Banned rifle question

[catch]

Can a parent give a once legal rifle, now banned rifle, to their child?

 

[rseymorejr]

Can a parent give a once legal rifle, now banned rifle, to their child?

Only after they're dead, by inheritence

 

[Squaregrouper]

Only after they're dead, by inheritence

This is correct.
/thread

 

[ohen cepel]

Or, move to America and give it to them there.

 

[catch]

Thanks for the information.

 

[catch]

Can the child barrow the rifle with out the parent being with the rifle?

 

[Mightydog]

Let me guess…are you “the child”?

 

[outrider58]

If the OP is in Morgantown, why is he asking here?

 

[catch]

no im not the child

 

[rseymorejr]

I'm not aware of any reason not to loan your son whatever you have. My son has taken my guns out to shoot pretty much whenever he wanted to, never gave it a second thought. The only problem I ever had was shortly after I had bought a 300 WSM and he grabbed it after school one day and shot up about $60 worth of ammo (this was about 20 years ago) Now that he buys his own ammo, no problems!

 

[catch]

My uncle son wants to use the rifle. My Uncle said," He will give it to him". I told him I don't think you can give it to him. Now I'm ask can the Son borrow the rifle. My Uncle doesn't own a lot of guns and is not in to guns and gun laws.

 

[lazarus]

My uncle son wants to use the rifle. My Uncle said," He will give it to him". I told him I don't think you can give it to him. Now I'm ask can the Son borrow the rifle. My Uncle doesn't own a lot of guns and is not in to guns and gun laws.

Is the kid at least 21? If not all banned firearms fall under regulated firearms. Treated kind of like a handgun. An under 21 can’t take possession. They can use one when monitored by the owner. Even if they weren’t transferring it, “borrowing” is almost certainly a flat out no.

If they are 21 or older it wouldn’t violate the law. However, borrow implies a short term non-gratuitous loan. Are police going to search your cousin’s place? Probably not. But if he was ever questioned about it for any reason and said something stupid, or your uncle did, like “oh I gave it to him” or “well I am just borrowing it. When does he want it back? Uh, I don’t know, I’ve had it a few years”.

Generally a bad idea unless the cousin is 21+ and it really is just borrowing it to go to the range and back.

PS as it is a banned firearm, if the cousin is ever in possession and the police have a reason to observe it and ask questions they are likely to do some investigating and ask deeper questions. It’s a pretty quick mental math to look at a drivers license and calculate when a person turned 21 and if it was after October of 2013 then they cannot legally own the firearm in Maryland as they couldn’t have legally owned it prior to the firearm being banned.

“This warrants investigation”. Could be legit reasons the person legally possesses it (inheritance, temporary loan). A lot of reasons it might not be legal possession (not so temporary loan, legally acquired outside Maryland after October 2013 and brought in, etc)

 

[JustCallMeDad]

Only after they're dead, by inheritence

I believe That is correct or move to anywhere besides md...

 

[bcr229]

Also "borrow" = short-term borrow for a specific purpose, e.g. one hunting trip or a range visit, with the firearm begin returned to the owner afterward.

A resident of one state can not "borrow" a firearm from a resident of another state and take it home on loan per GCA 1968; that would be an illegal transfer.

 

[Benny]

Only after they're dead, by inheritence

Sadly- this is correct.


Sent from my iPhone using Tapatalk

 

[teratos]

I’m going to fake my death.

 

[mvee]

I would really like to hear someone who knows a lot about Maryland law’s opinion on this. What does “possession” mean?

The way I read the law, it actually bans possession of a banned long gun by someone who didn’t legally possess it prior to the date in 2013.

When they were pushing these laws through, they said that pistol could be rented by ranges and it really didn’t count as a rental because the pistol didn’t leave the range. I don’t remember any other exceptions on possession being talked about as the laws were being debated.


I’ve heard of prohibited people being arrested for possessing a gun at a gun range or gun shop. Police would check the logs at a range and find a prohibited person was shooting there. They would find them and arrest them. I have heard of people being arrested for simply holding a gun a store while they were prohibited. I don’t have any case to back that up with though.

It was legal for my friend to shoot one of my now banned long guns prior to October 2013. If he held it I guess he legally possessed the firearm. Since he legally possessed the firearm before that date I guess he could still legally possess it now. The state would not be able to prove that anyone who was alive and is not prohibited didn’t possess my gun. So only one of my kids can use my banned firearms. I actually had my son possess all my banned firearms before the deadline.


This opens up other questions for me. If owned and legally possessed a banned gun and before the deadline I transferred it to a family member, could I legally re-take ownership of it, and have it transferred to me? The state would have evidence that I definitely possessed it before the deadline.

If I was visiting a friend and I used their now banned rifle in 2012, I legally possessed the banned gun before the deadline. Can they transfer it to me now ?

https://law.justia.com/codes/maryland/2020/criminal-law/title-4/subtitle-3/

 

[Mark75H]

I’m going to fake my death.

Your kids will rejoice

 

[Mark75H]

I would really like to hear someone who knows a lot about Maryland law’s opinion on this. What does “possession” mean?

