Black Friday safes

[toddtrain]

Hoepfully no one has asked this but I am looking to buy a safe and stay under $500 or so. 24 gun size. My question is what is the best deal. I have seen the following

Walmart - Stack on $497
Sports Authority - Stack on elite $459
Dicks Field and Stream $399

The fire ratings seem to be similar. The field and Stream does not have a door organizer and the others do. It also is not an electronic lock with the SA and the WM ones have. Those 2 things alone I think are worth $60-$100 premium.

Has anyone seen better deals than these. I was hoping Tractor supply would put the Winchester 24 on Sale but they did not so it is a bit over my budget. I am thinking the Sports Authority is the best bang for the buck.
Thoughts?

 

[MDNavyVet]

Understanding you are looking for something under $500.00. However, just in case, Costco has a Field and Stream (32 gun) with the door organizer and electronic lock, shipping included for $749.00 after a sale price reduction of $250.00.

http://www.costco.com/.product.100055246.html

 

[vinjet700]

Hoepfully no one has asked this but I am looking to buy a safe and stay under $500 or so. 24 gun size. My question is what is the best deal.
I was hoping Tractor supply would put the Winchester 24 on Sale but they did not so it is a bit over my budget.
Thoughts?

Just picked this one up yesterday after seeing in another post.... Still sitting in the truck, hopefully for only a few more hours....

 

[pbharvey]

Tractor supply has the big cannon one on sale.
May be over size and over budget for what you want but not a bad deal.
http://www.blackfriday.fm/adscan/tractorsupply?page=2

 

[vinjet700]

Tractor supply has the big cannon one on sale.
May be over size and over budget for what you want but not a bad deal.
http://www.blackfriday.fm/adscan/tractorsupply?page=2

It is bigger than the Winchester but wouldn't fit where I need to get it to...
Looked like it was decent though.

 

[Drew1340]

i am leary of electronic locks and feel that the price of the upgrade is not worth it with battery and cable problems reported in the past especially with the box store safes...
just my two cents...

 

[Yingpin]

Understanding you are looking for something under $500.00. However, just in case, Costco has a Field and Stream (32 gun) with the door organizer and electronic lock, shipping included for $749.00 after a sale price reduction of $250.00.

http://www.costco.com/.product.100055246.html

Dicks has this same one or similar listed for Black Friday for $599.99. It is a Field & Stream 32+6 but I have not compared the fire ratings. That's a pretty good price but isn't F&S simply rebranded Stack on? How do these compare to Winchester?

 

[MDNavyVet]

Dicks has this same one or similar listed for Black Friday for $599.99. It is a Field & Stream 32+6 but I have not compared the fire ratings. That's a pretty good price but isn't F&S simply rebranded Stack on? How do these compare to Winchester?

The Pro model Dicks is selling on Black Friday appears to be smaller (59"H x 29.25"W x 25.5"D) and lighter (493 lbs) and is rated at 30 mins. fire protection versus the Executive Vault (60” H x 33” W x 20” D) and (535 lbs.) Costco rated at 40 mins. fire protection.

 

[Mooseman]

Tractor Supply DOES have the Winchester Safe on sale for black Friday. The sale starts Wednesday. The price is $549.99. They just emailed me their Black Friday circular. It is on page 2.

 

[Yingpin]

The Pro model Dicks is selling on Black Friday appears to be smaller (59"H x 29.25"W x 25.5"D) and lighter (493 lbs) and is rated at 30 mins. fire protection versus the Executive Vault (60” H x 33” W x 20” D) and (535 lbs.) Costco rated at 40 mins. fire protection.

since you posted I have been liking the Costco one more and more. Any negatives about this? I like the built in power strip and USB ports. It is only 14 gauge but I like a lot of the features. That may not fit through the door I need it too.. I have not heard of this brand.

 

[toddtrain]

Hey good catch on the Winchester. I guess the ad I saw was not complete.

The Sports Afield safe is a chinese version of the Heritage Safes I think. The Cannon at TSC seems like a better deal. Plus Cannon is American Made.

 

[toddtrain]

Actually the Winchester seems equal to the Sports Afield minus the outlets. My buddy has the Winchester and it is nice. Especially for $550.

 

[Mooseman]

I bought my Winchester on a Black Friday sale several years ago. It has served me well.

 

[Yingpin]

Tractor Supply DOES have the Winchester Safe on sale for black Friday. The sale starts Wednesday. The price is $549.99. They just emailed me their Black Friday circular. It is on page 2.

TS has a Cannon listed for sale online for $699 but I called locally and they have it for $799. Apparently there is a $89-$110 Shipping fee even if I have it shipped to the store. The girl on the phone didn't indicate that they would match that price but I wonder why not.


