Colt SP1 C&R exempt from HBAR law?

[MattFinals718]

One of the worst cases of BGOS I’ve ever seen.

The flaw in your theory is that I'm not good at lying about anything, not just disobeying unconstitutional laws.

Anyway...you keep up the virtue-signaling...errrr, good fight.

 

[Allen65]

The flaw in your theory is that I'm not good at lying about anything, not just disobeying unconstitutional laws.

Anyway...you keep up the virtue-signaling...errrr, good fight.

Well, most of MD's gun laws are so poorly written, you can never be sure whether or not you're actually in violation.

 

[MattFinals718]

Well, most of MD's gun laws are so poorly written, you can never be sure whether or not you're actually in violation.

You are correct, and definitely, I’ve already said that I find the guidance on AR-15 barrels to be arbitrary and convoluted. That being said, I’m at least going to follow the guidance that MSP has given to assure myself that I’m doing my best to avoid breaking the law.

BTW, the first time I posted on this topic (January), when I was asking for members’ opinions on whether my old Olympic Arms CAR-15 upper was MD-compliant, I was surprised at how many posters were even more risk-averse than me. The first guy who responded said he wouldn’t feel safe unless the barrel was marked HBAR. It’s weird to me that I’m getting singled out for bullying over my supposed BGOS compared to some other people here.

 

[teratos]

OYou are correct, and definitely, I’ve already said that I find the guidance on AR-15 barrels to be arbitrary and convoluted. That being said, I’m at least going to follow the guidance that MSP has given to assure myself that I’m not breaking the law.

BTW, the first time I posted on this topic (January), when I was asking for members’ opinions on whether my old Olympic Arms CAR-15 upper was MD-compliant, I was surprised at how many posters were even more risk-averse than me. It’s weird that I’m getting singled out for bullying over my supposed BGOS compared to some other people here…

“Bullying”

You won’t shoot a pre-13 AR in MD without an HBAR in MD despite knowing it’s legal.

There’s caution, and then there is just going too far.

You do you. In the end, your comfort with your actions is what matters.

 

[Blaster229]

In the end, your comfort with your actions is what matters.

Comfort, with your actions in the end, is what matters.....

 

[outrider58]

Comfort, with your actions in the end, is what matters.....

What is with comfort, your action in the end matters.

 

[Bob A]

Tbh, the reason that I follow the law is not that I'm worried about MSP ever checking my rifles at the range; my bigger concern is maintaining my security clearance. I've literally been asked in clearance interviews whether I've ever violated federal or state gun laws (I received that question from the interviewer for my most recent investigation, which was just last year). I'd rather have a clear conscience that I'm not doing anything that would jeopardize my employment prospects, especially in the event that I ever have to get polygraphed.

I've heard, anecdotally, about a guy who admitted to selling cocaine out of his college dorm room; still got his clearance, because he spoke the truth.

Also, I think he was out of the pharma trade by then.

 

[Bob A]

Yeah...most of us working stiffs do have to make minor real world compromises about compliance to put food on the table...at least for a while

The hand that signs the paycheck rules the world.

.

 

[MattFinals718]

Hi, everyone. Sorry for my late reply - I ran off to get married last week.

I want to offer some thoughts in closing: I understand that all of you regard FSA2013 (and most of MD's gun laws) as unconstitutional BS, and I share your perspectives. But please make no mistake: Acting the way that several of you are acting (i.e., trying to publicly shame me for abiding by the law, even if I don't agree with it) is indeed a form of bullying. I really think that unfortunately, the behavior that I've witnessed from some folks in this thread is representative of an endemic problem in the pro-2A interwebs: Too many folks who are characters and "true believer" types, and will shame those who don't embrace their "orthodox" perspective. I hope you all understand that this is the same kind of behavior that is common in cults and the most extreme religious and political movements (whether secular or theological), and it tends to scare those who might otherwise be inclined to agree with us.

I understand that we're all feeling browbeaten by the gun controllers and that we're sick of how we're treated by MD's government and the media, but I think you all have to remember that nobody is going to feel the least bit sympathetic to bullies. We can't blame leftist media bias and politicians for all of our problems - our community is not going to win the war for public opinion if our opponents can point to posts like those in this thread as an example of the kinds of people who oppose new gun control laws. I hope that some of you will consider how we look to outsiders, but alas, I'm not optimistic that anyone here is introspective enough to do that kind of soul-searching.

 

[RRomig]

Hi, everyone. Sorry for my late reply - I ran off to get married last week.