The way I read the law, it actually bans possession of a banned long gun by someone who didn’t legally possess it prior to the date in 2013.

When they were pushing these laws through, they said that pistol could be rented by ranges and it really didn’t count as a rental because the pistol didn’t leave the range. I don’t remember any other exceptions on possession being talked about as the laws were being debated.


I’ve heard of prohibited people being arrested for possessing a gun at a gun range or gun shop. Police would check the logs at a range and find a prohibited person was shooting there. They would find them and arrest them. I have heard of people being arrested for simply holding a gun a store while they were prohibited. I don’t have any case to back that up with though.

It was legal for my friend to shoot one of my now banned long guns prior to October 2013. If he held it I guess he legally possessed the firearm. Since he legally possessed the firearm before that date I guess he could still legally possess it now. The state would not be able to prove that anyone who was alive and is not prohibited didn’t possess my gun. So only one of my kids can use my banned firearms. I actually had my son possess all my banned firearms before the deadline.


This opens up other questions for me. If owned and legally possessed a banned gun and before the deadline I transferred it to a family member, could I legally re-take ownership of it, and have it transferred to me? The state would have evidence that I definitely possessed it before the deadline.

If I was visiting a friend and I used their now banned rifle in 2012, I legally possessed the banned gun before the deadline. Can they transfer it to me now ?

https://law.justia.com/codes/maryland/2020/criminal-law/title-4/subtitle-3/

Sounds like the kind of thing that makes it to the SC, state using both defintions of possession

 

[lazarus]

I would really like to hear someone who knows a lot about Maryland law’s opinion on this. What does “possession” mean?

The way I read the law, it actually bans possession of a banned long gun by someone who didn’t legally possess it prior to the date in 2013.

When they were pushing these laws through, they said that pistol could be rented by ranges and it really didn’t count as a rental because the pistol didn’t leave the range. I don’t remember any other exceptions on possession being talked about as the laws were being debated.


I’ve heard of prohibited people being arrested for possessing a gun at a gun range or gun shop. Police would check the logs at a range and find a prohibited person was shooting there. They would find them and arrest them. I have heard of people being arrested for simply holding a gun a store while they were prohibited. I don’t have any case to back that up with though.

It was legal for my friend to shoot one of my now banned long guns prior to October 2013. If he held it I guess he legally possessed the firearm. Since he legally possessed the firearm before that date I guess he could still legally possess it now. The state would not be able to prove that anyone who was alive and is not prohibited didn’t possess my gun. So only one of my kids can use my banned firearms. I actually had my son possess all my banned firearms before the deadline.


This opens up other questions for me. If owned and legally possessed a banned gun and before the deadline I transferred it to a family member, could I legally re-take ownership of it, and have it transferred to me? The state would have evidence that I definitely possessed it before the deadline.

If I was visiting a friend and I used their now banned rifle in 2012, I legally possessed the banned gun before the deadline. Can they transfer it to me now ?

https://law.justia.com/codes/maryland/2020/criminal-law/title-4/subtitle-3/

Most your loopholes are a big no.

Maryland law says a non-gratuitous loan of a regulated firearm is okay. No HQL and transfer needed. But you’d need to be 21 or over and not a prohibited person. So yeah, you probably could also possess that banned firearm in such a way. TEMPORARILY. As mentioned upthread, federal law is relatively clear on what a temporary loan means. Maryland doesn’t define it, but you’d better bet a DA would make a strong case it should be what Federal law means.

It’s fine if someone who is 12 (or whatever age) handles a pistol if the adult owner is right there. They aren’t committing a crime. No, you can’t give your 16yr old, or 19yr old kid a handgun to take it to the range. Or hunting.

It’s not considered a loan if you are with the person the entire time.

But no, if you used to own the banned firearm, transferred it to someone else, you can’t take possession back now that it is years later. If you don’t own it ON the date the law went in to affect, too bad. You can’t have it in the state. You transfer it to someone out of state the next day or years later, tough shit. You can’t have it transferred back to you.

If you transferred it to someone else post law change and the state doesn’t know, well you can’t have legally transferred it to a Maryland state resident. Because it was banned. If it was pre-October 2013 before it was banned, you also couldn’t have legally done that without the state knowing unless it was a hell of a long time ago as all banned firearms were regulated and you MUST have transferred it on a 77r, not face to face for a lot of years before 2013.

I guess you could have become a resident of another state, transferred it face-to-face to a resident of that state and both of you moved to Maryland…but they still couldn’t then legally transfer it to you in the state. I guess they could have transferred it back while you were still residents that and no one knew and you moved back to Maryland.

I mean, we can try to come up with all these permutations.

End of the day, you needed to own it on a October 1, 2013. And have continuous ownership ever since. Otherwise it is illegal for you to have the firearm in Maryland.

It would be good that there is some sort of proof you did and no proof anywhere else that you transferred it to some other person out of state. Odds of getting in to deep crap. Low. The deep crap you would get in to? Neck deep.