It 12 ga and fire rating is not great but it looks like a decent deal. I need one and I am going to buy one in the next two weeks but there are too many variables for me.
http://www.tractorsupply.com//Produ...isplayErrorView&top_category=&catalogId=10051

 

[NickZac]

At the price range, absolutely go used, IMHO. We have a few safe retailers here who sell new and used and they will get you into something much more capable for similar levels of cash...plus they can help you find the right safe for your specific needs/applications.

Avoid digital and biometric locks completely. They are much less reliable, almost always less secure, and more expensive. I can open the Stack-On digital locks in a few seconds with either a paperclip, a magnet, a small hammer, and/or my fingers, depending on the lock type. You can drop or knock most Stack-Ons over and defeat the lock by just doing that.

Most new safes in that price-point are not going to give any level of real & reliable fire protection. Stack-On's fire ratings have consistently failed to meet UL standards time-and-time again...most safes in that class are usually the same story, more or less. They usually wind up advertising that their safe has "been tested" but not as "met requirements, passed testing, was given certification by the UL". If those safes see any sort of a fire, the contents are toast. At your price range, you could find a nice mid-line, mid-size used Liberty with a UL fire rating pretty easily and with a build quality that is at least 10-fold better than Stack-On.

A fire safe needs to have a rating that is higher than the temp of the fire, longer than the duration of the fire, and capable of keeping the inside temp below a certain threshold (generally 350F is the standard for non electronics/pharma safes) (if kept on an above floor, it also needs to be able to withstand a 'drop test'). Cheaper safes fail at the last parts. Ideally, users wanting serious fire protection should shop for a UL certified rating of 1400F @ 30 min with internal temps certified to not exceed 350F...45 (and even more so 60+) minutes are even better, especially if they live in an area where a response to a house fire is going to be slower as only 30 minutes is cutting it close. Last I read the average house fire duration is something like 25-29 minutes, but it can vary dramatically and an average temp around 1100-1200F, but again with variation. Below 1400F and there is the risk some home fires could exceed the maximum temperature the safe can withstand. While some house fires can exceed the 1400-1500F mark, it's quite rare and so 1400F is generally a good rating that combined value + fire safety.

There are a few non-fire safes in that price range that are reasonably decent for locked storage cabinets of low-security items. However, be sure to check the weight and the thickness of the armor (at the sides/top because these are the weakest point and criminals absolutely now are aware of this). Safes with weaker armor (and/or bad welds) can be defeated in seconds with basic tools such as crow/pry bars, axes, and hammers. Our safe experts here are great in determining how much armor is best suited for a specific application.

But IMHO going used will allow you to stay on budget and wind up with something that is of much better quality. Buyers are often left amazed at how nice a safe they can get buying used and for such a low price at that. It may not be as cosmetically pleasing as a new 'budget' safe, but in the event of fire or theft, it's going to do a much, much, much better job at serving the two core purposes a safe is designed to do. And going through a safe expert helps ensure you take all possible actions to deter criminals, which is something buyers cannot benefit from with big box stores. To an employee at Bass Pro, the Redhead safes are great safes. To a safe expert, they can explain why the Redheads are usually terrible choices and what characteristics safes offer, what degrees they come in, what is best balance of price v. performance, and what you can do with the install to maximize the safe's effectiveness. Of course the above is just my opinion.

 

[Yingpin]

Nick,

Great info for sure. I went to Tractor Supply today and I was thinking I would go with the 36 gun cannon but I was disappointed when I saw it. I compared it to the Winchester 24 gun and although it was bigger it was not as secure.

The Cannon only had 5 locking bolts 1 inch long on the door side and one on top. Nothing on the hinge side (internal hinge) and nothing on the bottom. It was more roomy than the Winchester and it had the USB and Power outlet but the inside looked cheaply made. The door had no play but the electronic lock looked and felt fragile. The anti pry hinges did not look that strong and was only on the top. Rated for 30 minutes @ 1200 deg. TS stated one year warranty but the papers in the safe stated limited lifetime. It was listed for $699.

The Winchester 24 gun had 5 locking bolts (1 1/4 inch) on both sides and one on the top and one on the bottom. There were external hinges with anti pry welds on all four sides. I although it was a little smaller I think the long gun configuration gave more options as it was two "U" shaped racks. The Cannon was 3 horizontal rows of 6 and you could not move the top rack that the guns slid into. The door had a little bit of forward and back play but felt heavier. The electronic lock was more robust as well. Rated for 30 mins @ 1400deg. Lifetime Warranty and listed for $549

Your going to shame me but I did purchase the Winchester. I have 14 rifles currently and 5 handguns so I think I can make it work with a little room to grow. I don't have a lot of other purchases in mind other than a Mouser K98 and a pretty wooden deer rifle.

 

[Yingpin]

Just picked this one up yesterday after seeing in another post.... Still sitting in the truck, hopefully for only a few more hours....

I just purchased the Winchester 24 on sale as well and it is in my truck and with this weather it may be for a while. I need about 3-4 guys to get it in I think. How many guns did you get in the safe and at what configuration? I am hoping that I can get by with using one side and the shelves on the other but we will see.