I want to offer some thoughts in closing: I understand that all of you regard FSA2013 (and most of MD's gun laws) as unconstitutional BS, and I share your perspectives. But please make no mistake: Acting the way that several of you are acting (i.e., trying to publicly shame me for abiding by the law, even if I don't agree with it) is indeed a form of bullying. I really think that unfortunately, the behavior that I've witnessed from some folks in this thread is representative of an endemic problem in the pro-2A interwebs: Too many folks who are characters and "true believer" types, and will shame those who don't embrace their "orthodox" perspective. I hope you all understand that this is the same kind of behavior that is common in cults and the most extreme religious and political movements (whether secular or theological), and it tends to scare those who might otherwise be inclined to agree with us.

I understand that we're all feeling browbeaten by the gun controllers and that we're sick of how we're treated by MD's government and the media, but I think you all have to remember that nobody is going to feel the least bit sympathetic to bullies. We can't blame leftist media bias and politicians for all of our problems - our community is not going to win the war for public opinion if our opponents can point to posts like those in this thread as an example of the kinds of people who oppose new gun control laws. I hope that some of you will consider how we look to outsiders, but alas, I'm not optimistic that anyone here is introspective enough to do that kind of soul-searching.

Congratulations ! Hope you have a blessed life together.
I think your response to post 28 is where things got a little sideways. I understood your post to be surprised at someone letting Leo shoot standard (pencil) barrel post 13 ARs. No where have I seen you post you wouldn’t shoot a pre 13 pencil AR. Maybe I’m confused? I really don’t think anyone truly wants you to do something you’re not comfortable with. But they definitely want you to feel comfortable if your within the law.

 

[Sundazes]

JFC, a lot of people on this board hold tickets. Like the good doc said, you do you.
If you feel bullied, go to your safe space.
I have let many Leo, FED and local, shoot my firearms. I even RSO'ed an event where the police were called. Guess who ended up hanging out shooting with us.

 

[jr88]

Hi, everyone. Sorry for my late reply - I ran off to get married last week.

I want to offer some thoughts in closing: I understand that all of you regard FSA2013 (and most of MD's gun laws) as unconstitutional BS, and I share your perspectives. But please make no mistake: Acting the way that several of you are acting (i.e., trying to publicly shame me for abiding by the law, even if I don't agree with it) is indeed a form of bullying. I really think that unfortunately, the behavior that I've witnessed from some folks in this thread is representative of an endemic problem in the pro-2A interwebs: Too many folks who are characters and "true believer" types, and will shame those who don't embrace their "orthodox" perspective. I hope you all understand that this is the same kind of behavior that is common in cults and the most extreme religious and political movements (whether secular or theological), and it tends to scare those who might otherwise be inclined to agree with us.

I understand that we're all feeling browbeaten by the gun controllers and that we're sick of how we're treated by MD's government and the media, but I think you all have to remember that nobody is going to feel the least bit sympathetic to bullies. We can't blame leftist media bias and politicians for all of our problems - our community is not going to win the war for public opinion if our opponents can point to posts like those in this thread as an example of the kinds of people who oppose new gun control laws. I hope that some of you will consider how we look to outsiders, but alas, I'm not optimistic that anyone here is introspective enough to do that kind of soul-searching.

Matt, congratulations on the nuptials. Don't get too upset about being called BGOS, just roll with the flow. One question though, why all the fuss when you are listed as living in Arlington, VA. ??

 

[Bountied]

Has anyone ever been prosecuted for having a non-HBAR rifle? Does anyone in law enforcement care, or even know what they're looking at?

I've never heard of anything. I've never had a gun checked once by a LEO ever, except for a game warden and all he was looking for was lead shot when they banned it.

 

[MattFinals718]

Congratulations ! Hope you have a blessed life together.
I think your response to post 28 is where things got a little sideways. I understood your post to be surprised at someone letting Leo shoot standard (pencil) barrel post 13 ARs. No where have I seen you post you wouldn’t shoot a pre 13 pencil AR. Maybe I’m confused? I really don’t think anyone truly wants you to do something you’re not comfortable with. But they definitely want you to feel comfortable if your within the law.

Thank you! I appreciate it. But I am confused - in Post #28, Muleskinner wrote the following:

I've been to the range at DELMARVA several times with law enforcement there shooting. The only interactions I've had with any of them have all been positive. I have 1 pre 2013 AR and several that were built or purchased afterward. I have both HBAR and standard profile uppers and have invited officers to shoot my firearms while there. Never have they inspected my guns or even commented on the HBAR law...and I can tell you that they have shot post 2013 ARs that I own with standard profile barrels and they never even asked.

