.com/threads/greetings-from-normandy.266482/post-6721578) we used Stephen Ambrose Tours. That said, if you want to PM me with any questions at all, I'll do my best to answer them. If you're interested, I can see about introducing to you Stephen Borque as well if you'd be interested in having him guide your trip. He told us that the "custom" trip we took, where it's just your family and not a huge tour group, are the only ones he's interested in doing anymore. But he will research the everloving heck out of your Grandfather's unit history and make sure you know exactly what they were doing each and every stop on the way.

 

[U.S.SFC_RET]

tallen
Thank you for posting thee pictures.