Carrying at self owned business???

[bdr2012]

So I have decided to start my own bike shop. More specifically... a motorcycle service and repair shop in Harford County. Since I have never owned a business, at least not a store front, I was wondering if it was legal to carry (concealed or otherwise) on my business property or at the very least, store a weapon on site, like behind the register counter, etc.?

SIDE NOTE - For any bike guys/gals, I will provide more info on the shop and provide some kind of discount to MDshooters members once I get up and running. I plan on opening in the August-September time frame.

Brian

 

[Boondock Saint]

It's legal.

Maryland 4-203

This section does not prohibit:

(among other things)

the wearing, carrying, or transporting of a handgun by a person on real estate that the person owns or leases or where the person resides or within the confines of a business establishment that the person owns or leases;

 

[bdr2012]

It's legal.

Maryland 4-203

This section does not prohibit:

(among other things)

the wearing, carrying, or transporting of a handgun by a person on real estate that the person owns or leases or where the person resides or within the confines of a business establishment that the person owns or leases;

YES!

Thanks BS!

Special discount for you if you ride!

 

[Boondock Saint]

No problem man. I don't ride, but I do appreciate the offer.

 

[bdr2012]

No problem man. I don't ride, but I do appreciate the offer.

Okay, than beer's on me when we meet!

 

[donmega334]

I'd like to jump in and ask a related question, or point out a serious shortcoming in this law.

One of my repair shops is in PG county in Fort Washington, MD. Its not a terrible neighborhood but it is surrounded by some pretty bad areas. Anyway I feel I'm at my most vulnerable when walking from my business to my car with the days deposits. What would be the legal way for me to carry a loaded firearm on my person from my business door to my car and then drive home? Would I have to unload the firearm before leaving my property then go straight home? kinda like the allowed transport to and from a shooting range, etc...

 

[bdr2012]

I'd like to jump in and ask a related question, or point out a serious shortcoming in this law.

One of my repair shops is in PG county in Fort Washington, MD. Its not a terrible neighborhood but it is surrounded by some pretty bad areas. Anyway I feel I'm at my most vulnerable when walking from my business to my car with the days deposits. What would be the legal way for me to carry a loaded firearm on my person from my business door to my car and then drive home? Would I have to unload the firearm before leaving my property then go straight home? kinda like the allowed transport to and from a shooting range, etc...

Sounds like a valid reason for a MD CCW, IMHO. If you haven't, I would try to get a CCW stating the carrying of large quantities of cash to and from the business.

 

[donliv]

Bike Shop in Harford County huh? Where are you setting up? What are you specializing in?

 

[VNVGUNNER]

I'd like to jump in and ask a related question, or point out a serious shortcoming in this law.

One of my repair shops is in PG county in Fort Washington, MD. Its not a terrible neighborhood but it is surrounded by some pretty bad areas. Anyway I feel I'm at my most vulnerable when walking from my business to my car with the days deposits. What would be the legal way for me to carry a loaded firearm on my person from my business door to my car and then drive home? Would I have to unload the firearm before leaving my property then go straight home? kinda like the allowed transport to and from a shooting range, etc...

Don't use the bad area as a reason for your CCW. In MD, it's all about the
money.

 

[novus collectus]

I'd like to jump in and ask a related question, or point out a serious shortcoming in this law.

One of my repair shops is in PG county in Fort Washington, MD. Its not a terrible neighborhood but it is surrounded by some pretty bad areas. Anyway I feel I'm at my most vulnerable when walking from my business to my car with the days deposits. What would be the legal way for me to carry a loaded firearm on my person from my business door to my car and then drive home? Would I have to unload the firearm before leaving my property then go straight home? kinda like the allowed transport to and from a shooting range, etc...

The handgun transport/possession law does not apply to long guns and antiques. However, concealed is a no-no for long guns and a gray area for antique handguns and open carry of either might be legal (when not in the car), but a skittish PG cop in Ft W. might have issues with it if they see you.

There is a PG county law saying you cannot have a loaded firearm within 1000 feet of a structure, but this law is preempted by the state and is moot.

 

[bdr2012]

Bike Shop in Harford County huh? Where are you setting up? What are you specializing in?

Pm'd ya.

Brian

 

[wlc]

I know you can carry at your own business or when you have permission of the business owner

anyone know if it has to be open carry or can it be concealed?

 

[Boondock Saint]

I know you can carry at your own business or when you have permission of the business owner

anyone know if it has to be open carry or can it be concealed?

The law makes no distinction, so either one is permissible.

 

[foxtrapper]

I open carry here at my taxidermy business.

 

[novus collectus]

I know you can carry at your own business or when you have permission of the business owner

anyone know if it has to be open carry or can it be concealed?

The law makes no distinction, so either one is permissible.

I agree.
Besides the fact that most of your place is on private property in the first place that is not accessible to the public without permission an d there is court precedence that seems to me 4-203 does not apply in those locations, there is also the part Boondock Saint mentioned that 4-203 makes no distinction between the two...