In other words: I read his message (#28 in this topic) as an indicator that he runs non-HBAR uppers on his post-2013 lowers, not his pre-2013 lowers. That also seems to be everyone's beef with me: They're telling me that I should be willing to break the law and run standard (non-HBAR) uppers on my lowers. If I owned any pre-2013 lowers, I would not have any hesitancy with using regular-profile barrels on them. Alas, I don't - I sold my only pre-2013 lower years before I knew that I was going to have to move to MD.

If you feel bullied, go to your safe space.

I'm perfectly fine; my self-esteem is healthy enough that this doesn't bother me. What I do worry about is that several of the folks on here are doing our community a disservice and ensuring that nobody outside of the community will ever see us as the "good guys."

One question though, why all the fuss when you are listed as living in Arlington, VA. ??

As of this year, I don't any more - I'm in the Rockville/North Bethesda area, living with my wife. I have been trying to change my profile, but don't see where to update my location info.

 

[Bob A]

God forbid anyone should contemplate breaking The Law.

Because it's there to protect us from people like us.


"I am free, no matter what rules surround me. If I find them tolerable, I tolerate them; if I find them too obnoxious, I break them. I am free because I know that I alone am morally responsible for everything I do."

- Robert A.Heinlein

 

[jr88]

Title says it all. Will a 1975 Colt SP1 AR be exempt from the HBAR reg, once it hits 50 years old and becomes a C&R?

Wouldn't this had been bought Cash and Carry in the first place ? Just Curious

 

[Sundazes]

Wouldn't this had been bought Cash and Carry in the first place ? Just Curious

Nope, when I bought it, it was regulated.

 

[Biggfoot44]

Wouldn't this had been bought Cash and Carry in the first place ? Just Curious

Nope, when I bought it, it was regulated.

Before '94 , an SP-1 was just a regular rifle .

Between '94- ' 96 , it would have initially sold as a " Regulated Rifle " , but could have subsequently been sold in private sale .

Not sure how these facts fit into the discussion , other than such a person would have had to be 21 yo in '96 , and thereby in their 50's today .

And down memory lane , while HBAR were exempted , probably a good 50% of dealers sold them on a 77R in an abundance of caution .

Not sure how that would fit in either , but more knowledge is usually better than less .

 

[Biggfoot44]

Congratulations on your nuptials . Live long , prosper , and be fruitful .

********************************

That said -

You kind of set the tone by wanting to find a work around for a "naughty" bbl profile .

Interpretation is subjective . I suppose Virtue Signaling and Telling it like it is can be in the eye of the beholder .

( Unless I blinked while major poo flinging took place , and subsequently cleaned up by a Moderator ) I didn't see any bullying , only marginal to rise to spirited discussion .

Here , or in person , I don't tell anyone to do anything illegal , and go to seemingly convoluted lengths to explore any possible Legal path , even if idiotic and confusing .


Simplified Bottom Line :

If you aren't already Grandfathered , the only legal way for you as a Maryland Resident to get a ( skinny bbl profile AR- Rifle ) is by inheritance .

Options : Move to Free America . Convince your self that a 16 inch fluted HBAR isn't that bad , and the offhand shooting qualities of them don't suck compared to a 20 inch Government profile . ( True statement , I have both .)

For visual throwback , an A-1 stock , A-1 Upper reciever , and a HBAR profile bbl hiding under Triangle handguards would 90% visually pass at 10 feet distance ( but be very muzzle heavy ) .

 

[MattFinals718]

Congratulations on your nuptials . Live long , prosper , and be fruitful .

********************************

That said -

You kind of set the tone by wanting to find a work around for a "naughty" bbl profile .

Interpretation is subjective . I suppose Virtue Signaling and Telling it like it is can be in the eye of the beholder .

( Unless I blinked while major poo flinging took place , and subsequently cleaned up by a Moderator ) I didn't see any bullying , only marginal to rise to spirited discussion .

Here , or in person , I don't tell anyone to do anything illegal , and go to seemingly convoluted lengths to explore any possible Legal path , even if idiotic and confusing .

Thank you, but I'm not a fan of the moral equivalence that you're demonstrating right now. Nobody ever responded to (or even seemed to notice) my question about whether "CA-compliant"-style ARs are GTG in this state, so I'm pretty sure that's not what triggered some of the people in this thread. Don’t blame me for the flaming that happened. I also don't think that I'd call telling somebody that they have extreme BGOs and need to be held by a man in a gimp suit (all for not wanting to do something illegal) to be "marginal" to "spirited discussion."

I do think that you and I share the desire to explore legal paths - that's what I'm doing in these threads.