 

[Numidian]

Nick,

Great info for sure. I went to Tractor Supply today and I was thinking I would go with the 36 gun cannon but I was disappointed when I saw it. I compared it to the Winchester 24 gun and although it was bigger it was not as secure.

The Cannon only had 5 locking bolts 1 inch long on the door side and one on top. Nothing on the hinge side (internal hinge) and nothing on the bottom. It was more roomy than the Winchester and it had the USB and Power outlet but the inside looked cheaply made. The door had no play but the electronic lock looked and felt fragile. The anti pry hinges did not look that strong and was only on the top. Rated for 30 minutes @ 1200 deg. TS stated one year warranty but the papers in the safe stated limited lifetime. It was listed for $699.

The Winchester 24 gun had 5 locking bolts (1 1/4 inch) on both sides and one on the top and one on the bottom. There were external hinges with anti pry welds on all four sides. I although it was a little smaller I think the long gun configuration gave more options as it was two "U" shaped racks. The Cannon was 3 horizontal rows of 6 and you could not move the top rack that the guns slid into. The door had a little bit of forward and back play but felt heavier. The electronic lock was more robust as well. Rated for 30 mins @ 1400deg. Lifetime Warranty and listed for $549

Your going to shame me but I did purchase the Winchester. I have 14 rifles currently and 5 handguns so I think I can make it work with a little room to grow. I don't have a lot of other purchases in mind other than a Mouser K98 and a pretty wooden deer rifle.

When counting your guns for a safe, remember. Any gun with a scope or bipod counts as two. Scope AND bipod is three. So suddenly your 21 gun safe is a 7 gun safe if you have all guns with scopes and bipods.

 

[NickZac]

Nick,

Great info for sure. I went to Tractor Supply today and I was thinking I would go with the 36 gun cannon but I was disappointed when I saw it. I compared it to the Winchester 24 gun and although it was bigger it was not as secure.

The Cannon only had 5 locking bolts 1 inch long on the door side and one on top. Nothing on the hinge side (internal hinge) and nothing on the bottom. It was more roomy than the Winchester and it had the USB and Power outlet but the inside looked cheaply made. The door had no play but the electronic lock looked and felt fragile. The anti pry hinges did not look that strong and was only on the top. Rated for 30 minutes @ 1200 deg. TS stated one year warranty but the papers in the safe stated limited lifetime. It was listed for $699.

The Winchester 24 gun had 5 locking bolts (1 1/4 inch) on both sides and one on the top and one on the bottom. There were external hinges with anti pry welds on all four sides. I although it was a little smaller I think the long gun configuration gave more options as it was two "U" shaped racks. The Cannon was 3 horizontal rows of 6 and you could not move the top rack that the guns slid into. The door had a little bit of forward and back play but felt heavier. The electronic lock was more robust as well. Rated for 30 mins @ 1400deg. Lifetime Warranty and listed for $549

Your going to shame me but I did purchase the Winchester. I have 14 rifles currently and 5 handguns so I think I can make it work with a little room to grow. I don't have a lot of other purchases in mind other than a Mouser K98 and a pretty wooden deer rifle.

It all depends on application and sounds like you got a good deal. If the Winchester has locking bolts on both sides, you want to do everything you can to force a criminal to attack it through the door (rather than sides/top). When safes are hit, it is almost always through the side or top if the criminal can access it as the armor on these parts are always significantly thinner than the door. Ideally, when you do placement, if you can put it into a tighter space on an angle and preferably in a position that would leave a criminal vulnerable, it will make it harder to position/manipulate/use tools and force the criminal to work in a vulnerable area...those two things help increase the amount of time an attack will take, and can help discourage a criminal. Whenever possible, use the environment to force the criminal to have to work through the door rather than the sides...it will slow an attack down incredibly. Security cameras, even if they are the fake ones from eBay, installed to overlook the area will also help build an environment less friendly to the break in. One thing a lot of people here do is purchase a small heavy-duty fireproof lockbox or pouch that they put inside the safe to protect paper documents, electronics, cash, etc. to give it a little extra protection for a fire.

 

[Yingpin]

I wanted to give everyone an update. Today my dad and I moved the safe into the basement. Its a 507lb safe and I backed my truck down to the basement slider and slid it off. Then I rented an appliance dolly for $10 and we rolled it into my cave. It was a lot easier than I thought it would be.

I managed to get 9 long guns on one side. 4 with scopes and two bolt actions, shotguns and rifles of different sizes. Obviously it I pretty packed in there and I would have to remove guns to get to the ones in the back but I put them in there based on usage. Everything is secure and they wont scratch each other.

I have two shorter rifles (AR-15, Ruger 10/22) and black powder pistol on the right rack with a shelf on the bottom for some documents. This left the top shelf with a lot of room for ammo and various things.

I will get a picture but that is what I ended up with so far and I am happy.