Article - Criminal Law

§ 4-203.

(a) (1) Except as provided in subsection (b) of this section, a person may not:

(i) wear, carry, or transport a handgun, whether concealed or open, on or about the person;

(ii) wear, carry, or knowingly transport a handgun, whether concealed or open, in a vehicle traveling on a road or parking lot generally used by the public, highway, waterway, or airway of the State;...

[Novus note: the above is the only mention of open or concealed and later on it says when the above does not apply and the following does not mention open or concealed and just says wear, carry or transport]

....(b) This section does not prohibit:...

....(6) the wearing, carrying, or transporting of a handgun by a person on real estate that the person owns or leases or where the person resides or within the confines of a business establishment that the person owns or leases;

 

[Ethan83]

This raises a good question that I'm still not clear about.

I work at a small business, just me and the owner. It's not a storefront kind of business, we only see people by appointment. The owner carries his gun to/from work as the law obviously allows him to, but it's not clear to me whether or not the law would cover me as I neither own nor lease the business or its property. I would assume that all I would need is the owner's permission (which he would happily give - he's a total gun nut), and I at least should be able to transport to/from and carry on premises (even concealed, if I understand correctly)? However, the exception in 402-3(b)(6) doesn't seem to apply to me. So, what's the deal?

I don't have any plans to take a gun to work either way, so I'm mostly just curious, but while I'm at it - how exactly does the gun have to be transported? For a long time I thought the federal provision (FOPA?) was what was necessary, but from what I've read recently that doesn't seem to be the case. It seems I could go as far as having it in a snap holster with a loaded mag right next to it (but nothing in the gun itself). Again not that I'd try it - but am I understanding the law correctly?

 

[novus collectus]

This raises a good question that I'm still not clear about.

I work at a small business, just me and the owner. It's not a storefront kind of business, we only see people by appointment. The owner carries his gun to/from work as the law obviously allows him to, but it's not clear to me whether or not the law would cover me as I neither own nor lease the business or its property. I would assume that all I would need is the owner's permission (which he would happily give - he's a total gun nut), and I at least should be able to transport to/from and carry on premises (even concealed, if I understand correctly)? However, the exception in 402-3(b)(6) doesn't seem to apply to me. So, what's the deal?

I don't have any plans to take a gun to work either way, so I'm mostly just curious, but while I'm at it - how exactly does the gun have to be transported? For a long time I thought the federal provision (FOPA?) was what was necessary, but from what I've read recently that doesn't seem to be the case. It seems I could go as far as having it in a snap holster with a loaded mag right next to it (but nothing in the gun itself). Again not that I'd try it - but am I understanding the law correctly?

As I read it too, you are correct on both the loaded mag not in the gun and the tranposrt to work. There is no direct allowance for an employee to transport to and from work as one of the approved locations or purposes. However there are ways around this.

One, antique handguns (and some of their modern made replicas) are not covered by 4-203.
Two, and this is just a legal theory of mine, if you convert it to a rifle it is no longer covered under 4-203. When you get to work, just convert it back to a handgun.
I am not a lawyer and many people disagree with me on the second idea (they think that either the handgun is still a handgun even with a buttstock and 16" barrel, but they are wrong. And they also think that once you convert a pistol to a rifle you cannot change it back, but I have good cause to believe they are wrong about this too).

The third possibility is if you are a bona fide collector and you are taking part of your collection (i.e. your handgun) to a private showing at work.

 

[BigCity]

I open carry here at my taxidermy business.

Afraid they are going to go zombie on ya?

 

[honda53s]

u should just buy cycle world and fire all of those pieces of shit that work there and then remodel it. prolly get it cheap anyways since there going outa business 1st of the year

 

[Ethan83]

As I read it too, you are correct on both the loaded mag not in the gun and the tranposrt to work. There is no direct allowance for an employee to transport to and from work as one of the approved locations or purposes. However there are ways around this.

One, antique handguns (and some of their modern made replicas) are not covered by 4-203.
Two, and this is just a legal theory of mine, if you convert it to a rifle it is no longer covered under 4-203. When you get to work, just convert it back to a handgun.
I am not a lawyer and many people disagree with me on the second idea (they think that either the handgun is still a handgun even with a buttstock and 16" barrel, but they are wrong. And they also think that once you convert a pistol to a rifle you cannot change it back, but I have good cause to believe they are wrong about this too).

The third possibility is if you are a bona fide collector and you are taking part of your collection (i.e. your handgun) to a private showing at work.

I see... but what about carrying it at work? Am I allowed to do so with the owner's permission? That's how gun store employees are able to open carry, right? And if the answer is yes, then am I not protected by the federal FOPA guidelines and just have to keep it locked in a case with separate ammo until I get there? It wouldn't be practical to do every day, but if I am indeed allowed to carry at work, I would of course have to get it there somehow in the first place. Again, just hypothetical, but the law doesn't seem to clearly address it, at least to my feeble brain.

Thoughts?